Johan Santana

[example1]

Depressing steroid talk aside, the team who I think need to make the Santana move is the Mets. They have the money and the talent to make a run. I don't know how they haven't been the NL champs the past few years. Santana would give them a better-than-peavy option, and Peavy has carried his team to the playoffs/playdowns a few times.

[jacksonianmarch]

If it is true that the Twins are asking for both Jacoby and Clay, then at least they are really holding out for value. Kinda like what they are doing with us.

[Cocos Disciples]

If I'm Theo and they hold out for Jacoby and Clay, I walk away and never look back. Unless they lower their demands of course. Then I'd run back.

[CrespoBlows]

OMG WE WOOD HAVE

 

JOHAN

BECK

SCHIL

PAPI

WAKE

 

WOW!

[YAZMAN]

If I'm Theo and they hold out for Jacoby and Clay' date=' I walk away and never look back. Unless they lower their demands of course. Then I'd run back.[/quote']

 

Agree. If they don't get what they want, he plays another year in Minnesota and then the Yankees overpay for him. If they get too much for him, it most likely will have been from the Yankees - who gave up the farm then overpay. I think the Sox offer is more than fair considering the value should be looked at for only a year plus the exclusive negotiation period to sign him longer term. The rest of contract is theirs and not Minnesota's.

 

I'd love to see him in Boston, but not at too high a cost to the team and it's future.

[Cocos Disciples]

OMG WE WOOD HAVE

 

JOHAN

BECK

SCHIL

PAPI

WAKE

 

WOW!

 

 

By the way, I didn't realize Papi could pitch?

[cam780]

I guess I kind of felt like everyone was implicated. Do you REALLY think Pujols is clean? He's an enormous power hitter who is putting up numbers that are roughly equivalent to the best hitters of all time. Which players do NOT warrant speculation at this point? MAYBE Manny, but otherwise I just can't think of many who have put up huge numbers without looking like roid users. Ortiz? He's basically admitted to it. A-Rod, probably.

 

Everyone has the telltale signs of HGH usage. They're all bigger in all areas and with HGH you grow but do not lose the size gained. I think everyone was implicated by yesterday's revelation and nobody was exonerated.

 

 

 

Maybe, but Buchholz isn't going anywhere so it just doesn't matter. If the Yankees want to deal Hughes to get santana then more power to them.

 

I think everyone is implicated in steroids but its a cloud thats been over the sport last year especially with Bonds passing Aaron and baseball still had record revenue and even if it did affect baseball's bottom line - I don't see the Red Sox losing much if any profit. All of the games will still sell out. They still have NESN. Yadda Yadda Yadda.

 

I agree the Mets need him the most but they also have the least to offer unless they throw in Reyes which they won't do.

 

The way I look at it having it public that the Twins want both Ellsbury and Buchholz. It allows Theo to pass and not face the wrath of the fan base. I think the deals that we've seen so far this offseason show the type of value the Twins can expect. The D-backs package for Haren wasn't a wow type package and the Twins should be in line for a similar deal.

[BSN07]

This deal is getting out of hand. I say Theo walks from it now. Buccholz+Ellsbury+ 2,3 more prospects+ 140M minimum is way too much for Santana.

 

I realize he is a dominant pitcher, but thats just too much. Let the Yanks overpay for him.

 

 

I think we will be better of keeping the pieces Minny wants, and putting the 140M to use elsewhere.

 

I know of a few decent arms that are available next season. I mean we won this yr, with a dominant Beckett, a shaky Dice K and Schill, a recovering Lester, an injured Wake, a legally insane JT, and a young up and comer in Buccholz. We don't need Santana, we don't want to see him go to NY, but hey not everything is perfect. I think we could get better value elsewhere. Not really sure who tho. Bedard be great, but it will be tuff to get him. Maybe a 3rd team gets involved.

 

Thinking outside the box here, we could turn to SF for one of there young arms. I kn ow SF said there not trading them but they also mentioned a youth movement and then signed a 30 yr old Rowand to a 5 yr deal... They have no hitting prospects in there farm system. If we package up 3 good hitting prospects maybe we could get Cain. Cain's numbers weren't great this season but hes going to be a good pitcher. Moss/Carter/Lowrie/Hansen might be a good package. Just trying to think of something besides Santana. Even Blanton in Oak should be considered.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

This deal is getting out of hand. I say Theo walks from it now. Buccholz+Ellsbury+ 2,3 more prospects+ 140M minimum is way too much for Santana.

 

I realize he is a dominant pitcher, but thats just too much. Let the Yanks overpay for him.

 

Absolutely. A lot of people have said the price for Santana should be above the cost of Dan Haren which the Dbacks gave up a good number of prospects. I disagree.

 

Because of the money involved I would think Johan Santana would be cheaper. I think you can say with 100% certainty that the front office will not part with Clay Buchholz. I'm sure they are reluctant to trading Jacoby Ellsbury. I'm thinking this trade will not happen and on that note I have a feeling the Twins don't trade him at all.

 

It reminds me a bit of Manny Ramirez. The Red Sox couldn't get the right price for him because they couldn't replace him. The Minnesota Twins can't get the right guys for Santana so instead I see them keeping him and giving it a run this season. They will take the draft picks at the end of the season.

[a700hitter]

The Minnesota Twins can't get the right guys for Santana so instead I see them keeping him and giving it a run this season. They will take the draft picks at the end of the season.

I still would not be surprised if the Twins signed him.

[riverside sluggers]

Buchholz, Ellsbury, other prospects plus the reported asking contract price for Johan... Theo should just shake hands with the Twins GM and say "thanks but no thanks". Even without Santana, theyre the early favorites to at least win the division

[rician blast]

Wonder if the Yankees, reeling from the Mitchell report, would be inclined to push hard for Santana now as a diversionary tactic...

 

Get the attention off the fact that a number of their current/former players were implicated, that they're committed to one of them for $16m in 2008 and that at least two of these former players are now spinning ridiculous lies...

 

and get the attention on Santana and the prospect of competing for a WS title in 2008.

 

Wouldn't surprise me in the least if this week we hear the Yankees are back in the hunt.

[das11209]

There have been several news that the Yankees are back on hunt after expired self imposed deadline. They are still not giving up Kennedy and Hughes - so far that's what is holding the deal.

[He Hate Me]

Buchholz' date=' Ellsbury, other prospects plus the reported asking contract price for Johan... Theo should just shake hands with the Twins GM and say "thanks but no thanks". Even without Santana, theyre the early favorites to at least win the division[/quote']

 

that package sounds about right.

 

not sure why the Sox would give that up though. Didnt you just win a championship last year?

[BSN07]

that package sounds about right.

 

not sure why the Sox would give that up though. Didnt you just win a championship last year?

 

Thats why alot of us on here think they should pass on him.

[Cocos Disciples]

The notion that we shouldn't make big strides to improve because we won a championship is idiotic. Despite that, I wouldn't give up Ellsbury AND Buchholz for Santana.

[BSN07]

The notion that we shouldn't make big strides to improve because we won a championship is idiotic. Despite that' date=' I wouldn't give up Ellsbury AND Buchholz for Santana.[/quote']

 

I agree Coco...

 

But I also think adding Ellsbury to CF, A full healthy season of Lester, Buccholz waiting in the wings is making improvements to the team. Adding Santana would def be an improvement. But to add him you have to subtract alot(prospects) and add alot of $(140M minimum contract). Having Santana at this price is not a big improvement to this team.

[Mr Crunchy]

having a guy who won 2 cys, is under 30 and has an era of 1.2? in yankee stadium isnt a big improvement over our current staff??

the man who led baseball in k's and comes from the left side wouldnt help us??

youre kididng yourself by making these remarks

if it costs elsbury and lester it would sting

that sting would be shortlived after he goes 9 in a 3-1 win over the yanks in his 1st bronx start for us....hes expensive,show me a staff that isnt and i will show you a team with little chance to succeed

[Paradisecity]

I think that the way the sox need to play it is to wait until the end of the season for Santana unless the yanks move on him, in which case they should go for him very hard. Worst case scenario would be that the yanks give too much for him.

[Thumper]

I think that the way the sox need to play it is to wait until the end of the season for Santana unless the yanks move on him' date=' in which case they should go for him very hard. Worst case scenario would be that the yanks give too much for him.[/quote']

 

By very hard you're saying give up both Lester and Ellsbury yes?

 

Sorry but I don't feel Santana is worth that much.

[ORS]

Would anyone here trade Beckett for Maybin and Miller?

[carltonfiskga]

Somebody must be smoking their own stool.

[BSN07]

Would anyone here trade Beckett for Maybin and Miller?

 

LOL good way of putting it.

[das11209]

LOL good way of putting it.

 

Someone might have done that trade when Becket was in Florida.

 

Bottom-line- Santana has not won a world series game yet.

[KeepTheFaith1229]

Bottom-line- Santana has not won a world series game yet.

 

:what:

[Cocos Disciples]

Bottom-line- Santana has not won a world series game yet.

 

Does the fact that he has never appeared in one matter?

[das11209]

Does the fact that he has never appeared in one matter?

 

Unfortunately no IMO. I know that twins have a cheap owner - and it's hard for them to go to the world series with that offense. But I will take Becket over Santana any day just because Becket has shown that he can do it all twice so far - I understand thought it's not Santana's fault that he has not been able to do much in post-season.

[example1]

Would anyone here trade Beckett for Maybin and Miller?

 

If Beckett had one year left on his contract and was financially too expensive to resign, then Maybin and MIller would be a fine return for him, wouldn't they?

[Cocos Disciples]

Would anyone here trade Beckett for Maybin and Miller?

 

As the Red Sox, no. We have the cash flow we need to keep Beckett for a very long time. Plus we have Ellsbury (at least now), so theres no need for Maybin.

[ORS]

If Beckett had one year left on his contract and was financially too expensive to resign' date=' then Maybin and MIller would be a fine return for him, wouldn't they?[/quote']

Those caveats speak to my point. Nobody here would do solely on the merits of the players, and those qualifiers won't apply for the Red Sox, so Ellsbury and Buchholz aren't "too much". Would I go that far? It would require some serious thought, but it's not "too much".