David Price

[a700hitter]

DD signed the best starter available and traded for the best reliever available.

 

I'm going to let that sink in, and worry about 2020 another time. Hell yes Dumbo.

This is one of those times when we are in full agreement.

[Meh]

The sox had to do this. There is no question. Will he be an albatross in 4 years? Probably. But will he be immensely helpful in 2016? Absolutely. Dombrowski was brought in with one mission, win now. And you should do that. I still think you need one more pitcher, but as it stands, you're definitely playoff contenders and maybe the favorites in the ALE

 

Nah, this was a great dude deal. Unless he gets seriously hurt he'll opt out. You're paying for the tail end of his peak. If the deal didn't have an opt out I'd love it for as a Yankees fan. Sox got better, still need to do some work though before I start to get too worried. Red Sox have the most balanced team between the Yankees-Jays-Red Sox now. Jays hitting is still awesome and Yankees have the best pitching. I'd think the Sox are at the payroll limit now they are at 210 million though.

[NativeBostonian]

Now can we trade Buchholtz and get a real number two?

[mvp 78]

Buchholz isn't bringing back a #2.

[Palodios]

This is one of those times when we are in full agreement.

 

One thing you and have I always agreed on is this team's need for pitching.

[RedSoxNC84]

Buchholz isn't bringing back a #2.

 

Unless Double D's has a few more sweet tricks up his sleeve, Buch might be the #2 still.

[Elktonnick]

Well I was wrong I thought the Cubs would get Price. I am glad that he is in Boston. Yes the Sox may have overpaid but if they did it wasn't by that much. Jim Bowdoin said over a week ago he thought Price would get 7 years and 210. It is clear that Dumbrowski was able to do what Cherrington couldn't, that is convince John Henry that he had to give a long term deal to an ace over 30.

[jacksonianmarch]

The need to buy an ace was apparent. This is Papi's final season and the offense is good even with laggards like Pablo and Hanley. You had a pen with 2 nice pieces and then you went out and added a shutdown relief ace. The only major weaknesses on this team were starting pitching and defense. Your defense should get a boost from Vasquez returning, although the Hanley experiment at 1b could be a plus or a minus onto 2015, we'll see. Regardless, you're kinda stuck with your offense as is. The only major spot for upgrade was the rotation. Now you have

 

1. Price

2. Buchholz

3. E-Rod

4. Porcello

5. Miley

 

If you cannot find a taker for Buchholz, you kinda have to roll with him. Now that you've added to the top, you can at least rely on a guy to be a stopper. Is your rotation great or even above average? On the whole, probably more the latter but not convincingly more than average on the whole. But it's no longer abhorrent. That means your dynamic offense and now strong 7-8-9 should allow you to win games you were losing last year. As it stands right now, the sox have probably

jumped into the lead in the division IMO as it stands right now.

 

The one thing this also does is give you time to acquire another pitcher. You have the means to roll into 2016 and should Buch go down again (more like when) you'll only have to deal for one starter, and it won't have to be an ace

[Station 13]

I applaud DD, he doesn't beat around the bushes.

 

Kelly and Porcello were our best starters last 2nd half, if they are close to 3.5-4ERA starters, we're taking th e east

[User Name]

The need to buy an ace was apparent. This is Papi's final season and the offense is good even with laggards like Pablo and Hanley. You had a pen with 2 nice pieces and then you went out and added a shutdown relief ace. The only major weaknesses on this team were starting pitching and defense. Your defense should get a boost from Vasquez returning, although the Hanley experiment at 1b could be a plus or a minus onto 2015, we'll see. Regardless, you're kinda stuck with your offense as is. The only major spot for upgrade was the rotation. Now you have

 

1. Price

2. Buchholz

3. E-Rod

4. Porcello

5. Miley

 

If you cannot find a taker for Buchholz, you kinda have to roll with him. Now that you've added to the top, you can at least rely on a guy to be a stopper. Is your rotation great or even above average? On the whole, probably more the latter but not convincingly more than average on the whole. But it's no longer abhorrent. That means your dynamic offense and now strong 7-8-9 should allow you to win games you were losing last year. As it stands right now, the sox have probably

jumped into the lead in the division IMO as it stands right now.

 

The one thing this also does is give you time to acquire another pitcher. You have the means to roll into 2016 and should Buch go down again (more like when) you'll only have to deal for one starter, and it won't have to be an ace

 

Damn, I have to admit, you've really improved as a poster. Would still superplex you if given the chance though, by virtue of being a Yankees fan.

[Orange Juiced]

The Red Sox are so much better now than they were at the start of the offseason, it isn't even funny. Price bumps the worst starter out of the rotation, and the difference between the Red Sox' #5 starter and David Price is.....gargantuan.

 

Kimberly bumps the worst reliever pitcher out of the bullpen, and Koji also returns. And the difference between Kimbrel and the worst reliever is.....gargantuan.

 

Young is a really nice 4th OF, is a RH pull hitter who is perfect for Fenway, and while I don't want him as my everyday left-fielder, he can definitely be a serviceable starter if one of the other guys gets hurt or goes into a funk.

 

The Sox made these huge upgrades without giving up any significant chip. Margot and Guerra were good chips, maybe really good chips. But nothing this organization can't handle losing. Like, at all.

 

Every Red Sox fan should be THRILLED with how this offseason is going. If they aren't, I have no idea what will make them happy.

[gojohn99]

Thumbs up on the signing. Thumbs down on the contract length.

[Northern Star]

Now, I realize I still have 700s quote in my signature, but... in a case like this I'm fine with the deep-pocket Sox throwing a chunk of change at Price instead of giving up pieces and picks. Doesn't mean I think the prices these players cost are worth it, especially later on, but this season was Exhibit A against this stupid idea we could get by without an ace. We could have had Lester for less, though.

[Kimmi]

Probably be the idea situation for the Sox. Price has three outstanding seasons and then opts out. Sox wouldn't have to worry about the back end of the contract and by then some of the young arms (Espinosa and Kopech) would be ready.

 

Price opting out in 3 years would definitely be an ideal situation for the Sox. I still can't see him doing it, not at age 33. At least the opt out should give him added incentive to pitch well, not that he needs any.

[Kimmi]

We will take up a collection to buy you a blanket to help you with the shuddering.

 

Thanks, but that won't be needed.

 

I have stated before that if Dombrowski gets us our ace without further gutting the farm system, then I will be good with what he has done this offseason. The Kimbrel trade does not look as bad now, in that it did not keep up from getting our #1. Farm system still looks great, and the team looks really good heading into this season. All is good!

 

I can shudder and still be very happy with the players that we got.

[Kimmi]

Well I was wrong I thought the Cubs would get Price. I am glad that he is in Boston. Yes the Sox may have overpaid but if they did it wasn't by that much. Jim Bowdoin said over a week ago he thought Price would get 7 years and 210. It is clear that Dumbrowski was able to do what Cherrington couldn't, that is convince John Henry that he had to give a long term deal to an ace over 30.

 

I don't think Dombrowski had to convince Henry of anything. Henry already had his mind made up that he didn't want to finish in last place again, and he wanted somebody with a win now mentality. Hence, the reason for hiring Dombrowski.

 

Give Henry credit for opening up the checkbook. Dombrowski did nothing spectacular in being able to pay more than any other GM for the players that he got.

 

Reports are that Price had his heart set on signing with the Cardinals, and was ready to do so for more than $30 million less than the Sox offer. The Sox swooped in at the last minute with more money than Price could say no to.

[Kimmi]

As a side note for anyone interested - the Sox were over the luxury tax limit in 2015 by a small amount. That means that their tax rate increases to 30% this year if they do not shed payroll to get under the limit.

[cp176]

a tax rate of 30%???

[Palodios]

In another note, Buch, Miley and Porcello probably need to give up their "I'm the ace" jerseys.

[Kimmi]

a tax rate of 30%???

 

A tax rate of 30% on the amount of payroll above the luxury tax limit. It increases to 40% the 3rd year, then 50% the 4th year. The tax rate in and of itself is not so bad.

 

But on top of that, starting in 2016, a team that goes over the tax limit in 2 consecutive years loses part or all of its revenue sharing. For the Yankees, that amount is in the neighborhood of $30 million. I don't know what it would be for the Sox.

[cp176]

I wouldn't be surprised if there is another deal in the works. DD has everybody thinking that we are done. Probably a pretty good chance that we won't get screwed in a trade now. Somebody might have to really show their cards if they actually want some of our surplus. A lot of things could still happen. When it comes to Price, I would bet on him being more than good beyond the 3 year time frame. He keeps himself in very good shape. Father Time comes calling for us all just a little later for some than others.

[a700hitter]

David Price with his 3.09 ERA @ $31 million a year for 7 years with an opt out after 3 years

 

vs.

 

Rick Porcello with his 4.39 ERA @ $21.1 million a year for 4 years

 

And just a little fun fact --- Price has less than 200 more innings of wear on his arm than Porcello.

[cp176]

David Price with his 3.09 ERA @ $31 million a year for 7 years with an opt out after 3 years

 

vs.

 

Rick Porcello with his 4.39 ERA @ $21.1 million a year for 4 years

 

And just a little fun fact --- Price has less than 200 more innings of wear on his arm than Porcello.

 

 

I don't think DD would have made that deal for Porcello. There is nor there will be any comparison between the two pitchers. Not to worry, Porcello's contract will expire at about the same time Price's will. The future looks good. I had many questions about the Porcello deal. 21 million dollars per year for a middle of the rotation guy with potential or 31 million dollars for a first class ace. I like the ace. I think that he will be much tougher to replace than the #3. I actually am glad that we have them both though. The franchise can afford them and more and the future will not be bothered at all. I wouldn't be surprised if the dealing continues. It would be good to have one more starter who we could actually count on.

Price

Rodriguez

Porcello

Miley

Buchholtz (first half) - Kelly (second half)

Still not too bad though.

 

I fully understand about the length of Price's contract. No issue for me.

[Dojji]

I'm thrilled. This is a lot better than what I've come to expect of the front office in recent years. Ben and Theo had a tendency to outsmart themselves when it came to going for top free agent acquisitions, trying to find that guy who'd be just as good but cheaper rather than just rolling up their sleeves and going after the genuine article.

 

So we now have our ace, we've added at least one bullpen arm, and we have a slightly overpaid 4th OF that should still be serviceable on defense and in a platood role. Our lineup is set at a decent level, and our bench is pretty strong and the bullpen has been improved. Next up is seeing what can be done practically to improve the bullpen as much as possible. I still think we need one more good arm there if it can be found, preferably a power lefty but that may wind up being filled internally.

 

Since we're now not desperate enough to be taken over a barrell, we may be able to make a few surprising moves, but I think that this pretty much is your 2016 Red Sox.

 

I would still love to go after Wei-Yin Chen to flesh out the lower middle of the rotation just a bit more. The work of building a rotation is never really done and the lower middle of the rotation matters just as much as the top at the end of the day. But if we don't make that move I'm content that we've got a pretty strong team as-is. Health is going to be the deciding factor

Edited December 3, 2015 by Dojji

[a700hitter]

I don't think DD would have made that deal for Porcello. There is nor there will be any comparison between the two pitchers. Not to worry, Porcello's contract will expire at about the same time Price's will. The future looks good. I had many questions about the Porcello deal. 21 million dollars per year for a middle of the rotation guy with potential or 31 million dollars for a first class ace. I like the ace. I think that he will be much tougher to replace than the #3. I actually am glad that we have them both though. The franchise can afford them and more and the future will not be bothered at all. I wouldn't be surprised if the dealing continues. It would be good to have one more starter who we could actually count on.

Price

Rodriguez

Porcello

Miley

Buchholtz (first half) - Kelly (second half)

Still not too bad though.

 

I fully understand about the length of Price's contract. No issue for me.

You are being kind to Porcello by considering him a number 3 pitcher. His career work establishes him as a number 4. Arguably, he still has the potential to be a number 3. He should be our number 4 to start the season behind Price, ER and Buchholz. Hopefully, he can pitch well enough to warrant the number 3 spot in June/July when Buch goes down.

[Elktonnick]

I don't think Dombrowski had to convince Henry of anything. Henry already had his mind made up that he didn't want to finish in last place again, and he wanted somebody with a win now mentality. Hence, the reason for hiring Dombrowski.

 

Give Henry credit for opening up the checkbook. Dombrowski did nothing spectacular in being able to pay more than any other GM for the players that he got.

 

Reports are that Price had his heart set on signing with the Cardinals, and was ready to do so for more than $30 million less than the Sox offer. The Sox swooped in at the last minute with more money than Price could say no to.

 

Henry was outspoken about his opinion that spending big bucks for long term over 30 year old pitchers was a waste. Henry lost faith in Cherrington either because Cherrington believed in that philosophy also or he couldn't convince Henry it wasn't working and Cherrington demonstrated poor skills at constructing a competitive team. I said before and I say again that changing that approach was part of the deal in order to get Dumbrowski. Dumbrowski did something that your boy Cherrington couldn't do that's why he is here and Cherrington is off licking his wounds pouting someplace.

[a700hitter]

Henry was outspoken about his opinion that spending big bucks for long term over 30 year old pitchers was a waste. Henry lost faith in Cherrington either because Cherrington believed in that philosophy also or he couldn't convince Henry it wasn't working and Cherrington demonstrated poor skills at constructing a competitive team. I said before and I say again that changing that approach was part of the deal in order to get Dumbrowski. Dumbrowski did something that your boy Cherrington couldn't do that's why he is here and Cherrington is off licking his wounds pouting someplace.

If the no-ace philosophy couldn't work, it was Ben's Jon to convince Henry of that. If he agreed with the no ace philosophy, it was his job to make it work. He did neither, so now he is out of baseball.

[jacksonianmarch]

Ben didn't like committing to dealing off his players or spending money on pitching. Your pitching farm is basically barren with the only real top notch starting prospect coming over in a trade for Miller. I was entirely unimpressed with Owens and he was supposedly the crown jewel of the org on the pitching side. Without a philosophy change, you were doomed to repeat the same issue. Inconsistent yet overall top notch offense paired with incredibly bad pitching

[cp176]

Ben didn't like committing to dealing off his players or spending money on pitching. Your pitching farm is basically barren with the only real top notch starting prospect coming over in a trade for Miller. I was entirely unimpressed with Owens and he was supposedly the crown jewel of the org on the pitching side. Without a philosophy change, you were doomed to repeat the same issue. Inconsistent yet overall top notch offense paired with incredibly bad pitching

 

 

 

What is a little confusing to me is that we lost Margot and Guerra and all of a sudden 3 of our top 6 prospects are starting pitchers. Public relations ploy or what? Either the trading of 2 guys that could become decent players absolutely decimated our farm system or these 3 pitchers might be pretty good. If our farm is solid, something good should come from at least one of them.

[Elktonnick]

Ben didn't like committing to dealing off his players or spending money on pitching. Your pitching farm is basically barren with the only real top notch starting prospect coming over in a trade for Miller. I was entirely unimpressed with Owens and he was supposedly the crown jewel of the org on the pitching side. Without a philosophy change, you were doomed to repeat the same issue. Inconsistent yet overall top notch offense paired with incredibly bad pitching

 

There are those who claim Cherrington deserves credit for building this great farm system. While the farm system has some quality prospects and the B boys, it hasn't produced any quality starters in over a decade. Except for the oft injured Buchholtz, all the current likely starters were developed elsewhere. I agree with you. I am not impressed with Owens.