June 3, 2012: Red Sox @ Blue Jays

[FredLynn]

I disagree. I think he may well have just pitched himself out of the rotation, I really do.

 

With DiceK ready to return, they always say "these things figure themselves out", and I honestly think this just figured itself out.

 

They may throw him on the DL, though, and get him some reps as a relief pitcher in Pawtucket to get his legs back underneath him.

 

I hope you are right SFF. This just cannot continue. And the DL is a good place to start trying to regain his form. Lets hope he is not another Joba case.

[jung]

There have been worse starts but not by much!

 

Bard filled a role for the Sox at the start of the season. For a period here the Sox may have had the best 4 and 5 going in the AL in their rotation. However he is not even improving by microscopic degrees at this point and no young pitcher aims to be a 5. A 5 is either a young guy on the way up or an older guy on the way down or somebody just off the DL. Bard has done a good job in the 5 hole but is going nowhere.

 

However who the hell else were they going to put there for the beginning of the season other than Bard or Aviles and they needed Aviles in the pen worse than they needed Bard in the pen. So he has filled that role and has done it almost up to the point where he was going to have to get the hell outta' there anyway.

 

As for ruining him as a RP, I am not sure he has what it takes there either. It is not like he is wild somewhere into the game. When he is wild he is wild from pitch 1 and he had gotten that way last year. I just don't buy this overworked argument from last year because just about everything that plagued him at the end of last season followed him into this season. As a starter he has been able to stay out there on the mound and work out issues where as a reliever he was generally pulled from a bad stint quickly.

 

Obviously at some point Bard goes to the pen. However if he does not do well there I would be less inclined to blame it on his stint as a starter. If he succeeds there, good for him. I do think something happened in his delivery, in his approach, in something last year and Bard may have to go down a notch to work it out before things get better for him.

[FredLynn]

Hey-at least we won the series against the Jays. Thats what we really needed to accomplish here. Lets do it against the Orioles too...keep winning series.

[evilhand]

I was not accusing you of trying to use injuries as an excuse. Some here have done that, but I never bought that. In fact, I am really not disagreeing with what you wrote about that.

I think that you CAN almost bash your way into the playoffs, but you need SOME pitching too. Last year is an example. We led the AL in runs scored and OPS, but still missed the playoffs because of mediocre to poor pitching. The year before we were second in OPS and runs scored, but again, our pitching sucked and we missed the playoffs.Its out pitching that will determine if we make the playoffs or not this year, once again.

 

Do don't disagree with most of this. I will point out, however, that missing the playoffs last year required an historic collapse during an historically bad month. Play that September out 100 times, the result we got happens once, maybe twice.

 

Not making excuses, just pointing out that the results were so far beyond three standard deviations from what you would expect, that in a statistical simulation you'd simply toss them out as outliers.

 

This is the real world, so there are not do-overs due to extremely unlikely results, but let's not pretend that anyone could have seen September 2011 coming on August 31st.

[lesterkett]

f*** off punto .. When the red sox are going to DFA this jackass

[evilhand]

I hope you are right SFF. This just cannot continue. And the DL is a good place to start trying to regain his form. Lets hope he is not another Joba case.

 

I think a DL stint is a great idea. He probably needs to shut it down and just rest for a few weeks, then try to come back as a reliever with a fresh start. Even if this is just dead arm, rest is required before he can start being effective again.

 

Hey-at least we won the series against the Jays. Thats what we really needed to accomplish here. Lets do it against the Orioles too...keep winning series.

 

Yeah, even if they can't come back today, it's been a good weekend. Hell, it's been a really good month. This team looks like a contender right now.

[FredLynn]

Do don't disagree with most of this. I will point out, however, that missing the playoffs last year required an historic collapse during an historically bad month. Play that September out 100 times, the result we got happens once, maybe twice.

 

Not making excuses, just pointing out that the results were so far beyond three standard deviations from what you would expect, that in a statistical simulation you'd simply toss them out as outliers.

 

This is the real world, so there are not do-overs due to extremely unlikely results, but let's not pretend that anyone could have seen September 2011 coming on August 31st.

 

I guess my point is that we will probably finish in the top three in runs scored and OPS this year. I don't think there will be any shortage of runs for the Red Sox this year, just like the last two years. If we want the results of 2010 and 2011 to be different in 2012 that difference has to be in pitching, especially in starting pitching. There is lots of room to improve over the performances of our last two years. If we discard the first several weeks of the season and finish in the top five in the AL in ERA we should be fine in terms of making the playoffs. Below that, we are in trouble, just like the past two years.

[jung]

I think a DL stint is absolutely the best thing they can do for Bard right now. Maybe he could have gone directly to the pen if he had made it all the way to the end of his starter's role "successfully" but I can't believe they will leave him in a starters role at this point and he needs some time to try to work out issues.

[SoxFanForsyth]

We'll get to this guy. No worries. Just don't allow any more runs.

[SoxFanForsyth]

Well. Maybe we won't get to him. Ortiz and Youk looked stupid there.

[jung]

Damn....Youk at least had stopped chasing sliders since coming back from the DL...still has not hit them for s*** but had stopped chasing them. Now he is back to chasing them again and looks like he did before going to the DL.

[Station 13]

Youkilis stop chasing the pitch you could never hit.

[SoxFanForsyth]

This game is painful to watch.

[Palodios]

One hit. Five runs. Even with Dice-k and Wakefield here, I don't think I've ever seen that.

[jung]

I do wish V did not leave guys out when they are wild to the point where we are filling hospital wards.

[SoxFanForsyth]

One hit. Five runs. Even with Dice-k and Wakefield here' date=' I don't think I've ever seen that.[/quote']

 

That really is incredible.

[Brennan]

I hope this team thinks it is worth it to not sign good SP and try to ruin a very good relief pitcher as a cheap way out. Said it all year and caught a lot of s*** for it.

[Brennan]

Cy Hutchison.

[jung]

Almost uncanny how often Schoppach hits some guy the rest of the Sox are struggling to hit.

[Palodios]

Home run! Let's see this game get competitive.

[Elktonnick]

One hit. Five runs. Even with Dice-k and Wakefield here' date=' I don't think I've ever seen that.[/quote']

 

Darnel McDonald couldn't have done worse

[mvp 78]

I hope this team thinks it is worth it to not sign good SP and try to ruin a very good relief pitcher as a cheap way out. Said it all year and caught a lot of s*** for it.

 

Yes, because they actively tried to ruin Bard.

[TutGadol]

Rally bears?

[jung]

At least this should be a bad enough outing to make for a nice easy FO decision. Will they then be smart enough to put Bard on the DL and give him a chance to hit the reset button???

[Brennan]

Yes' date=' because they actively tried to ruin Bard.[/quote']

 

Exactly. He is obviously valuable in the pen, not as a starter.

 

You are finally getting it.

[mvp 78]

Hey-at least we won the series against the Jays. Thats what we really needed to accomplish here. Lets do it against the Orioles too...keep winning series.

 

Pfft, stop being such an opptimist.

[SoxFanForsyth]

s***. Really needed Gonzo to get a knock there.

 

He's getting tied up SO BADLY inside this year.

[Station 13]

Gonzalez.....pathetic.

[Elktonnick]

At least this should be a bad enough outing to make for a nice easy FO decision. Will they then be smart enough to put Bard on the DL and give him a chance to hit the reset button???

 

Yes they should DL him citing a mental injury.

[lesterkett]

gonzo is overpaid and overrated player ..