Ellsbury to Yankees

[User Name]

nope, USD (They signed with Televisa and recently with Univision), reason why I don't think the NYY are only making 200 MUSD via TV .

 

The other question is are they making that amount yearly, or over the course of the deal?

[BudLight]

This website: http://www.forbes.com/teams/new-york-yankees/ explains part of the reason for misconceptions like yours regarding how much money teams make off their tv deals.

 

I quote:

 

So in short, out of the 224 million YES generated in 2011, the Yankees only received a grand total of 90 million dollars, meaning your idea of just how much revenue the Yankees receive from YES network is a gross misconception, and jives a lot more with Forbe's 471 million dollars in revenue for the NYY.

 

What is not discussed here is how much the Yankees made in 2012 in addition to the $90 M that UD states. The Yankees sold 9% of their stake in the YES network as part of the 49% buy of YES by News Corp. That was worth $270M and are expected to receive an additional $400-$500 M. YES pays the Yankees $85M per year for broadcast rights. The broacast rights are based on an escalated scale that, when reached at the end of the Yankees agreement with YES in 2042, will be worth $350M in 2042. Not having the scale for the escalation I cannot know how much the rate increases per year, but the $85M increases each year.

[iortiz]

Few things.

 

As part of the deal, the rights fee will begin at $85 million in 2013 and will hit $350 million a year by 2042. In addition, Fox paid the Yankees a $400 million one-time fee. Also you have to consider the profit/year they are making since they still hold the 27% of YES. When you sum all the lines, their income look like very juicy.

 

Secondly, and regardless how much is that TV income, they clearly put in the foot notes that the revenue regards only to "stadium revenues" which make me think that you still have to add the TV rights + the Fox fee + annual profit since they still hold the 27% of the RSN.

Edited December 5, 2013 by iortiz

[mvp 78]

The footnote seems to just say it's net of debt payments and doesn't say it's just stadium revenue. That's just what it seems like to me. I'm just going on what you two louts have posted.

[iortiz]

The footnote seems to just say it's net of debt payments and doesn't say it's just stadium revenue. That's just what it seems like to me. I'm just going on what you two louts have posted.

 

It says "Net of stadium revenues used for debt payments". I understand from this, that part of that "stadium revenue" is used to pay debt payments but doesn't include TV incomes.

[mvp 78]

It says "Net of stadium revenues used for debt payments". I understand from this, that part of that "stadium revenue" is used to pay debt payments but doesn't include TV incomes.

 

To me, it seems like it says total revenue less debt payments paid by stadium revenue.

[iortiz]

I clearly remember that we already discussed this with ORS and by the time I showed him the same figure from Frorbes but it was the Red Sox one. That figure showed red numbers. ORS's argument was that it DIDN'T include the TV rights income. While the discussion was totally different the figure and the footnote was the same at the time.

[User Name]

To me, it seems like it says total revenue less debt payments paid by stadium revenue.

 

It is, or at least that's what the explanation from other sources say.

[mvp 78]

To me, if it was just stadium revenue, the footnote would've said simply "net of stadium debt payments."

 

I don't really care either way though, just my opinion.

[SoxSport]

Looks like the Mariners are bumping the Yankees on Cano the way the Yanks bumped the Red Sox on Ells. Love to see Mariners force the Yankees over $250 M for Cano.

 

Hear the Red Sox are now in on Choo. Maybe Boras' consolation prize. James probably likes his OBP and power. He can play RF at Fenway.

[jacksonianmarch]

If I were in charge of NY and had unlimited pockets, I'd kick the tires on Choo too. Adding a .400+OBP to our lineup would be sweet

[mvp 78]

Choo is a lefty with horrible splits, blah defense and a contract that will be close to Ells. Stay away!

[SoxSport]

If I were in charge of NY and had unlimited pockets, I'd kick the tires on Choo too. Adding a .400+OBP to our lineup would be sweet

 

I think they should have signed Choo over Ells.

[jacksonianmarch]

Ells is the better overall player. Ells had a 12.9UZR/150 as a CFer last yr. He stole 50+ bases as well. Choo is a year older, had a UZR/150 of -15.3 and cannot steal anywhere near as much as Ells can. Choo in Fenway may reach base at a .380 clip, but his power would be severely impacted in Boston.

 

BTW, let's say Ells turns 5 outs into HRs in his 2013 season by moving to the Bronx. His slash line would be up to .307/.364/.461 for an .825OPS

[SoxSport]

Ells is the better overall player. Ells had a 12.9UZR/150 as a CFer last yr. He stole 50+ bases as well. Choo is a year older, had a UZR/150 of -15.3 and cannot steal anywhere near as much as Ells can. Choo in Fenway may reach base at a .380 clip, but his power would be severely impacted in Boston.

 

BTW, let's say Ells turns 5 outs into HRs in his 2013 season by moving to the Bronx. His slash line would be up to .307/.364/.461 for an .825OPS

 

Ells is just too much like Gardner. You can't have both in the lineup together.

[Spitball]

Ells is the better overall player. Ells had a 12.9UZR/150 as a CFer last yr. He stole 50+ bases as well. Choo is a year older, had a UZR/150 of -15.3 and cannot steal anywhere near as much as Ells can. Choo in Fenway may reach base at a .380 clip, but his power would be severely impacted in Boston.

 

BTW, let's say Ells turns 5 outs into HRs in his 2013 season by moving to the Bronx. His slash line would be up to .307/.364/.461 for an .825OPS

 

Honestly, I prefer Choo. Put him in right field, and he is probably the better player. He has a better arm, more power, and has a much better ability to get on base. If I need a center fielder, I'll take Ellsbury. Choo has the other areas covered.

[seabeachfred]

Choo is a lefty with horrible splits, blah defense and a contract that will be close to Ells. Stay away!

 

Stay the HELL away. The guy is utterly s***** against left handed pitching and he can't run worth crap. Sure he gets on base and clogs the paths so all we get is risk of a rally killing double play because you can't steal with him. Also he is too expensive. Also, damn it, let Bradley play and keep that Gomes-Nava platoon in left. That was a strength last season and I don't want Victorino in CF because he was the best RF in the league this season. Vic in center would wear him down and cause him to work harder out there and risk hurting his back more. Stay the hell away.

[User Name]

Choo has stolen more than 20 bases four times in his career, and has only grounded into more than 10 DP's twice. He also has decent BSR value from Fangraphs' valuation. Where do you come up with this stuff Fred? Choo is an excellent baserunner. Edited December 6, 2013 by User Name?

[rjortiz]

Ells is just too much like Gardner. You can't have both in the lineup together.

 

Why? They're both quality hitters.

[Bellhorn04]

Why? They're both quality hitters.

 

Don't expect an answer to that.

[Spitball]

Choo has stolen more than 20 bases four times in his career, and has only grounded into more than 10 DP's twice. He also has decent BSR value from Fangraphs' valuation. Where do you come up with this stuff Fred? Choo is an excellent baserunner.

 

Right, and Choo actually got on base at a .347 rate against lefties this past year compared to Ellsbury's .323 On Base Percentage versus left-handed pitching.

Edited December 6, 2013 by Spitball

[SoxSport]

Right, and Choo actually got on base at a .347 rate against lefties this past year compared to Ellsbury's .323 On Base Percentage versus left-handed pitching.

 

Choo is the better hitter. He can't be that slow--he steals about 20 bases a year--with more power than Ells. He has a good arm and can play RF. They need another outfielder for flexibility and insurance. Vic is fragile and Bradley is still green.

 

A lot of people don't realize the Yankees had to overbid to pry Ellsbury away from Boston and everybody else. Seriously overbid. He isn't a $20 million player. Of course, none of them are. wink wink.

[mvp 78]

Too much money to spend on "insurance." I like Choo, don't like his price tag.

[sk7326]

Ells was a good signing ... FOR THE YANKEES. When you get to deals like this, it is useful to stop pretending that the purchase decision is the same for every team. Clearly the Yankees will benefit hugely from making the playoffs (in terms of the revenue streams they get to enjoy), and they just do not have a lot of impact position guys at the top of their system. While it is not reasonable to expect Ellsbury to have his 2011 power surge, it is MUCH more likely that he will be a double digit homerun sort in Yankee Stadium where his swing will allow for a number of lazy fly balls to turn into homeruns. With the free agents, the Yankees could see enough improvement to add 5-10 wins, and whatever $$/win function you want to assume - the Yankees is among the largest. It also allows the Yankees to take Gardner and possibly spin him for some farm help - it obviously is not a blue chipper, but Gardner clearly is a mid-level starting CF.

 

The Sox letting Ells go was a prudent business decision - for the Yankees, the signing is sensible too.

[sk7326]

Right, and Choo actually got on base at a .347 rate against lefties this past year compared to Ellsbury's .323 On Base Percentage versus left-handed pitching.

 

Choo's patience is terrific, and in his career best year this was the case. Neither guy is good against lefties, but at the same time the positional value cannot be ignored. Ellsbury's bad lefty bat is a bit more playable (as a plus-plus CF) than Choo as a solid corner guy.

 

Certainly putting a guy who struggled against lefties like that in an offensive position is a worrisome prospect, especially at the $20M sort of price point. Now Choo's WAR last year understates how good he was a little bit because he was playing out of position (and thus poor defensive numbers), but the increased offensive expectation combined with the split raises eyebrows. I certainly wouldn't call Ells for Choo a net plus.

[SoxSport]

Cano has just signed with the Mariners for 10/$240M, according to Heymann tweet. Yankees screwed this up. They needed Cano more than Ellsbury.

[mvp 78]

Cano has just signed with the Mariners for 10/$240M, according to Heymann tweet. Yankees screwed this up. They needed Cano more than Ellsbury.

 

Boomshackalacka!

[SoxSport]

The Cano signing should be a reminder to the Red Sox that these guys are out for the biggest bucks. They should loosen up if they want to keep their chicks.

[Spitball]

Choo's patience is terrific, and in his career best year this was the case. Neither guy is good against lefties, but at the same time the positional value cannot be ignored. Ellsbury's bad lefty bat is a bit more playable (as a plus-plus CF) than Choo as a solid corner guy.

 

Certainly putting a guy who struggled against lefties like that in an offensive position is a worrisome prospect, especially at the $20M sort of price point. Now Choo's WAR last year understates how good he was a little bit because he was playing out of position (and thus poor defensive numbers), but the increased offensive expectation combined with the split raises eyebrows. I certainly wouldn't call Ells for Choo a net plus.

 

I found this article interesting. The author explains why Choo's splits should not be a concern going forward:

 

http://espn.go.com/mlb/hotstove13/story/_/id/10079533/discount-free-agents-shin-soo-choo-curtis-granderson-stephen-drew-hit-lefties-mlb

[sk7326]

Boomshackalacka!

 

On the other hand ... THIS is a bad signing for Seattle.