Torre rejects Yankee deal

[Gom]

I would say he and Francona are eerily similar. Both are top 5 AL managers. If I had to rank the AL managers I'd probably rank the top 5 as such:

 

Francona

Torre

Scoscia

Leyland

Wedge (though I think he kinda sucks)

Ok...

 

Francona 2008 base salary $2 million

Francona max bonuses: approx 1 million

Torre 2008 rejected base salary $5 million

Torre 2008 max bonuses $3 million

 

Yet the Yankees were classless in what they offered Torre.

 

WAKE UP.

So the 9 straight division titles mean nothing?

Of course they do. Hence the 19.2 million for 3 years, and a continuing salary making you the highest paid manager in baseball, which apparently wasn't good enough. Now go enjoy your green tea with Joe Torre.

[redsoxrules]

holy f*** GOM, if your work would go to you and say " well GOM I know we guaranteed you 50,000 last year but this year we're going to drop that to 35,000 , so you'll have to earn the rest by doing a super job this year. how would you react to that ? I know it would piss me off and I would leave,

 

thats a slap in the face , bassicaly the yanks made him quit so they didn't have to fire him

[Gom]

holy f*** GOM, if your work would go to you and say " well GOM I know we guaranteed you 50,000 last year but this year we're going to drop that to 35,000 , so you'll have to earn the rest by doing a super job this year. how would you react to that ? I know it would piss me off and I would leave,

 

thats a slap in the face , bassicaly the yanks made him quit so they didn't have to fire him

I wouldn't leave if my next best offer was $20,000. Would you?

 

Players take pay cuts all the time due to decreased performance. Why shouldn't everyone else?

[example1]

holy f*** GOM, if your work would go to you and say " well GOM I know we guaranteed you 50,000 last year but this year we're going to drop that to 35,000 , so you'll have to earn the rest by doing a super job this year. how would you react to that ? I know it would piss me off and I would leave,

 

thats a slap in the face , bassicaly the yanks made him quit so they didn't have to fire him

 

Gom presumably isn't in a job with a renewable contract. Most of us aren't.

 

Look folks, the Yankees appear to be doing exactly what the Red Sox have been doing the past few years with guys like Pedro and Damon. They set a value that is realistic based on managers, and were willing to hold firm if Torre rejected it. He did and they held firm.

 

The biggest problem I see is that the Yankees somehow think there is a formula to winning the World Series, when many knowledgable people in the baseball biz these days agree that it is largely a crapshoot. Getting to the playoffs is the hardest part, the rest requires a ton of luck.

 

It is remarkable to me that they are able to look a Gift Horse in the mouth.

 

As a Red Sox fan this makes me very happy. As someone who has come to appreciate and respect Torre over the years I'm disappointed. I imagine a number of the players are disappointed as well and the fall-out will be interesting.

[Gom]

You got rid of Grady Little, and the next year won with Francona. Hope the same magic applies to us next year.

[ORS]

What are you talking about? Why are you always so argumentative and confrontational? I said I was going to reserve judgement...and didnt say the Yankees honored him or anything. While yes, I believe it was a fair offer, it certainly could have been better.

 

Why don't you keep your hard on for me IN your pants and out of your mouth. I know it might be hard. but please try. I'm glad I can get you so riled up though.

Nice homoerotic imagery. It comes so natural to you. I'm guessing this is a Freudian slip.

 

FYI, you don't rile me up. I just find it funny that you are in here doing full fledged spin control after telling us how these diffucult departures "never" happen with the Yankees. And, as long as you continue to trumpet the absolute virtue of the Yankee organization, then I'll be here to remind you that the dynamics at work here are experienced by every organization, like I did a couple of years ago when you started in with that tripe about how the Sox are a low-class organization.

[VA Sox Fan]

Nice homoerotic imagery. It comes so natural to you. I'm guessing this is a Freudian slip.

 

FYI, you don't rile me up. I just find it funny that you are in here doing full fledged spin control after telling us how these diffucult departures "never" happen with the Yankees. And, as long as you continue to trumpet the absolute virtue of the Yankee organization, then I'll be here to remind you that the dynamics at work here are experienced by every organization, like I did a couple of years ago when you started in with that tripe about how the Sox are a low-class organization.

 

ORS kicks ass, as usual. f*** Joe Torre right? Please, can't wait to see who the new Manager is.. He was handed a gift when he started. FOUR WS!!!!! ZERO in the past 7 seasons. As Crunch and some others have said "He's done the least with the most"

 

Best of health to you Joe!!!!!!!!!! RETIRE!

 

The Yankees SUCK, they slapped Joe in the face. (sorry Gom)....doom and gloom for a couple of more seasons.

 

George (Stein-crapper) DO GET NOT iNVOLVED and ALL IS WELL!

 

Let's Go Red Sox!!!!!!!!!

 

Yankees SUCK, REALLY BADLY!

[Mr Crunchy]

i too would like to be insulted with 5m on the table

however

just as in real life when you break your balls and have success you expect rewards from your employers,not threats and backstabbing.

thats the best job in sports says mike lupica??

i always thought he was a f***ing idiot

 

you wont ever see a manager do 12 trips in a row to october

you may never see a manager do 12 years period

[26 to 6]

Nice homoerotic imagery. It comes so natural to you. I'm guessing this is a Freudian slip.

 

FYI, you don't rile me up. I just find it funny that you are in here doing full fledged spin control after telling us how these diffucult departures "never" happen with the Yankees. And, as long as you continue to trumpet the absolute virtue of the Yankee organization, then I'll be here to remind you that the dynamics at work here are experienced by every organization, like I did a couple of years ago when you started in with that tripe about how the Sox are a low-class organization.

Yes, but at the time there were quite a few bitter departures within the Red Sox. I said that things like that don't particularily happen like that, and in this case when they do they still manage to put out a fair offer. Not that it justifies it at all, but those Sox incidents were disastrous as I recall. A lot of things fell apart with a lot of people. Granted, I have to eat my words now because the Yankees did do someting similar to Joe, but come on it was a mess up in Boston this time of year the past few years.

 

Not that it has anything to do with the matter at hand, you just like being argumentative, especially with me. It gets you off and puts a smile on your face so have fun man. Say what you wanna say.

 

Nice to know you've been waiting for this chance though to bring all that stuff up though. Means quite a bit.

[ORS]

Yes, but at the time there were quite a few bitter departures within the Red Sox. I said that things like that don't particularily happen like that, and in this case when they do they still manage to put out a fair offer. Not that it justifies it at all, but those Sox incidents were disastrous as I recall. A lot of things fell apart with a lot of people. Granted, I have to eat my words now because the Yankees did do someting similar to Joe, but come on it was a mess up in Boston this time of year the past few years.

 

Not that it has anything to do with the matter at hand, you just like being argumentative, especially with me. It gets you off and puts a smile on your face so have fun man. Say what you wanna say.

 

Nice to know you've been waiting for this chance though to bring all that stuff up though. Means quite a bit.

Oh quit the self gratification. I'm not pining to give you yours when the time comes. Check it out numbnuts, I can't give it to you if you don't go Lazarus on us. But don't expect me to forget things, because regardless of how insignificant it is to me, I just remember s***. Deal with it.

 

And it has nothing to do with being argumentative. I just like to talk people down from the pedestal they put themselves on.

[yankees228]

I don't root passionately for the Mets. Casually' date=' yes, but certainly not passionately. I do also root casually for the Nets, Giants, and Rangers while I consider myself a fan of the Jets, Knicks, and Islanders. I live in New York. There is nothing wrong with pulling for a team from New York to do well.[/quote']

 

You're an Islanders fan but you don't mind seeing the Rangers win? I'm not trying to get on you or anything, that just kind of took me by surprise.

[TheKilo]

I have another question for my Yankee fan brethren on this board.

 

If the Yankees don't offer incentive clauses in their player contracts, why did they deem it necessary to do so for a guy who all the players love and respect?

 

All of you seriously think Torre is at fault for rejecting this offer? What a joke. And you accuse US of drinking the Kool-Aid.

[yankees228]

I have another question for my Yankee fan brethren on this board.

 

If the Yankees don't offer incentive clauses in their player contracts, why did they deem it necessary to do so for a guy who all the players love and respect?

 

All of you seriously think Torre is at fault for rejecting this offer? What a joke. And you accuse US of drinking the Kool-Aid.

 

I'm 100% behind Torre in this situation. The Yankees made this offer knowing that Torre was going to reject it.

[Gom]

I have another question for my Yankee fan brethren on this board.

 

If the Yankees don't offer incentive clauses in their player contracts, why did they deem it necessary to do so for a guy who all the players love and respect?

 

All of you seriously think Torre is at fault for rejecting this offer? What a joke. And you accuse US of drinking the Kool-Aid.

You know Kilo, it's not like they gave him something that wasn't attainable. That's what pissed me off.

 

You old timers, remember Walter Alston?

 

He won seven pennants for the Dodgers, and was the manager when they won their only Championship in 1955. You know what...he signed 23 one year deals. 23!

 

Torre was given the option to remain as the highest paid manager in baseball. He was given the opportunity to make MORE money than he had by getting to the World Series. It's not like he was offered 1 million with 6 million in incentives. His base was higher than anyone in baseball with incentives included.

 

You know, Arod/Boras wanted to negotiate in spring training for a new deal. Cashman said no, and now will probably lose Arod and he will eclipse his previous deal. Remember, Arod was coming off a down year for him and an absolutely horrible post-season. His season this year will probably net him an extra $100 million. Extra. I'm serious.

 

If Torre had won it all this year, he would have been talking about a 10 million deal rather than a 5 million one. It's the nature of baseball. You get paid more as what you've done, than what you can do in the future, especially as a manager.

 

Do I think Torre deserved a paycut? Absolutely. His team underachieved over the last three years. Over the last 6 years. He knew the deal going in. He was almost canned after last year. This coming as a surprise to him would be a surprise to me.

 

The way I look at it...they offered him a better deal than he would get anywhere else with any team. Period. He would have made more money in base salary alone than Francona would have made in two years of winning the World Series. To him, it wasn't good enough to be the highest paid. He wanted an extra year guaranteed. Truthfully, his performance as a manager over the past few seasons did not give me confidence that he warranted a guaranteed second year. He also didn't want to take a pay cut.

 

Torre is a good manager, and an unbelievably good person. He is active in causes, and brought a stability and desire to play in New York that was missing before his tenure. He will be missed. He is a poor strategist, but excellent in all other facets in managing. I will miss Joe Torre. I really will. However, I believe the Yankees made a fair offer. They went from firing him to giving him a chance to not only manage, but make more money than ever before by winning, which is the mission goal for this team. Truth is, and I am a little biased, but the Yankees are the favorites to win the division next year [if Arod comes back]. It's not like this is the Devil Rays who are putting in these incentives..it's the Yankees.

 

I think Joe made a mistake in not taking the offer. If he did not like the offer, he could have graciously said he was getting older, he wanted to spend time with his daughter [i think she's 6 or so], that he had had a good run, but it was time for him to move on. That would have been the classy Torre I knew. He turned this into a spectacle on the way out, and that was sad to me.

 

You guys don't believe the offer was fair? We do. He was to be paid more than any other, and with bonuses that would reach an extra 60% in income if certain attainable goals are met, not to mention a one year extension that would increase his salary 60% by attaining these goals. If you call that an insult, I pray to God my bosses insult me every year.

[AlexanderTheGreat13]

I have no problem with getting rid of Torre I just thought it was a little silly the way they did it. I would have prefer George hand Torre a pink slip right after Posada struck out in game 4 instead of the way it was done.

[RedSoxRooter]

The Yankees are so classless.

[a700hitter]

You know Kilo, it's not like they gave him something that wasn't attainable. That's what pissed me off.

 

You old timers, remember Walter Alston?

 

He won seven pennants for the Dodgers, and was the manager when they won their only Championship in 1955. You know what...he signed 23 one year deals. 23!

 

Torre was given the option to remain as the highest paid manager in baseball. He was given the opportunity to make MORE money than he had by getting to the World Series. It's not like he was offered 1 million with 6 million in incentives. His base was higher than anyone in baseball with incentives included.

Great point with Alston. A one year deal for a manager has never been unusual, but somehow it is an affront to Joe Torre.

 

Torre made an obscene amount of money based on the 4 Championships. Five million is still higher than any other manager and there are 6 managers that have won a Championship more recently than Torre. He hasn't won a Championship so he doesn't deserve to make $7.5 million. After all, he was nothing more than a turnkey manager. It's not like management wanted him back for the last two years, but he didn't walk away then because he wasn't wanted. He didn't walk away from the last $15 million of that deal. Somehow he is insulted by $5 million for managing? I am sorry, but as has often happens, Torre has come to believe his own press clippings and his rejection of a $5 million deal was a pure act of arrogance.

[26 to 6]

You're an Islanders fan but you don't mind seeing the Rangers win? I'm not trying to get on you or anything' date=' that just kind of took me by surprise.[/quote']

I dont really follow hockey. I'm not a serious Islanders fan or anything, just goes back to my days living on the Island. I could honestly care less. I just prefer them over the Rangers.

 

All of you seriously think Torre is at fault for rejecting this offer? What a joke. And you accuse US of drinking the Kool-Aid.

Not at all. i can understand where both sides are coming from, and I understand why Torre turned it down, but I won't go as far to say that it was a ridiculously unfair offer, because it wasn't.

[a700hitter]

Not at all. i can understand where both sides are coming from' date=' and I understand why Torre turned it down, but I won't go as far to say that it was a ridiculously unfair offer, because it wasn't.[/quote']I can't understand how he could turn down a base salary that would have him making more than 3 million more than Francona. What arrogance!

[Cocos Disciples]

LaRussa re-signed with the Cardinals for 2 years, so that takes him off the table.

 

I think it comes down to either:

 

a) Joe Girardi

Don Mattingly

distant c) Joe Torre

[TheKilo]

Buster Olney said John Farrell was a darkhorse candidate over the weekend.

[26 to 6]

That would surely be an interesting choice. Doubt it though. Who knows, we'll see.

[a700hitter]

Torre will be quite surprised when his endorsements and speaking engagements start to dry up, because he is now a non-entity that he is no longer the Yankee manager. He's nothing without the Yankees. They owed him nothing. It was the other way around. He owed it to the Yankees to go out with some dignity instead of as an ungrateful whiner. Buck Showalter, who had a much shorter but very popular stint as Yankee manager, made appearance on Seinfeld and Saturday Night Live etc. What appearances has he made since leaving the Yankees? The same will happen to the arrogant Mr. Torre.

[Mr Crunchy]

i dunno luca

the yanks werent built to succeed in october

everyone of cashmans free agents blew dead dogs

start with pavano end with igawa and all of them in between sucked

 

they were out of it and then played .700 ball down the stretch to get to the playoffs. i think

asking a 12 year veteran manager to take a pay cut is insulting(insult me all day)in the grand scheme of things,he had them there every year

this wont happen again in our lives

we wont see a team get to october 12 times in a row

 

he lost a bit of respect by whining out the door but ultimately it came down to success or lack there of in october that finally ended him

i like torre but he was a complete underachiever

[zackredsox]

Looks like Mattinglys gonna get the job.

[bobby jr]

I don't care for the Yankees and I was hoping they would keep Torre because he was becoming the Bobby Cox of the AL, always getting into the playoffs and losing. His best years as a manager were 10 years ago. Any manager in the major leagues could likely make the playoffs with that team and that payroll.

 

That being said it is amusing the way Torre threw the Yankees under the bus by rejecting their offer and walking away.