Sox and Ortiz Settle at Mid-Point

[User Name]

Fred, although i agree with your points (mainly about hope of improvement for Salty) the discussion is not about Varitek. You're going to reverse-lock him into coming in to ST!

[jung]

I am really hoping that Lavarnway comes on and improves at a rate that ultimately gets him to the top of the depth chart for Sox catchers.

 

Salty is a decent catcher but I don't think he is going to improve much from where he is now. Lavarnway appears to me to have more natural ability and much more upside. I just think his catching instincts are better than Salty's and he appears to have a bit more athleticism in his game as well. Hence I think he has more upside than Salty has. There is no question in my mind which one is quicker. Lavarnway moves around home plate much more gracefully than Salty does.

 

Salty should be able to hold the fort for now anyway.

[Palodios]

I am really hoping that Lavarnway comes on and improves at a rate that ultimately gets him to the top of the depth chart for Sox catchers.

 

Salty is a decent catcher but I don't think he is going to improve much from where he is now. Lavarnway appears to me to have more natural ability and much more upside. I just think his catching instincts are better than Salty's and he appears to have a bit more athleticism in his game as well. Hence I think he has more upside than Salty has. There is no question in my mind which one is quicker. Lavarnway moves around home plate much more gracefully than Salty does.

 

Salty should be able to hold the fort for now anyway.

 

In the fearless prediction thread, I made a prediction-- Salty gets DFAed by the middle of the year. Shoppach has an arm, and Lavs has the bat. What does Salty have?

[RedSoxfanforlife305]

He's tall and adequate.

 

In before a700 and SCM

 

In all seriousness though, he exceeded many peoples expectations. He wasn't no Joe Mauer but he really wasn't as bad most people made him out to be. Wasn't that like his first full season with a team? He's young too. Plus catching Wake I bet isn't fun. His flaws are fixable. With time he can probably produce quality stats.

[jung]

I made a prediction-- Salty gets DFAed by the middle of the year. Shoppach has an arm, and Lavs has the bat. What does Salty have?

 

My prediction for Salty is that he is going to have the most forgettable career of any Boston catcher in recent memory. He will however be our Mr. Adequate until Lavarnway is ready to be our everyday catcher.

[SoxSport]

I am really hoping that Lavarnway comes on and improves at a rate that ultimately gets him to the top of the depth chart for Sox catchers.

 

Salty is a decent catcher but I don't think he is going to improve much from where he is now. Lavarnway appears to me to have more natural ability and much more upside. I just think his catching instincts are better than Salty's and he appears to have a bit more athleticism in his game as well. Hence I think he has more upside than Salty has. There is no question in my mind which one is quicker. Lavarnway moves around home plate much more gracefully than Salty does.

 

Salty should be able to hold the fort for now anyway.

 

They got to give those young guys a shot. Look at that Harvard kid Lin with the Knicks.

Without injuries, the kid never gets in a game. Same with Reddick last year. They gave him a shot, he panned out, and they got a good closer for him. Lavarnway comes in, hits two HRs, and Tito bats him cleanup the next day. Well, that's Tito. Not the thing to do with the kid. Not in that lineup. So now they've got Lavarnway, Iglesias and Kalish waiting in the wings. Kalish will be late due to injuries, but I think Valentine will give the other two plenty

of opportunity to show what they can do in ST. Bobby will be looking for fundamentals, and he will run.

[SCM33]

League average is s*****' date=' and slightly above average is still s*****. I don't discredit the hot streak, it happened, don't know where you pulled that out of, or how much it hurt to do so. Doesn't matter what Bill James projects, I'm pretty sure it's not a fool proof formula. His career has yet to inspire hope. Spin it whatever way you like, but Salty is mediocre overall. His bat doesn't make up for how much of a butcher he is.[/quote']

Dont argue with everyone. You are wrong. Nothing we say will prove otherwise. Im going to try an not have this argument all year again.

 

Salty had the 14th highest OPS (out of 27) among catchers with 300+ PAs. He's an average catcher. Why do you continue to say he's s*****?

He sucks.

 

Salty is adequate at best. His defense stinks. Too many throws into CF. His release is almost as slo as the 40 year old Varitek's release. He can't catch the ball. Wakefield is not to blame for all of his passed balls. He doesn't block balls well. He's no Varitek catching the ball and blocking the plate. Varitek's weakness was his throwing release which became glaring over the last few seasons. Other than that, he did everything very well behind the plate, and I never saw a catcher block the plate better. His left leg was like a concrete pillar. Salty doesn't do anything well behind the plate, and the jury is still out on how he handles the pitching staff.

 

As for his hitting, he hits like a catcher. It's a weak pool. My fear this season (to connect up with the topic of this thread) is that he will not improve offensively in 2012 and Ortiz will not see any pitches because of it. With the bottom of the Sox order, someone needs to step up or pitchers will pitch around Ortiz from day 1. They'd have to be idiots to let Ortiz hurt them with Salty, Aviles, Sweeney, and Ross hitting behind him.

Not worth it, nothing you or I or Emmz says will change their minds.

[Emmz]

He's tall and adequate.

 

In before a700 and SCM

 

In all seriousness though, he exceeded many peoples expectations. He wasn't no Joe Mauer but he really wasn't as bad most people made him out to be. Wasn't that like his first full season with a team? He's young too. Plus catching Wake I bet isn't fun. His flaws are fixable. With time he can probably produce quality stats.

 

As BAD? 3 months of hot streak and half the site was wanting his dong. Some members here were even seen hating, then jumping on the wagon all in one thread. Absolutely ridiculous. hits .900 OPS for a few months and he's suddenly an elite offensive catcher.

[User Name]

Dont argue with everyone. You are wrong. Nothing we say will prove otherwise. Im going to try an not have this argument all year again.

 

 

He sucks.

 

 

Not worth it, nothing you or I or Emmz says will change their minds.

 

What is your problem with Salty? Dear Lord. Would you rather have the titanic bat of Kurt Suzuki in the lineup?

 

He's not that good but he doesn't suck.

 

Besides, he's just keeping the seat warm for Lavarnway or Exposito anyways.

[SCM33]

What is your problem with Salty? Dear Lord. Would you rather have the titanic bat of Kurt Suzuki in the lineup?

 

He's not that good but he doesn't suck.

 

Besides, he's just keeping the seat warm for Lavarnway or Exposito anyways.

 

Sucks.

 

Keeping the seat warm is fine. He is not the catcher of the future, which some people believe to be true because of his relatively young age. If he hangs around as a backup, Id be more than happy with him. Id rather he keep the seat warm in the bullpen.

[Bellhorn04]

In the fearless prediction thread' date=' I made a prediction-- Salty gets DFAed by the middle of the year. Shoppach has an arm, and Lavs has the bat. What does Salty have?[/quote']

 

Isn't it possible that these high expectations for Lavarnway as a hitter are a little premature? Sure, the guy tore it up in the minors last year. So did Anthony Rizzo.

 

Rizzo hit 331/404/652 in AAA ball, then 141/281/242 for the Padres. They liked him so much they traded him.

 

Lavarnway had a 2-homer game. Nice. Overall 231/302/436 in a very small sample. Bottom line, he has not proven himself to be a big league hitter yet.

[mvp 78]

Yeah, I hope he's not Kevin Maas, but it's way too early to tell. He should spend the whole year catching at AAA and start for Boston in 2013.

[SoxSport]

I read 5 of the 7 arb players lost their cases. Ortiz probably would have lost, but the Red Sox are overpaying him for PR reasons.

[redsoxfan3]

Isn't it possible that these high expectations for Lavarnway as a hitter are a little premature? Sure, the guy tore it up in the minors last year. So did Anthony Rizzo.

 

Rizzo hit 331/404/652 in AAA ball, then 141/281/242 for the Padres. They liked him so much they traded him.

 

Lavarnway had a 2-homer game. Nice. Overall 231/302/436 in a very small sample. Bottom line, he has not proven himself to be a big league hitter yet.

 

I know that you cannot just say that after he hit two homers in a game that he is ready for the majors, but the reason everyone is saying that is because he was solid in AAA and AA last year as well. Scouts all mainly agree that he is major league ready offensively, but I want him the be major league ready defensively as well. One more year in AAA could put him right on track to where he needs to be defensively. I hope Lavarnway is our future catcher, not our future DH. I do agree that he has not proven himself to be a big league hitter, because he doesn't even have much experience. I just want him to continue to develop, so that when he is given the chance, then he will be as ready as he can be.

[jung]

I read 5 of the 7 arb players lost their cases. Ortiz probably would have lost, but the Red Sox are overpaying him for PR reasons.

 

I expect that Ortiz having earned a reputation for pouting the Sox lost their nerve against the potential for his going into a blue funk. The arbitration hearing would have forced the Sox to describe what Ortiz is not. Having already invested $12.5M into him, I am guessing they decided that another $2M was not worth the trouble. I do agree however that the whole thing smacks more of PR than anything else.