2013 Spring Training

[mvp 78]

Fred's right about one thing, we have had some very s***** starts the last few years. 4-9 in 2010, 2-10 in 2011, 4-10 last year.

 

But he's wrong because he's correlating the slow start with ST wins and losses, and has made up the poor ST records.

[Bellhorn04]

But he's wrong because he's correlating the slow start with ST wins and losses, and has made up the poor ST records.

 

Agreed. When Fred sees something s***** he has to correlate it with something else. Francona always came in handy for that.

[SoxSport]

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/2013/03/29/bradley-waits-number/fbXmBc9fHIp33Y9GxON1PM/story.html

 

Abraham says they are trying to get Bradley on the 40 man roster so he can make the 25 man roster. That's been the holdup all along--too bad the media didn't explain it sooner. They have to DFA or deal somebody. I would guess they are not going to 60 day DL Morales, with just a bad back. Nava is the logical alternative, as Abraham mentions at the close of the article. He's expendable with Carp and Bradley aboard, and they could well be trying to trade him right now before the Sunday deadline.

Abraham notes he has never made the starting day roster.

[Dojji]

Mauro Gomez is a wiser cut than Nava. While Nava isn't great, he has a 2 year track record in the big leagues of hitting at least well enough to be useful as a reserve, which is what you want deep in the 40-man.

 

Or to put it another way, of the two, Nava and Gomez, Nava is the one I can see making someone else's big league roster a few months from now if we cut him. He's not the archetypal COF, but the archetypal COF has been so hard to find lately that there's room for a guy like him in some bottom feeder's lineup.

 

If we're talking trade though, we could be talking Ciriaco. Unlike Nava or Gomez or the other schlubs we could cut, Ciriaco could fetch us a return, and I suspect we have the depth to part with him.

 

If they want Iglesias in the big leagues at all costs, Ciriaco is expandable. If they plan on sending Iglesias down when Drew comes back, then we might see Nava or Gomez be the casualty.

 

I must say, it's not a bad problem to have, having guys with at least some big league utility at the bottom of the 40 man.

[SoxSport]

My favorite thing about sports forums is that everyone is capable of being a competent professional sports team's general manager/manager/head coach. I wonder if most GMs get hired via forums like talksox.com?

 

No they don't. But more than you think are overqualified to be in the baseball business. It's just a hobby to them. Some of those guys in the FO started off as mail deliverers with no salary. The high level stats specialists are usually hired as consultants on the cheap. An occasional one shows up in chat forums.

 

The problem with Bradley is we didn't have the same information as the FO about what his hold up was--the media didn't explain it until last night. It's a simple problem--he's not on the 40 man roster, and they have to clear space for him on the 40 man roster before he can make the 25 man roster. Somebody should have leaked that to the media sooner, because it made the Red Sox look bad delaying this kid while not delaying everybody else. The one guy who looks good in this is Farrell, who made his view about Bradley evident early. He wants him.

[SoxSport]

Mauro Gomez is a wiser cut than Nava. While Nava isn't great, he has a 2 year track record in the big leagues of hitting at least well enough to be useful as a reserve, which is what you want deep in the 40-man.

 

Or to put it another way, of the two, Nava and Gomez, Nava is the one I can see making someone else's big league roster a few months from now if we cut him. He's not the archetypal COF, but the archetypal COF has been so hard to find lately that there's room for a guy like him in some bottom feeder's lineup.

 

If we're talking trade though, we could be talking Ciriaco. Unlike Nava or Gomez or the other schlubs we could cut, Ciriaco could fetch us a return, and I suspect we have the depth to part with him.

 

If they want Iglesias in the big leagues at all costs, Ciriaco is expandable. If they plan on sending Iglesias down when Drew comes back, then we might see Nava or Gomez be the casualty.

 

I must say, it's not a bad problem to have, having guys with at least some big league utility at the bottom of the 40 man.

 

Agree about Gomez. But the guy was AAA MVP last year, and I would guess they are trying to trade him. Nava is expendable because they have too many outfielders with he and Bradley on the team. However, if you figure Bradley gets sent down after 20 games, they need another outfielder, which puts Nava, and maybe Sweeney, in play. They may be trying to work out a deal with Sweeney, where they stash him in AAA for a month.

 

I don't think they'll deal Ciriaco. He's their wild card off the bench. Plus he kills the Yankees.

Big plus for him. When Drew returns, Iggy goes to Pawtucket to play full time, Ciriaco infield backup.

[Bellhorn04]

Mauro Gomez is a wiser cut than Nava. While Nava isn't great, he has a 2 year track record in the big leagues of hitting at least well enough to be useful as a reserve, which is what you want deep in the 40-man.

 

My impression is that Nava is pretty safe. Farrell has talked about how he might be a good #2 hitter against RH pitching. He also singled him out for praise for his right-handed at-bat against Cliff Lee when he fouled some 2-strike pitches off and got a sac fly.

 

Of course I'm a Nava fan myself.

[SoxSport]

My impression is that Nava is pretty safe. Farrell has talked about how he might be a good #2 hitter against RH pitching. He also singled him out for praise for his right-handed at-bat against Cliff Lee when he fouled some 2-strike pitches off and got a sac fly.

 

Of course I'm a Nava fan myself.

 

Gomez hasn't looked good in ST. They are thinking about 1b in Pawtucket more than anything for him, so he could be the one.

[Thunder]

Gomez hasn't looked good in ST. They are thinking about 1b in Pawtucket more than anything for him, so he could be the one.

 

So I guess that means that Napoli will be the full time 1st baseman.

[jung]

I don't see the Sox trying to move Nava. Gomez I could see or possibly Ciriaco. If I had to bet I would bet Gomez.

 

The 40 man roster for JBJ was always going to be a problem IF they were going to try to have him there at the start of the season. Neither Sweeney nor JBJ have been on the 40 man roster the entire time.

[Station 13]

Morales could be on the 60 day DL since he hasn't appeared in any spring training game (that I know off). He could retroactively get place on the 60 day DL if they think he could be back in May without losing anyone on the roster for Bradley.

[Palodios]

Morales could be on the 60 day DL since he hasn't appeared in any spring training game (that I know off). He could retroactively get place on the 60 day DL if they think he could be back in May without losing anyone on the roster for Bradley.

 

Morales appeared in exactly one game-- and that game will be a big pain to the roster. Otherwise he was on the DL to the end of last year and I think it could have been retroactive to last year.

[Station 13]

Morales appeared in exactly one game-- and that game will be a big pain to the roster. Otherwise he was on the DL to the end of last year and I think it could have been retroactive to last year.

 

Players can't get credited for last season's DL time. The roster is active in the off-season, meaning all DL must return to active. Which is why teams are actively squeezing for the rule 5 draft.

 

 

I heard somewhere Morales will be early June at best. He's not a factor right now. Ortiz could also get place on the 60 day if early May is his target return. Any grapefruit league game not played can be credited as DL time to the last game played.

[a700hitter]

My impression is that Nava is pretty safe. Farrell has talked about how he might be a good #2 hitter against RH pitching. He also singled him out for praise for his right-handed at-bat against Cliff Lee when he fouled some 2-strike pitches off and got a sac fly.

 

Of course I'm a Nava fan myself.

He has a nice story, and it's easy to root for him, but not the type of player that good teams carry on their roster. He is a glorified bush leaguer. He is very very limited in his abilities. He's small with little power, runs like a wounded duck, and has a weak arm. He's got a lot of heart, but otherwise, he's a zero.

[rjortiz]

Anyone have ESPN subscription can post this?

 

http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb/blog/_/name/olney_buster/id/9107108/mlb-execs-pick-top-10-players-2013-bbtn-500

 

 

The American League Most Valuable Player debate last summer illuminated the significant difference between the way folks in front offices evaluate players and how uniformed personnel view them. For managers, coaches and players, Miguel Cabrera was a no-brainer selection as he became the first hitter in 45 years to win the Triple Crown.

 

But for many general managers, assistant general managers and scouts -- baseball's talent evaluators -- the whole question seemed ridiculously simple, summed up neatly by the offensive and defensive metrics of Mike Trout.

ESPN Baseball Tonight with Buster Olney

 

Buster Olney talks about the top 10 players in baseball as voted on by GM's and scouts and previews the NL Central with Tim Kurkjian, Derrick Goold and Jesse Rogers.

 

More Podcasts »

 

"Taking a home run away with your glove means the same thing as hitting a home run," one GM said with incredulity.

 

It was a debate that execs believed wasn't really debatable.

 

So the results of a poll of 21 talent evaluators shouldn't be a surprise. In conjunction with the "Baseball Tonight" 500 -- the top 10 of which will be unveiled at 10 tonight on ESPN -- I asked those 21 execs to rank the top 10 players in the majors for 2013, 1 through 10, and the votes reflected the way they feel about overall value. The middle-of-the-diamond guys, including pitchers, fared very well.

 

In tabulating the votes, I gave the players points according to where they were placed on ballots -- 10 for first place, 9 for second place, etc.) .

 

1. Mike Trout | OF, Los Angeles Angels

177 (out of 210 possible) points; 13 first-place votes

 

"Best player in the game, period," said one front office type. "Special, a freak talent."

 

2. Buster Posey | C, San Francisco Giants

164 points; 5 first-place votes

 

"Elite hitter at a premium position who has led his team to two World Series titles."

 

3. Justin Verlander | RHP, Detroit Tigers

132 points

 

"Most dominant pitcher in the game."

 

4. Miguel Cabrera | 3B, Detroit Tigers

130 points; 2 first-place votes

 

"Probably the best pure hitter in the game."

 

5. Clayton Kershaw | LHP, Los Angeles Dodgers

93 points

 

"Injuries from last year hurt his ranking a little, but he's one of the best."

 

6. David Price | LHP, Tampa Bay Rays

68 points

 

"For me, he's right there with Verlander -- and he's younger, and left-handed."

 

7. Joey Votto | 1B, Cincinnati Reds

65 points; 1 first-place vote

 

"I think he's headed for a big year at the plate, and he's a good defender."

 

8. Robinson Cano | 2B, New York Yankees

63 points

 

"He's got the best swing in baseball."

 

9. Ryan Braun | LF, Milwaukee Brewers

62? points

 

"There are questions about the stuff in Miami, but he performs at an extremely high level every year."

 

10. Andrew McCutchen | CF, Pittsburgh Pirates

56 points

 

"He may be the most complete player, and does it on bad team."

 

Other players who got votes: Giancarlo Stanton finished 11th, with 27 points; Matt Kemp 26; Evan Longoria 25; Felix Hernandez 19; Joe Mauer 11; Stephen Strasburg 11; Adrian Beltre 6? Bryce Harper 4; Troy Tulowitzki 4; Chase Headley 1.

 

Bradley's scouting report

 

A talent evaluator had this scouting report after watching Jackie Bradley Jr. play as an amateur at the University of South Carolina.

 

"Player carries the 'it' factor. Presidential presence to game. Regal. However, the player has been the most popular man in Columbia, S.C. from the 1st day he walked on campus and he had me glued to the TV last year watching the College World Series. Mesmerizing defender. Jaw-dropping defensive skills. Patrols CF with a determined grace, with flare. Would have happily paid good money just to watch his pregame batting practice and infield. Acrobatic and skilled. Catches every ball with flare. Covers ground like a gladiator. Plus handles the glove in CF like Omar Vizquel would in the infield. Amazing defensive skills. Innate ability to hawk the diamond. Better defender in center field than majority of major leaguers right now& [You] can't teach the things this kid can do defensively. Made the parallel play coming directly in on a ball ala 1998 Andruw Jones. Sick defender."

 

If the Red Sox open the season with Bradley, Jr. in the big leagues -- two years after that scouting report was placed -- his defense will be one of the biggest reasons.

 

Bradley has proven he belongs. Is he one of the best players in Boston's camp? Absolutely.

 

From a business standpoint, would it make sense to wait until April 12 to promote him and gain an extra year of team control? Absolutely.

 

Around the league

 

• Maybe the most notable maneuvering this week has been the Angels' scramble to add pitching. Their bullpen has been something of a puzzle this spring, so GM Jerry Dipoto got a reliever in a deal with the Rays, signed Mark Lowe and traded for Elvin Ramirez from the Mets.

 

• On Wednesday's podcast, one of the things Jerry Crasnick and I chatted about, in discussing Royals catcher Salvy Perez, was a catcher I covered who had an OCD issue that drove pitchers crazy.

 

• Evan Gattis made the Braves' roster, the culmination of an incredible comeback story.

 

• This is a good sign for the Giants: Pablo Sandoval was able to go through a workout.

 

Moves, deals and decisions

 

1. Derrick Goold wrote Wednesday morning that the Cardinals were on the verge of a deal with Adam Wainwright, and by last night, the agreement was in place, for $97.5 million.

 

2. The Tigers will huddle to discuss the fate of Bruce Rondon.

 

3. Each time a contract is signed, the deals are assigned average annual values separately by Major League Baseball, and the union assessed Kyle Lohse's deal at about $10.7 million annually. Lohse's deal was first reported at $33 million over three years, and it includes $7 million in deferred money, which is the reason for the difference.

 

4. Vance Worley will be the plow horse for the Twins, they hope, and he's getting the ball on Opening Day.

 

5. The Twins' projected payroll is at $81 million, writes Mike Berardino.

 

6. Gorkys Hernandez was pulled from a game Wednesday, and it could be that the Marlins are preparing a trade, as Joe Capozzi writes. Total speculation: Arizona has had its outfield depth tested this spring by injuries to Adam Eaton and Jason Kubel.

 

7. J.A. Happ got a contract extension, to go along with the No. 5 spot in the Toronto rotation.

 

8. Clayton Kershaw doesn't want to talk about his extension talks.

 

9. The Padres' Opening Day roster is all but set, writes Bill Center.

 

10. Jon Lester is getting the ball on Opening Day, as Dan Shaughnessy writes.

 

11. Jason Hammel is getting the ball on Opening Day for the Orioles.

 

Dings and dents

 

1. The Braves are waiting on the news about Jonny Venters. No matter what the doctors say, his status as an elite setup man will be in doubt as the season opens.

 

2. Willie Bloomquist will open the year on the disabled list.

 

3. Jair Jurrjens was nailed by a comebacker.

 

4. Phil Hughes will open the year on the disabled list.

 

5. Derek Jeter won't play in a minor league game until next week, at the earliest.

 

The fight for jobs

 

1. After all the work Matt Carpenter put in at second base this spring, he'll open the year at third.

 

2. Devin Mesoraco found the competition to be a good thing.

 

3. Nick Tepesch will be the Rangers' No. 5 starter.

 

4. Jeff Niemann, vying for the No. 5 spot in the Tampa Bay rotation, had a really good outing.

 

5. Brandon Maurer and Blake Beavan will be the No. 4 and No. 5 starters in the Seattle rotation, writes Geoff Baker.

 

6. Daniel Bard had a really tough day.

 

7. Some bullpen intrigue remains for the Nationals, writes Amanda Comak.

 

8. The Phillies have to pick a backup catcher.

 

9. Jeff Locke will open the season as the No. 5 starter for the Pirates.

 

Wednesday's games

 

1. Daisuke Matsuzaka had good results.

 

2. Bob Melvin yanked a lot of his starters from Oakland's last exhibition in Arizona.

 

3. Jon Niese finished spring training strong.

NL West

 

• The Rockies' roster is taking shape.

 

• Mark Kiszla doesn't want the Rockies to jinx Jhoulys Chacin with an Opening Day start.

 

• Ted Lilly is unsure about starting the season on the disabled list.

 

• For the Dodgers, questions remain, as Bill Plunkett writes.

 

• The Padres know all about the fragility of pitching, writes Tyler Kepner.

 

NL Central

 

• The Cubs are brimming with optimism as they break camp.

 

• Kyle Lohse is eager to take his turn in the Milwaukee rotation.

 

• A.J. Burnett is thinking about retiring after the season.

 

NL East

 

• Chris Coghlan has had a strong spring, writes Joe Capozzi.

 

• The Mets have faith in Bobby Parnell, writes Mike Puma.

 

• Shaun Marcum says he'll find a way to pitch.

 

• Wilson Ramos is all the way back.

 

• As Roy Halladay gets the ball today, questions about him persist.

 

• The Phillies hope that Michael Young is an influence on Delmon Young.

AL West

 

• For Jurickson Profar, it's hello, Round Rock, writes Randy Galloway.

 

• Kevin Sherrington talks about the Rangers' prospect not named Profar or Olt who is the next big thing.

 

• Mitch Moreland has been a spring star for Texas.

 

• Chip Bailey writes about the Astros' rotation.

 

• The Astros got a glimpse of their future.

 

• The Angels have a star-laden lineup.

AL Central

 

• Terry Francona is eager to see his speedy lineup take off. Francona gave some clues about how he's going to structure his lineup.

 

• Lorenzo Cain hopes to bring a sprinter's approach to center field, writes Bob Dutton.

 

• Addison Reed is putting in work this spring, as Mark Gonzales writes.

 

• Dayan Viciedo seems primed for a breakout year.

 

AL East

 

• Ricky Romero had a difficult time with the news that he was sent down. Pitching coach Pete Walker blames himself for not making changes with Romero's delivery earlier in spring.

 

• The Yankees need to have a 2013 version of Aaron Small to win, writes Joel Sherman.

Other stuff

 

• Major League Baseball is not ready to approve padded caps, writes Willie Weinbaum.

 

• The Cardinals will wear a patch to honor Stan Musial.

 

• Mike Rizzo relies on scouting and analytics, as Adam Kilgore writes.

 

• Tim McCarver is set to retire. He has taught us a lot of things, and he has always been honest, a frankness that cost him jobs with the Mets and the Yankees.

 

• Manny Ramirez debuted in Taiwan, as Brandon DuBreuil writes.

 

And today will be better than yesterday.

[Dojji]

So I guess that means that Napoli will be the full time 1st baseman.

 

If he isn't, it won't be because of Mauro Gomez.

 

We need to worry about the 1B position going forward. There just isn't much out there inside or outside the org over the next few years. Someone's pipe dream of Middlebrooks at 1B and Bogaerts at third is starting to look reasonable.

[BSN07]

If he isn't, it won't be because of Mauro Gomez.

 

We need to worry about the 1B position going forward. There just isn't much out there inside or outside the org over the next few years. Someone's pipe dream of Middlebrooks at 1B and Bogaerts at third is starting to look reasonable.

 

Inception is working :thumbsup:

[Bellhorn04]

He has a nice story, and it's easy to root for him, but not the type of player that good teams carry on their roster. He is a glorified bush leaguer. He is very very limited in his abilities. He's small with little power, runs like a wounded duck, and has a weak arm. He's got a lot of heart, but otherwise, he's a zero.

 

There's one thing I believe he can do much better than average, and that's get on base.

[BornToRun]

There's one thing I believe he can do much better than average, and that's get on base.

 

Which is an extremely valuable skill.

[a700hitter]

There's one thing I believe he can do much better than average, and that's get on base.

The pitchers figure him out after one time through the league and he falls to below average at that too. Can his enormous heart and work ethic overcome his puny physical skills? Possibly, but the odds are against it.

[Palodios]

He has a nice story, and it's easy to root for him, but not the type of player that good teams carry on their roster. He is a glorified bush leaguer. He is very very limited in his abilities. He's small with little power, runs like a wounded duck, and has a weak arm. He's got a lot of heart, but otherwise, he's a zero.

 

Nava is considerably more useful this year than before. With Bradley Ellsbury and Victorino in the outfield, the team doesn't need someone who plays multiple positions in the outfield. That being said, he picked up 1B fairly well, and can play there with average ability.

 

Does he deserve to start? Probably not, but he's better than most 4th and 5th outfielders out there.

 

Let's look at some of the other 4th and 5th outfielders out there.

The Rangers? Julio Borbon and Leonys Martin. Maybe they have potential but so far haven't done much in the majors.

The Yankees? Boesch and Overbay are actually worse defenders than Nava.

The Jays? Raja Davis has speed, but he's a poor defender, doesn't hit, doesn't get on base.

The Tigers? Avisail Garcia and Don Kelly really don't have anything over Nava.

 

He isn't a superstar, but with the built-in versatility of this team, it seems reasonable to keep him around for his monster OBP.

[User Name]

Isn't the phrase "Monster OBP" a bit of an exercise in hyperbole?

[Palodios]

The pitchers figure him out after one time through the league and he falls to below average at that too. Can his enormous heart and work ethic overcome his puny physical skills? Possibly, but the odds are against it.

 

That's if he makes it to mid-season. Brentz could continue hitting in the minors, Kalish could get healthy, or he might just get pushed out when Ortiz comes back. If he starts hot, and burns out, that'll help the team get off to a good start, and maybe they'll be interested in bringing in an outfielder in a trade midseason. There is a good deal of flexibility.

[Palodios]

Isn't the phrase "Monster OBP" a bit of an exercise in hyperbole?

 

My impression was that they would be platooning him. .380 is definitely in the monster range-- top 10 in the league for 2012.

[User Name]

My impression was that they would be platooning him. .380 is definitely in the monster range-- top 10 in the league for 2012.

 

He had a .352 overall OBP in 2012, which falls into very good category. That's what we should be looking at, because recent Red Sox rosters have shown us that there is no such thing as a "platoon player" on this team. Circumstances always force those "platoon players" into full time gigs at some point in the season.

 

Also, that .383 OBP against righties came in a SSS. Let's not kid ourselves here.

[a700hitter]

He isn't a superstar, but with the built-in versatility of this team, it seems reasonable to keep him around for his monster OBP.

His OBP was .284 in the second half of the season. Hardly, a monster OBP. The pitchers figured him out.

[Palodios]

His OBP was .284 in the second half of the season. Hardly, a monster OBP. The pitchers figured him out.

 

It was probably more likely related to the wrist injury that sent him to the DL twice.

[mvp 78]

If he isn't, it won't be because of Mauro Gomez.

 

We need to worry about the 1B position going forward. There just isn't much out there inside or outside the org over the next few years. Someone's pipe dream of Middlebrooks at 1B and Bogaerts at third is starting to look reasonable.

 

It wasn't a pipe dream. It was called critcal thinking.

[Palodios]

Also, that .383 OBP against righties came in a SSS. Let's not kid ourselves here.

 

Nava's minor league numbers from his career:

2008-- .424 OBP

2009-- .458 OBP

2010-- .372 OBP

2011-- .372 OBP

2012-- .425 OBP

 

I'm not pulling this out of thin air. The guy has no power, no speed, but he gets on base.

[a700hitter]

It was probably more likely related to the wrist injury that sent him to the DL twice.

The pattern was the same in 2010. He started red hot and after once through the league his performance fell off a cliff. He wasn't injured then. The guy has very very limited skill.