2018 Rotation discussion

[moonslav59]

That is the kind of deal that I'm talking about. Anyone can overpay for a player through free agency or in a trade. Find me that diamond in the rough.

Sure beats finding a turd in the fairway.

 

(like Masterson, Aaron Cook, Penny, Smoltz and on and on...)

[jacksonianmarch]

The diamonds in the rough are exactly that. You will have a lot of sand and rough to find that diamond. Fister earned himself a lot of money in his Boston stint

[Kimmi]

Sure beats finding a turd in the fairway.

 

(like Masterson, Aaron Cook, Penny, Smoltz and on and on...)

 

Those moves didn't work out, but I was a fan of all of them at the time they happened.

[Kimmi]

Those moves didn't work out, but I was a fan of all of them at the time they happened.

 

Mike Cameron signing too.

 

To my credit, Adrian Beltre signing too, and there were a LOT of people who bemoaned that signing when it happened.

[moonslav59]

Those moves didn't work out, but I was a fan of all of them at the time they happened.

 

I realize with budget constraints you have to do what you have to do, but I've always hated trying to build up the rotation from the bottom by searching to upgrade your 4 or 5 slot guy.

 

I hated the Masterson & Dempster signings. Also, neither was all that cheap.

 

I know it's easier said than done, and we've failed a few times trying to rebuild from the top, but that has always been my preferred method.

 

Pedro

Schilling

Beckett

Dice-K

Lackey

Porcello (more like a 3 paid like a 2)

Price

Sale

[Kimmi]

I realize with budget constraints you have to do what you have to do, but I've always hated trying to build up the rotation from the bottom by searching to upgrade your 4 or 5 slot guy.

 

I hated the Masterson & Dempster signings. Also, neither was all that cheap.

 

I know it's easier said than done, and we've failed a few times trying to rebuild from the top, but that has always been my preferred method.

 

Pedro

Schilling

Beckett

Dice-K

Lackey

Porcello (more like a 3 paid like a 2)

Price

Sale

 

Rebuilding a rotation from the top would be the preferred method, but as you said, it's easier said than done. It also depends on team needs. If a team doesn't need a #1 starter, would it benefit more by picking up a mid rotation guy and focusing its resources on hitting?

 

My point really wasn't about how to build a rotation though. I realize that you can't build an entire rotation with Fister type deals. I just really like those kinds of finds.

[moonslav59]

Rebuilding a rotation from the top would be the preferred method, but as you said, it's easier said than done. It also depends on team needs. If a team doesn't need a #1 starter, would it benefit more by picking up a mid rotation guy and focusing its resources on hitting?

 

My point really wasn't about how to build a rotation though. I realize that you can't build an entire rotation with Fister type deals. I just really like those kinds of finds.

 

It's not easy to repeat Fister year-to-year, if we could of course I'd love that method.

 

One of our last "build from the top" attempts (Price) hasn't worked out too well.

 

Too many Mastersons for my liking, and he wasn't all that cheap either.

 

[Larry Cook]

Does anybody think porcello will have a bounce back season next year?

 

Can he get his two seam to sink consistently or will he continue to serve up multiple meatballs per game?

[moonslav59]

Does anybody think porcello will have a bounce back season next year?

 

Can he get his two seam to sink consistently or will he continue to serve up multiple meatballs per game?

 

Who knows?

 

I certainly hope so, and why not start the "bounce back" now? Imagine how much better we'd be, if he would pitch like 2016?

[mvp 78]

He's just getting killed at Fenway this year. He's probably better than he has pitched this year, but not as good as he was last year.

[Emp9]

Sure beats finding a turd in the fairway.

 

(like Masterson, Aaron Cook, Penny, Smoltz and on and on...)

 

Pom turned into a BabyRuth this year:o

[a700hitter]

He's just getting killed at Fenway this year. He's probably better than he has pitched this year, but not as good as he was last year.

Unless he can find his sinker, his stuff is very ordinary and he doesn't have pinpoint command. He needs a lot of run support to be successful.

[Kimmi]

Does anybody think porcello will have a bounce back season next year?

 

Can he get his two seam to sink consistently or will he continue to serve up multiple meatballs per game?

 

I think he can bounce back next year, but not to Cy Young level. I think he can be a good #2 pitcher.

 

That said, I'm not sure why he has given up on using his sinker more often and has become more of a fly ball pitcher.

[Northern Star]

I think he can bounce back next year, but not to Cy Young level. I think he can be a good #2 pitcher.

 

That said, I'm not sure why he has given up on using his sinker more often and has become more of a fly ball pitcher.

 

I just dropped in to ask if we can offload him. Selling low, of course, but do we have a viable replacement that would make it worth it?

[Kimmi]

I just dropped in to ask if we can offload him. Selling low, of course, but do we have a viable replacement that would make it worth it?

 

I wouldn't try to offload him. That would just create another hole that would need to be filled. IMO, Dombrowski should already be looking to acquire a mid rotation pitcher.

[notin]

I think he can bounce back next year, but not to Cy Young level. I think he can be a good #2 pitcher.

 

That said, I'm not sure why he has given up on using his sinker more often and has become more of a fly ball pitcher.

 

His two-seamer has become his out pitch. The problem has been he's throwing it too hard and killing its chance to break properly....

[Bellhorn04]

I wouldn't try to offload him. That would just create another hole that would need to be filled. IMO, Dombrowski should already be looking to acquire a mid rotation pitcher.

 

Do you think?

 

Sale

Price-assuming health obviously

Pomeranz

Porcello

E-Rod

 

Who do you replace with the new starter?

[moonslav59]

Do you think?

 

Sale

Price-assuming health obviously

Pomeranz

Porcello

E-Rod

 

Who do you replace with the new starter?

 

While I do not think acquiring an ace is our top priority, and maybe not even our second priority, I'd always be kicking the tires on any ace that becomes available. When I saw Quintana and Gray traded away for what I felt were relative underpays, I couldn't help but wonder "what if...".

 

Acquiring an ace would allow us to trade Porcello or ERod or Wright, of just keep them all. Look at the Dodgers. They stockpile starters and still end up needing another. With Pom becoming a FA after next year and Sale and Porcello the year after, you jump at an ace whenever you can.

 

That being said, we need a top quality clean-up hitter for 2018 to maximize our chances at a ring.

 

[notin]

Do you think?

 

Sale

Price-assuming health obviously

Pomeranz

Porcello

E-Rod

 

Who do you replace with the new starter?

 

No one.

 

Unless you trade E-Rod (easily the most tradable name on that list) for a 1B.

 

I doubt Dombrowski does that. But you never know. He's typically more patient with younger pitchers but 1) the Sox are loaded with LHSP and 2) E-Rod really isn't his type of pitcher. He might not like him or might be frustrated with his frequent injuries and slow development...

[moonslav59]

No one.

 

Unless you trade E-Rod (easily the most tradable name on that list) for a 1B.

 

I doubt Dombrowski does that. But you never know. He's typically more patient with younger pitchers but 1) the Sox are loaded with LHSP and 2) E-Rod really isn't his type of pitcher. He might not like him or might be frustrated with his frequent injuries and slow development...

 

So, we sign an ace and then trade ERod (and others) for who?

 

Votto?

 

Make Stanton a 1Bman?

 

Am I missing anyone?

[notin]

So, we sign an ace and then trade ERod (and others) for who?

 

Votto?

 

Make Stanton a 1Bman?

 

Am I missing anyone?

 

I could see Brandon Belt, who, while certainly not spectacular, is a pretty underrated hitter...

[moonslav59]

I could see Brandon Belt, who, while certainly not spectacular, is a pretty underrated hitter...

 

He'd be an upgrade over Moreland, but he doesn't solve the lack of power problem at all.

 

Belt's never hit over 18 HRs. Moreland can do that.

[notin]

He'd be an upgrade over Moreland, but he doesn't solve the lack of power problem at all.

 

Belt's never hit over 18 HRs. Moreland can do that.

 

Not with a .370 OBP he can't. ..

[Kimmi]

His two-seamer has become his out pitch. The problem has been he's throwing it too hard and killing its chance to break properly....

 

That makes a lot of sense to me. And it seems like such a simple problem to correct, but I guess that's easier said than done.

[Kimmi]

Do you think?

 

Sale

Price-assuming health obviously

Pomeranz

Porcello

E-Rod

 

Who do you replace with the new starter?

 

Well, I'm going with the idea that these things have a way of working themselves out. Or we can go with the one about how you can never have enough pitching.

 

A big part of my desire to get another starter is that I am not confident in Price remaining healthy. If I knew with reasonable assuredness that he will not need surgery or that he will not miss significant time, then I would not be looking for a starter.

 

Also, I'm not sure what's going on with Porcello, and I think Pom is due for some regression.

[moonslav59]

Well, I'm going with the idea that these things have a way of working themselves out. Or we can go with the one about how you can never have enough pitching.

 

A big part of my desire to get another starter is that I am not confident in Price remaining healthy. If I knew with reasonable assuredness that he will not need surgery or that he will not miss significant time, then I would not be looking for a starter.

 

Also, I'm not sure what's going on with Porcello, and I think Pom is due for some regression.

 

Last winter you did not think we needed Sale, yet now you think we need a quality starter. I'm a bit confused.

 

I get how our confidence in Price and Porcello has fallen, but the opposite should be true of ERod and Pom. Plus, we should have Wright returning.

[notin]

Last winter you did not think we needed Sale, yet now you think we need a quality starter. I'm a bit confused.

 

I get how our confidence in Price and Porcello has fallen, but the opposite should be true of ERod and Pom. Plus, we should have Wright returning.

 

I know he was an All Star, but he much faith do you really have in Wright?

[moonslav59]

I know he was an All Star, but he much faith do you really have in Wright?

 

I've always been high on Wright- higher than most, and maybe my faith is unfounded, but he looks like he could be a nice depth next year.

[Larry Cook]

csn Wright come back after being out so long?

 

Ps: if we sign ohtani, then whatever happens with Wright is mute!

[notin]

csn Wright come back after being out so long?

 

Ps: if we sign ohtani, then whatever happens with Wright is mute!

 

I think you mean "moot." Unless you think Wright will lose his power of speech....