The Red Sox Bullpen discussion thread

[Eddy Ballgame]

Theo: Pedey, Papi, Bogaerts, Vazquez, Buchholz, Jackie Bradley Jr, Mookie Betts, Travis Shaw... That's 30% of the roster right there and more than that for just production...

 

Cherington was in the Sox organization since the Duquette days. He worked with Epstein during Theo's whole tenure. Some people must've thought he was a pretty smart guy to last as long as he did. The GM gets all the credit and all the blame, but the reality is that nobody knows who influenced what decision.

 

Cherington also had most of the same scouts as Theo did while he was here. Cherington also made a lot of shrewd moves to turn a last place team into a World Series champ in one season. That's enough to give him a pass right there in my opinion.

[Bellhorn04]

Cherington also had most of the same scouts as Theo did while he was here. Cherington also made a lot of shrewd moves to turn a last place team into a World Series champ in one season. That's enough to give him a pass right there in my opinion.

 

Unfortunately he then turned a World Series champ into back to back last place teams. A truly mixed legacy.

[mvp 78]

Cherington was in the Sox organization since the Duquette days. He worked with Epstein during Theo's whole tenure. Some people must've thought he was a pretty smart guy to last as long as he did. The GM gets all the credit and all the blame, but the reality is that nobody knows who influenced what decision.

 

Cherington also had most of the same scouts as Theo did while he was here. Cherington also made a lot of shrewd moves to turn a last place team into a World Series champ in one season. That's enough to give him a pass right there in my opinion.

 

Ben doesn't get my dander up. I think he and Theo did a great job. They just whiffed on the major signings that were most likely pressured on them by ownership.

[iortiz]

The more I think about it, IMO LL is the main responsible for the good and bad results under his tenure, and BC and Theo were nothing but his assistants at the time. The good thing for Theo is that it seems that he learned well LL lessons (good and bad) and got more experience, and is ready to execute in Chicago.

[a700hitter]

Cherington was in the Sox organization since the Duquette days. He worked with Epstein during Theo's whole tenure. Some people must've thought he was a pretty smart guy to last as long as he did. The GM gets all the credit and all the blame, but the reality is that nobody knows who influenced what decision.

 

Cherington also had most of the same scouts as Theo did while he was here. Cherington also made a lot of shrewd moves to turn a last place team into a World Series champ in one season. That's enough to give him a pass right there in my opinion.

It wasn't enough to save his job.

[User Name]

The more I think about it, IMO LL is the main responsible for the good and bad results under his tenure, and BC and Theo were nothing but his assistants at the time. The good thing for Theo is that it seems that he learned well LL lessons (good and bad) and got more experience, and is ready to execute in Chicago.

 

Theo had significantly more power than Cherington did, but otherwise, that pretty much sums it up.

[Emp9]

Toronto has made Drew Storen available via trade. Any takers? 9.6 K/9, but a horrible 10.12 ERA.

[mvp 78]

Theo had significantly more power than Cherington did, but otherwise, that pretty much sums it up.

 

Pre or post gorilla suit? Also, this is pure conjecture. We don't know for sure.

[mvp 78]

Toronto has made Drew Storen available via trade. Any takers? 9.6 K/9, but a horrible 10.12 ERA.

 

Why am I not surprised that I pitcher coming from the NL East would struggle transitioning to the AL East. I guess you could pick him up and hope he provides better value than Noe Ramirez, but I wouldn't give up much. Is there an injury concern here?

[User Name]

Pre or post gorilla suit? Also, this is pure conjecture. We don't know for sure.

 

By all accounts, if what you say is true and I am incorrect (a possibility), do you think Panda is a Red Sock? Because he goes against everything in Cherington's team-building approach.

[mvp 78]

By all accounts, if what you say is true and I am incorrect (a possibility), do you think Panda is a Red Sock? Because he goes against everything in Cherington's team-building approach.

 

According to his contract, he's definitely a Red Socker.

 

Is he a "true" Red Socker? That is above my pay grade.

 

Is he a guy that The Boobed One would have wanted to sign? Possibly. I can't say that he would outright dismiss it. He could have been a temporary solution for 3b/1b as there weren't upper level prospects waiting in the wings at the moment.

[User Name]

According to his contract, he's definitely a Red Socker.

 

Is he a "true" Red Socker? That is above my pay grade.

 

Is he a guy that The Boobed One would have wanted to sign? Possibly. I can't say that he would outright dismiss it. He could have been a temporary solution for 3b/1b as there weren't upper level prospects waiting in the wings at the moment.

 

Panda is a low OBP/bad plate discipline/low athleticism guy. The complete opposite of the signings/draft strategy Cherington employed during his short tenure here. Food for thought.

[User Name]

According to his contract, he's definitely a Red Socker.

 

Is he a "true" Red Socker? That is above my pay grade.

 

Is he a guy that The Boobed One would have wanted to sign? Possibly. I can't say that he would outright dismiss it. He could have been a temporary solution for 3b/1b as there weren't upper level prospects waiting in the wings at the moment.

 

Btw, I'm not appealing to the no true scottsman fallacy here. Just pointing out he doesn't fit the mold of the type of guy the team was being built around.

[sk7326]

1. I can't believe this is still a discussion

 

2. The essential plus of Dombrowski is that he is where the buck stops on major baseball decisions. I do not know how much power Cherington had (although you have to assume less than Epstein post gorilla suit). But it was clearly a collaborative process of some kind, which got muddled. The accountability diagram is much simpler now. I think when Cherington was canned, it was less about the work he specifically did than a repudiation (by Henry) of the entire decision making apparatus on the baseball side. After all, Lucchino was ushered out too.

 

Dombrowski, like any new exec (mostly) was walking into a situation where there has been a lot of losing. It also was probably the "best" losing situation that a GM has ever inherited.

[Spudboy]

1. I can't believe this is still a discussion

 

2. The essential plus of Dombrowski is that he is where the buck stops on major baseball decisions. I do not know how much power Cherington had (although you have to assume less than Epstein post gorilla suit). But it was clearly a collaborative process of some kind, which got muddled. The accountability diagram is much simpler now. I think when Cherington was canned, it was less about the work he specifically did than a repudiation (by Henry) of the entire decision making apparatus on the baseball side. After all, Lucchino was ushered out too.

 

Dombrowski, like any new exec (mostly) was walking into a situation where there has been a lot of losing. It also was probably the "best" losing situation that a GM has ever inherited.

 

 

And Dombrowski is no fool. He knew that this is still a premium gig.

 

And the Sox used this along with the history of the principles with the candidate to snag a big fish.

 

At least in my eyes, anyway.

[iortiz]

Well, from an outside-in view, Cherington and Theo did not have the power and role that DD is having right now. LL was more likely what DD is right now, and he deserves most of the credit/blame of our success and failures in recent years. The other day I saw him in an interview with the people of NESN when he was officially inducted to the HOF-- btw the only time I have had the opportunity to listen this Sr-- and he seemed to me a very polite, educated an intelligent man, not sure why some people hated him at the time.

 

Said that, I really like that DD is running this team. We needed this kind of profile. I think that he has the seniority, personality and background to lead us to a new success. Time will tell, though.