Manny Ramirez Trade Deadline Thread (renamed)

[TheKilo]

The truly infuriating thing is that the Pirates got 4 good quality prospects for Bay when they got 4 so-so prospects for Marte and Nady combined.

 

OMG the way people were s***ing on Hansen all year I'd think everyone would be stoked he's gone.

[a700hitter]

Bostonownsyou is obviously very upset, but his fears may not be totally unfounded. I fear that Bay's inadequacies as compared to Manny will be resented as they are exposed to RSN night after night. I could see him being the target of boo birds within a month.

[TheKilo]

Imagine next year at this time: Manny is gone' date=' Moss is a .750 OPS OF, and Hansen is MAYBE a competent MR. If a .900 OPS OF like Bay was available for Moss and Hansen, wouldn't you make that deal? And that's only for a two month rental, we get Bay for another entire year.[/quote']

 

RATIONAL THOUGHT IS NOT ALLOWED HERE.

 

But honestly, one of the best posts in this thread.

[a700hitter]

OMG the way people were s***ing on Hansen all year I'd think everyone would be stoked he's gone.

I wasn't crazy about Hansen. I thought he had great stuff, but he is still a project. Nevertheless, I think he is better than Duseldorf.

[TheKilo]

The guy has made sketchy free agent signings at best (for the most part)' date=' and he doesn't make good trades. The last two major deals he's made have been absolutely atrocious. Plus, the 2004 'chip was mostly Duquette's guys anyways. All Theo did that year was trade Nomar for Orlando Cabrera, who everyone seems to think was the sole reason the Sox won it that year. So yeah I'd say the farm system is the only above average contribution he's made to the orginization. Fire away, I'm sticking by that.[/quote']

 

Curt Schilling

Keith Foulke

David Ortiz

Bill Mueller

Kevin Millar

 

etc.

 

 

Yeah, real s*****.

[jacksonianmarch]

BECAUSE HE WAS f***ING DRAFTED BY THEM?

 

No he wasnt. He was drafted by the Expos. They dealt him to the Mets, who dealt him to SD. SD than traded him with Oliver Perez to the Pirates for Brian Giles

[TheKilo]

Cross out Millar and Mueller' date=' first off. They weren't the reasons we won (and nobody go to the ALCS game 4 game-tying hit, Mueller was just the lucky winner there). Schill and Ortiz I grant. Foulke was a good addition for that year but I'm reluctant to consider him a good signing overall because he flat-out disappeared after that.[/quote']

 

So having the 2003 AL Batting Champ doesn't count?

 

Ok.

[TheKilo]

more example1 stuff I see.

 

 

 

I'll re-word this one. Is was a great signing gone bad. I know that he was huge in 2004, but that was the only year of the deal he showed up. Imagine where we could have gone in 05 if we just had a quality closer.

 

Keith Foulke killed his career for 2004.

 

So, 2004 was the reason he wasn't good in 2005.

 

In short, shut the f*** up.

[yeszir]

Blue for Admin voice. Given the circumstances of the day and the sheer volume of posts, I've suspended the profanity/insult moratorium. But in the coming days, please try to refrain from posts like "shut the f*** up" unless someone totally deserves it.

[das11209]

Blue for Admin voice. Given the circumstances of the day and the sheer volume of posts' date=' I've suspended the profanity/insult moratorium. But in the coming days, please try to refrain from posts like "shut the f*** up" unless someone totally deserves it. [/color']

 

You rock. Thanks:D

 

Coming to the trade - I was shocked when I saw this at work. Moss, Hansen, Manny + Cash for Bay? Is this the worst trade Theo has made? I know we need to move Manny - but for this? We did not address our needs at all.

 

I know Hansen has not been great but we could use our prospects better. Last year we gave up 3 good prospects for Gagne.

 

Yeszir - is FireTheo id available?

[CrespoBlows]

BECAUSE HE WAS f***ING DRAFTED BY THEM?

 

Expanding on this point, would Fire_Theo think Vladimir Guerrero sucked in 2004? After all, he played for the Expos longer than Bay played for the Pirates.

 

Obvious scrub!!!!!

[example1]

I'm at airport, plane left at 4:25 when deal not yet announced. Internet here is slow, don't want to search for every detail.

 

TheKilo, or someone, explain paramaters of the deal please:

 

I understand it is Manny, Hansen and Moss for Bay. Is that right?

[yeszir]

I'm at airport, plane left at 4:25 when deal not yet announced. Internet here is slow, don't want to search for every detail.

 

TheKilo, or someone, explain paramaters of the deal please:

 

I understand it is Manny, Hansen and Moss for Bay. Is that right?

 

Yes. Manny to LA, Hansen + Moss to Pittsburgh. Bay coming our way.

[example1]

Cheers Yeszir!

 

It's actually too bad that we had to let go of Moss (IMO), though I'm not sure right where he fit in and the Sox need to have the ability to have someone in a COF spot who can consistently put up a .900ish OPS. Bay is one of those people and the only one available as far as I know. They save money and they get a guy to move them forward positively.

 

No movement on a RP huh?

[TheKilo]

I'm at airport, plane left at 4:25 when deal not yet announced. Internet here is slow, don't want to search for every detail.

 

TheKilo, or someone, explain paramaters of the deal please:

 

I understand it is Manny, Hansen and Moss for Bay. Is that right?

 

Three team deal.

 

LAD gets Manny Ramirez

Boston gets Jason Bay

PIT gets Brandon Moss, Craig Hansen, Andy LaRoche, and Bryan Morris

[TheKilo]

Cheers Yeszir!

 

It's actually too bad that we had to let go of Moss (IMO), though I'm not sure right where he fit in and the Sox need to have the ability to have someone in a COF spot who can consistently put up a .900ish OPS. Bay is one of those people and the only one available as far as I know. They save money and they get a guy to move them forward positively.

 

No movement on a RP huh?

 

Moss is expendable IMO with the presence of Bailey, Van Every, and Carter in Pawtucket.

 

The upgrade in the bullpen comes when Aardsma comes back. Masterson was replacing him, now he'll be replacing Hansen. Plus, they can get RP help on the waiver wire.

 

Depending on how they play things, they can contend this year and make a very strong push for next year.

[YAZMAN]

Who got Manny's grill?

[inkman]

OMG the way people were s***ing on Hansen all year I'd think everyone would be stoked he's gone.

 

I am. I am also confused as to why people think the Sox got hosed. Were Hansen and Moss going to lead them to another World Series...ever.

[Gom]

Blue for Admin voice. Given the circumstances of the day and the sheer volume of posts' date=' I've suspended the profanity/insult moratorium. But in the coming days, please try to refrain from posts like "shut the f*** up" unless someone totally deserves it. [/color']

Shut the f*** up yeszir.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Keith Foulke killed his career for 2004.

 

So, 2004 was the reason he wasn't good in 2005.

 

In short, shut the f*** up.

 

Nope. I will keep posting, thanks. Just to piss you and a couple of others on here off. Since differing opinions seem to draw quite a wave of anger here. I guess people like you are the classic Boston fans the rest of the country hates and criticizes. With good reason, I might add.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

BECAUSE HE WAS f***ING DRAFTED BY THEM?

 

No, Jason Bay was drafted by Montreal! YOU ARE WRONG!!

[TheKilo]

No' date=' Jason Bay was drafted by Montreal! YOU ARE WRONG!![/quote']

 

Fine, let me revise my post.

 

He was traded to the Pirates and during this time was paid a salary that would have him be described as cost controlled and therefore the Pirates had no reason to deal him.

 

Since he is a FA after 2009, they didn't want to pay the money and looked to get something for him.

 

I was wrong about who drafted him, but the main point is that the biggest reason Bay has only played for the Pirates is because he was their best player and was not expensive with respect to his production.

 

Or is that too difficult for you to grasp?

[TheKilo]

Nope. I will keep posting' date=' thanks. Just to piss you and a couple of others on here off. Since differing opinions seem to draw quite a wave of anger here. I guess people like you are the classic Boston fans the rest of the country hates and criticizes. With good reason, I might add.[/quote']

 

So, to recap:

 

You thought signing Keith Foulke was bad because he struggled in 2005, completely ignoring the fact that he destroyed his pitching arm and knees during the 2004 playoff run - one that culminated in an incredible amount of physical stress for Foulke (and the first Sox WS in 86 years).

 

The fact that you would call the Keith Foulke signing a bad one has me scratching my head, not just because mine is a dissenting one but because yours is so spectacularly wrong.

 

Now, your time here has been post after post of embarrassment and low intellect. Remind me again why I should care if you think the way I post is incorrect?

[CrespoBlows]

No' date=' Jason Bay was drafted by Montreal! YOU ARE WRONG!![/quote']

 

Irregardless of the fact, the reason Bay stayed so long as a Pirate was because he was a cost-controlled young player who was very good.

 

The point Fire_Theo was making was absurd. That's like saying all star players who only play on low-market clubs are terrible.

 

LOL CARLOS BELTRAN WAS TERRIBLE UNTIL 2004. HE PLAYED ON THE ROYALS

[TheKilo]

After 18 hours worth of talks involving the Florida Marlins and Pittsburgh Pirates proved futile, the Red Sox scrambled to assemble another swap at the 11th hour and finally found a willing partner in the Los Angeles Dodgers.

 

General manager Theo Epstein was working with a mandate from within his own clubhouse. Following his team's dispiriting loss to the Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim Wednesday night, Epstein met with a handful of Red Sox veterans, all of whom delivered the same message: Manny had to go.

 

http://www.beloblog.com/ProJo_Blogs/SoxBlog/2008/07/sean-mcadam-man.html

[Gom]

Irregardless of the fact, the reason Bay stayed so long as a Pirate was because he was a cost-controlled young player who was very good.

 

The point Fire_Theo was making was absurd. That's like saying all star players who only play on low-market clubs are terrible.

 

LOL CARLOS BELTRAN WAS TERRIBLE UNTIL 2004. HE PLAYED ON THE ROYALS

It's irrespective, not irregardless.

[CrespoBlows]

It's irrespective' date=' not irregardless.[/quote']

 

It's a blend of irrespective and regardless.

 

EDIT* According to the dictionary, this word has been around since the 1920's. Learn something new, everyday.

[ORS]

Nope. I will keep posting' date=' thanks. Just to piss you and a couple of others on here off. Since differing opinions seem to draw quite a wave of anger here. I guess people like you are the classic Boston fans the rest of the country hates and criticizes. With good reason, I might add.[/quote']

Actually, it's quite the opposite. Differing opinions here are welcome as long as they come from an informed position and there is some foundation of logic in their genesis. What we, for the most part, are unreceptive to is an unsupported opinion, whether it be positive or negative. The same people giving you heat now for your unfounded negativity re: Jason Bay, have applied the same standard to irrational fanboys of current and former Sox players.

 

And I can assure you, the annoying fan the country hates are the "in your face" loudmouths who pontificate an uninformed opinion. Your posts fit right into this category.

[BoSox21]

Actually, it's quite the opposite. Differing opinions here are welcome as long as they come from an informed position and their is some foundation of logic in their genesis. What we, for the most part, are unreceptive to is an unsupported opinion, whether it be positive or negative. The same people giving you heat now for your unfounded negativity re: Jason Bay, have applied the same standard to irrational fanboys of current and former Sox players.

 

And I can assure you, the annoying fan the country hates are the "in your face" loudmouths who pontificate an uninformed opinion. Your posts fit right into this category.

 

Pete Sheppard would suck here

[rician blast]

Depending on how they play things' date=' they can contend this year and make a very strong push for next year.[/quote']

 

 

Exactly. This was an effort to save this year's chance to contend (the FO had obviously become very concerned that Manny would single-handedly derail any chance the team had this year) while making an even stronger push next year.