Trades before the deadline?

[User Name]

Scouts and GM's don't always have the same opinion of players in different organizations.

 

But they also won't alter their perception of a player's value based on two games at the MLB level, which is what i was getting at. Workman's value is what it is.

[Palodios]

Then you'd have him right at the verge of going back to being awesome by October. If he can't come back by mid-September at the least then he's useless either way. By that same token, do we have any reason to have any confidence whatsoever in Peavy? He's essentially another Buchholz health-wise but not as good.

 

Best case scenario, they're both healthy and productive. Either way, you need more than 1 starter in the playoffs, and you never know how Lackey's arm will react to a long season with TJS.

[italstallianion]

Why does everyone wanna trade Workman?

 

Another reason to trade him might be that if we get a starter, he's the piece that leaves the rotation. For example, if we trade for Peavy, and Buchholz comes back, what does our rotation look like? I initially had Doubront as the "prospect" I wanted to trade away for a real starter at the beginning of the season but now that Doubront has shown he can not suck, Workman becomes the odd man out imo. Sure, we can technically put him in the bullpen or stash him, but I think of the top 10-15 prospects, Workman/Brentz are the two I'd probably lose the least amount of sleep giving up in a trade.

[a700hitter]

Best case scenario, they're both healthy and productive. Either way, you need more than 1 starter in the playoffs, and you never know how Lackey's arm will react to a long season with TJS.

Also, if they get someone to go at the top with Buch, you can pick the hot hand from among Lackey and Lester for the #3.

[User Name]

I don't think Peavy's a reliable top 3 guy for a playoff run.

[User Name]

Another reason to trade him might be that if we get a starter, he's the piece that leaves the rotation. For example, if we trade for Peavy, and Buchholz comes back, what does our rotation look like? I initially had Doubront as the "prospect" I wanted to trade away for a real starter at the beginning of the season but now that Doubront has shown he can not suck, Workman becomes the odd man out imo. Sure, we can technically put him in the bullpen or stash him, but I think of the top 10-15 prospects, Workman/Brentz are the two I'd probably lose the least amount of sleep giving up in a trade.

 

Workman doesn't have a lot of trade value. Therein lies the issue. He is what he is regardless of what he's done over a couple games at the MLB level.

[Standing Room]

I would hold on to Workman. He's gotten better every at every level (3.71 ERA in A, 3.57 ERA in AA, 2.80 ERA in AAA). Overall this year, he's had a 3.21 ERA, 1.18 WHIP, 2.7 BB/9 and a 9.6 K/9 between AA and AAA and he's made a relatively seamless transition to the major leagues. He could easily pitch better than Peavy this year and he's cheap and cost controlled.

[a700hitter]

If we gave up Bogaerts for a pitcher...other than say Sale/Kershaw/Harvey etc...I'd violently storm Boston with burning pitchforks.

How does one light a pitchfork.

[dduncan6er]

I don't think Peavy's a reliable top 3 guy for a playoff run.

 

I think he most certainly can be. It's far from a sure thing but I think he's more than capable of slotting into the top 3 if he pitches to his potential.

[Standing Room]

I think he most certainly can be. It's far from a sure thing but I think he's more than capable of slotting into the top 3 if he pitches to his potential.

 

His numbers since 2010 are remarkably similar to Ryan Dempster's.

[dduncan6er]

The difference is he's been pitching in the AL. He had a healthy 2012 and his numbers showed it. He was hampered by injuries the few years before that and struggled but he's definitely been putting it together the last 2 years. And he's still only 32.

[Palodios]

Workman doesn't have a lot of trade value. Therein lies the issue. He is what he is regardless of what he's done over a couple games at the MLB level.

 

Workman is the definition of a mid-level prospect -- definitely not a blue chipper, but not just a throw-in either. On a lesser farm system he'd probably be a #5-10 prospect. Hell, we would have been gushing over the guy in 2011.

[BSN07]

How does one light a pitchfork.

 

Very carefully, my eyebrows took months to grow back after Crawford was signed

[Standing Room]

The difference is he's been pitching in the AL. He had a healthy 2012 and his numbers showed it. He was hampered by injuries the few years before that and struggled but he's definitely been putting it together the last 2 years. And he's still only 32.

 

Health issues have kind of been a theme in Peavy's career if you haven't noticed.

[dduncan6er]

It's a risk you have to take at the deadline. His deal is over after next year so if he's hurt it won't be crippling for years to come. There's not a single guy available with a higher ceiling over the next year and a half than Peavy. Granted you take a risk of giving up prospects for essentially nothing if he gets injured, but there's not a single guy available that doesn't come with his fair share of question marks.

[Standing Room]

It's a risk you have to take at the deadline. His deal is over after next year so if he's hurt it won't be crippling for years to come. There's not a single guy available with a higher ceiling over the next year and a half than Peavy. Granted you take a risk of giving up prospects for essentially nothing if he gets injured, but there's not a single guy available that doesn't come with his fair share of question marks.

 

Peavy's lived up to his "ceiling" once in the last five years. He is what he is, a mdi-rotation starter who's often injured. I don't see him as someone that would put us over the top.

[Palodios]

Health issues have kind of been a theme in Peavy's career if you haven't noticed.

 

Some players are fragile, and others are just unlucky. Peavy has had three major injuries in the last 10 years. 1) Broken rib. 2) Busted ankle on the basepaths. 3) Jake-Peavy Surgery. That doesn't exactly scream Nancy Drew.

[dduncan6er]

I disagree. I think 2010 and 2011 are outliers because he was hurt. I think he's certainly capable of being a top 3 starter in the rotation the next year and a half if he's acquired.

 

Edit: This is in response to SR.

[Standing Room]

He's been hurt five of the last six years and he's coming off a rib injury. Even when he's been healthy the last four years, he's been league average.

[Standing Room]

He's been healthy and effective once in the last five years and you're claiming it's the years he was unhealthy that are outliers. Think about that for a second.

[Palodios]

He's been healthy and effective once in the last five years and you're claiming it's the years he was unhealthy that are outliers. Think about that for a second.

 

Advanced stats are much kinder to Peavy than ERA.

[Standing Room]

Advanced stats are much kinder to Peavy than ERA.

 

Peavy and Dempster have indenticle xFIP's since 2010.

[User Name]

Peavy and Dempster have indenticle xFIP's since 2010.

 

And you wanna help me with my English

 

Kidding aside, Peavy is just not that good, and he's fragile. What am i missing here?

[Orange Juiced]

Workman doesn't have a lot of trade value. Therein lies the issue. He is what he is regardless of what he's done over a couple games at the MLB level.

 

What does this mean, "He is what he is"? As Standing Room pointed out, he's gotten better every year in the Sox' system, and every level he's gone up.

[Bellhorn04]

Peavy and Dempster have indenticle xFIP's since 2010.

 

That sounds kind of painful.

[Standing Room]

And you wanna help me with my English

 

Kidding aside, Peavy is just not that good, and he's fragile. What am i missing here?

 

And English is my first language.

[User Name]

What does this mean, "He is what he is"? As Standing Room pointed out, he's gotten better every year in the Sox' system, and every level he's gone up.

 

So does that change his projection or value? The improvements are there, but he hasn't jumped into elite prospect status or anything like that. You're arguing for the sake of arguing.

[Standing Room]

I would say that Workman's performance this year has changed his projection and value. I've always thought of him as a fringe back end of the rotation/relief pitcher until this year. Edited July 26, 2013 by Standing Room

[Orange Juiced]

So does that change his projection or value? The improvements are there, but he hasn't jumped into elite prospect status or anything like that. You're arguing for the sake of arguing.

 

What do you mean I'm arguing for the sake of arguing. That was my first post ever on this site with respect to Workman. I was just asking what you meant by "he is what he is". Seems to me he's getting better, which implies that there's a chance he could be a pretty useful pitcher in the majors.

[User Name]

What do you mean I'm arguing for the sake of arguing. That was my first post ever on this site with respect to Workman. I was just asking what you meant by "he is what he is". Seems to me he's getting better, which implies that there's a chance he could be a pretty useful pitcher in the majors.

 

But i never implied he couldn't be, which is why i said what i said. Whether or not he's improving in the minors does not change his ceiling (mid rotation starter) or his value to other teams (possible mid rotation starter). It really is what it is.