Players unhappy with the Valentine as manager?

[Muggah]

Hiring Bobby V wasn't just a baseball move it was a marketing one as well. Based on published reports ' date=' Lucchino et al were very concerned about fan reaction to the collapse. They monitor radio, the press aand yes these boards to guage fan reaction. They know their fan base was angry. That's why they embarked on the housecleaning. Sveum was too much like Francona. There are indications that they were concerned that a Sveum and Lamont type wouldn't satisfy the fans who wanted things to change after the team quit on a player friendly manager.[/quote']

 

I think Henry's 'pop in' on Felger and Mazz opened his eyes a bit to how truly pissed the fanbase is. It's a safe bet Larry was all for it from the outset, but that it took a little longer to get the other two on board.

 

As for Bennie, well...you know...

[jung]

Boy I hope they cleaned house because the house was a mess not because of us in the fan base.

 

As for hiring Bobby V being a consequence of comments from the fan base, the first I heard of Bobby V as an option people were saying that JH favored him and to some extent LL and that is why he was a candidate.

 

This is a pretty good board for having knowledgable people even when they don't agree with each other and I did not see anybody forward V until those reports that JH and LL were interested in him. At that point there were at least as many people holding their noses over V as people thinking it might be a good move.....I think.

[boy racer]

More media babble. Valentine will be just fine and the players will accept him--initially at least.

 

My thoughts. It's not all about Valentine, either.

[Mr Tibbs]

You thinks it's ok for a manager to call out a specific player to the media?

If you are refering to BV's comments about Beckett remember that BV was the media at the time.

 

 

I read this article last night and had the same reaction as the OP, screw the whiny bastards! I realize that not everyone will like the choice of BV as skipper, but if the same players that helped caused "the collapse" are the ones doing the whining the FO needs to take a serious look at getting rid of these problem causers. Why would the patients have a say in who is running the asylum??!!<_>

[jung]

Does anybody know where or how V commented about thinking Crawford should change his stance by closing it? Is that another comment that he made as a TV analyst or is this a more recent comment?

[BigPapiEnFuego]

Watching the press conference now... Valentine looked incredibly happy and excited to be named manager. I've always liked him and never understood why people seemed to dislike him so much. I am excited to see how this season will play out.

 

 

And like always, Shaughnassey has to be a s***-stirring, bloated, prick during the interview.

[Muggah]

Does anybody know where or how V commented about thinking Crawford should change his stance by closing it? Is that another comment that he made as a TV analyst or is this a more recent comment?

 

He made it on an ESPN broadcast covering the Sox this year. Not sure which one, but I believe it was later in the season when it was clear Crawford had little chance of turning things around.

[mvp 78]

Watching the press conference now... Valentine looked incredibly happy and excited to be named manager. I've always liked him and never understood why people seemed to dislike him so much. I am excited to see how this season will play out.

 

 

And like always, Shaughnassey has to be a s***-stirring, bloated, prick during the interview.

 

I wasn't a big proponent of his, but he came off rather well. I'm impressed so far.

[jung]

Boy that press conference was way more strange than I expected it to be. Surprised by how emotional V was and In his interview after, he it sounded like he was saying that he was surprised by how emotional he got as well.

 

In his opening comments, he said that he thanked JH and LL for supporting Ben in HIS decision to hire him. I don't know if his new bosses asked him to say that but expect they have asked him to characterize it that way.

 

I would not have asked V to start his life with the Boston media that way. Whatever they want to do or don't want to do about how this process was handled, don't bring V into it for crying out loud. I have to think they asked him to characterize it that way because it would have been more natural and so easy to have just thanked the "Red Sox" for giving him this opportunity. Actually I think the media cut him a break in not focusing on that characterization of his hiring since he opened that door. Honestly I am glad that they did not go down that road but I just wish the Sox brass would learn from the past and not throw every carcass out there in a way that gives the media a chance to carve it up. Reminds me of that press conference where they forced Tito onto the stage with Theo. That was the one where Tito said he questioned whether he had the support of management or not.

[wyo-sox]

He certainly seems passionate about his new job. I've got to think players feel good with his comments about how he needs to make efforts to become part of their team- to fond ways to help them. A couple good moves at the winter meetings and I am feeling real good about next season.

[a700hitter]

I wasn't a big proponent of his' date=' but he came off rather well. I'm impressed so far.[/quote']You were in favor of getting the best available puppet?

[Elktonnick]

Does anybody know where or how V commented about thinking Crawford should change his stance by closing it? Is that another comment that he made as a TV analyst or is this a more recent comment?

 

It was posted before. It was during an ESPN game broadcast, I believe a reporter asked Crawford about it later.

[sleepyhollow]

RE: Crawford's stance:

Bobby made that comment during his ESPN TV analyst stint

[a700hitter]

I think Crawford will like Bobby V. Crawford is a very hard worker and Bobby V will love him.

[VA Sox Fan]

If you are refering to BV's comments about Beckett remember that BV was the media at the time.

 

 

I read this article last night and had the same reaction as the OP, screw the whiny bastards! I realize that not everyone will like the choice of BV as skipper, but if the same players that helped caused "the collapse" are the ones doing the whining the FO needs to take a serious look at getting rid of these problem causers. Why would the patients have a say in who is running the asylum??!!<_>

 

No I was referring to a manager calling out one of his players in the media. Like Ozzie Guillen would do sometimes.

[VA Sox Fan]

Watching the press conference now... Valentine looked incredibly happy and excited to be named manager. I've always liked him and never understood why people seemed to dislike him so much. I am excited to see how this season will play out.

 

 

And like always, Shaughnassey has to be a s***-stirring, bloated, prick during the interview.

 

No doubt. As soon as they said his name I was thinking "here he goes"....fk'n douche-bag.

[VA Sox Fan]

I wasn't a big proponent of his' date=' but he came off rather well. I'm impressed so far.[/quote']

 

Me too. I was watching with a friend and he couldn't get over how much I was smiling.

[boy racer]

All the Red Sox players will desperately want to win this year, to thrive, slam the door on what happened this year. One by one, Valentine should talk with the players, and the players should talk with him, and they should all listen, and he should listen.

 

True, but Bobby isn't a therapist. It falls on the players in the end to do the work and correct their mistakes, because there were a boatload of non-managerial issues last season performance-wise.

[FredLynn]

Me too. I was watching with a friend and he couldn't get over how much I was smiling.

 

Go ahead: admit it. You are actually a bit curious and very much looking forward to seeing what he can do with this team.

[FredLynn]

He made it on an ESPN broadcast covering the Sox this year. Not sure which one' date=' but I believe it was later in the season when it was clear Crawford had little chance of turning things around.[/quote']

 

I think you gotta keep in mind that his role as a TV analyst is very different than his role as manager. I would discount ANYTHING he said in his previous job, which was to entertain people.

[VA Sox Fan]

True' date=' [b']but Bobby isn't a therapist[/b]. It falls on the players in the end to do the work and correct their mistakes, because there were a boatload of non-managerial issues last season performance-wise.

 

He wasn't hired to be a therapist and you are right about the players.

[User Name]

I think you gotta keep in mind that his role as a TV analyst is very different than his role as manager. I would discount ANYTHING he said in his previous job' date=' which was to entertain people.[/quote']

 

But he's not the first and won't be the last one who supports the opinion that Crawford needs to change his stance to make use of the monster. Maybe this is one situation where what he said in his broadcasting job may hold water in his managing job.

 

Exception that proves the rule, so to speak.

[FredLynn]

But he's not the first and won't be the last one who supports the opinion that Crawford needs to change his stance to make use of the monster. Maybe this is one situation where what he said in his broadcasting job may hold water in his managing job.

 

Exception that proves the rule, so to speak.

 

I think that the difference is in how strong he comes across. As an analyst his job is to create interest and to an extent, controversy to keep people interested. He can comment much more strongly about Crawford's stance as an analyst. People love controversy; the watch controversial figures more than dull vanilla ones.

As a manager his approach has to be a lot softer. All of it would have to be done behind the scenes, man to man with Crawford and the coaches. He has to get Crawford to buy into the change as manager, something that is irrelevant as analyst.

I don't think (ie IMO) there is much you can take home from his stint as analyst that will translate to his function as manager. Thats all I am saying.

[VA Sox Fan]

Go ahead: admit it. You are actually a bit curious and very much looking forward to seeing what he can do with this team.

 

I have no problem admitting it. I'm psyched, :thumbsup:

[User Name]

RE: Pumpsie: I'm not arguing to the contrary. I'm just pointing out the Crawford situation specifically because it seems more like an inevitable change (whether or not Valentine was chosen as the manager) than a possibility. And the fact that he had mentioned it before doesn't change the fact that it's a sentiment echoed by several scouts. Crawford really needs to address it, and Valentine will probably be part of the effort.

[FredLynn]

RE: Pumpsie: I'm not arguing to the contrary. I'm just pointing out the Crawford situation specifically because it seems more like an inevitable change (whether or not Valentine was chosen as the manager) than a possibility. And the fact that he had mentioned it before doesn't change the fact that it's a sentiment echoed by several scouts. Crawford really needs to address it' date=' and Valentine will probably be part of the effort.[/quote']

 

And I am not debating the need for Crawford to look at this as something that is probably inevitable, eventually. As his swing slows down he is going to have a very hard time reaching some pitches with a stance that wide open. I don't know if Valentine is the right guy to reach him about it; maybe the next manager in a couple of years. Don't forget: Crawford had GREAT stats the year before he came over from the Rays. Its not all about his batting stance. There had to be other factors last year.

[User Name]

Should be sooner rather than later. Fenway has a very negative impact on Crawford's power output, and the easiest way to remedy that is to drive the ball the other way with authority. Need to close that stance up a bit if he wants to accomplish that.

[jung]

Low pitches tailing away went from being a bit of a weakness to a glaring flaw that killed just about every at bat for Crawford last season. I have got to believe there is something going on there. Maybe he is just not seeing those pitches as good as he once did. It got to the point last year where you were just waiting for the pitcher to throw either a change, sinker or slider depending on whether lefty or righty and sometimes it looked liked a pitcher was just probing for a pitch in that spot where Crawford was a sure out and have him hitting that weak ground ball to shortstop. I wonder how many 6-4-3's he had last year.

 

I really hope they bring somebody in for him as it might also help him feel like the Sox are committed to helping him figure it out, not just frustrated and regretting having signed him.

[mvp 78]

You were in favor of getting the best available puppet?

 

No, I wasn't sure about Mr Moustache. Those Mets teams turned sour at the end. Most reporters spoke of how intelligent he is and how "he knows it." I figured that he would come out and it would be all about him. That it would be the Bobby Sox not the Red Sox.

 

He was subdued and respectful. I thought he would think his s*** didn't stink, but he came out and was pashionate and gracious. I ate it up because I'm a sucker.

[VA Sox Fan]

No, I wasn't sure about Mr Moustache. Those Mets teams turned sour at the end. Most reporters spoke of how intelligent he is and how "he knows it." I figured that he would come out and it would be all about him. That it would be the Bobby Sox not the Red Sox.

 

He was subdued and respectful. I thought he would think his s*** didn't stink, but he came out and was pashionate and gracious. I ate it up because I'm a sucker.

 

I got the impression that he's learned a lot over the years, as we all do, and has matured as a person. Hope it helps him be a successful manager and help the Red Sox.

 

Man, I am SO ready for Spring Training!!