Hugh2

Sorry about the Crochet rant, this thread should be about Soto.

In my offseason roster page I picked Crochet to be on the 26 man and traded for, but the more I think about it the more I do not like him. He's never pitched more than 146 innings his entire life, now that may not mean anything, but he could be in for an injury, we have no ideal if he's the type of guy who can do 150-175 or more year in and year out. That's risky. He also said at the trade deadline he would refuse to pitch in the playoffs if traded for and not extended. That was a red flag that threw a lot of teams off. That kinds sounds a little crappy and entitled, I wouldn't mind him in Boston, but I don't think you can let a guy like that be your ace. That's why I'm back on the FA wagon.

Early I was big on Burnes, but the more I think about it and read about the free agent pitchers, the more I think Max Fried really should be the guy.

I certainly would be excited if the Sox sign Soto, and they have the room for it in their budget. My issue is, if they plan on continuing to stay under the luxury tax, they won't have room for much else and that means trading top prospects. I think you pay for a guy like Soto going $45 million plus a year because you're paying a guy the league minimum elsewhere on the roster. That's how elite teams like LA do it, even though they spend big, they have good homegrown players built around their FA superstars. I don't want the big 4 touched. I think you trade Duran with Soto on the roster and get a TOTRS, between him/Crawford/and prospects 6-10 I think you can get a lot. If the Sox were willing to return to the "hey will go above the Luxury tax for a year or two" they could still sign Soto and go out and get guys like Fried/Turner and still be in a position to reset the luxury tax in two years. If you want to do that and keep Duran, I think you can make Rafaela your super utility guy and roll with an outfield of LF SOTO CF Duran RF Anthony If that's your team, adding a pitcher and having multiple legit superstars around a growing young core, this team will be light years better next year BUT.......John Henry.

Yeah Boston has appeal, so do other towns. Do we really wanna bank on that and lose out while the top end of the FA market signs elsewhere. sox should do both. Sign an Ace and court Roki

Yeah I like it too, Pivetta is a BOTRS, Sox have plenty of that. Fried is a guy who can slide into the top of your rotation. thats exactly what the Sox need and exactly what they should do

Sasakis 24 season was a little less stellar than the last. I still think he’s going to be a stud but he ain’t a sure thing to be an ace. also. The max the Sox could give him right now is 1.03 million and there’s a ton of teams that have more money to sign him including the dodgers who can offer more than double. if he waits a few months he will have every team in baseball bidding on him, and seeing how the bidding can’t get too high it’s going to come down to appeal. It won’t be about the money as much as it will be about him going to the team he likes best. Someone like Max Fried, is a proven ace, and seeing how the Sox realistically need two good starters I think he should be priority. You can with much greater certainty get Fried over Roki if you’re willing to spend the money.

Yeah but if you get a pick back whatever, just sign a guy like Fried and upgrade the rotation. sure they have an advantage, but Pivetta doesn’t make the team any better

The more I think about it the more I say he is going to reject it. the more I think about how undervalued the pitching market gets the stronger I feel about this.

It will come down to which team can sell their organization, town and culture. It won’t be about the money

Yeah I’m pretty sick of it too, that’s why I say things like “I hope they sign xyz” which this offseason is Burnes/Fried, but he’s on the roster, so I’m going to hope he gets his head right and returns to form. I truly believe his problems are mental and I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s really good next year. But banking on him certainly wouldn’t be my first, second, third, or even fourth choice.

Man you guys are tough, I remember how badly people (myself included) were received around here by suggesting Chris Sale might pitch like an ACE again one day. And guess what..... Yeah, not saying he's Chris Sale, it's a crude analogy, I'm just not convinced he's a dud quiet yet.

No one is ignoring, Sale was bad during stretches too when he wasn't hurt, as have a lot of guys at various points in their career. You also can't ignore the fact he was a Cy Young candidate who pitched like an ACE 3 years in a row, and his 2022 was also helped out by having the WORSE defense in the league behind him. Yes you're correct, you can't ignore that, there's just another side to the equation too. It's not a crime to say a 30 year old who was once in ace may be talented and could get there again.

And I was going to take blame and say I forgot but now I get to blame you! Thank you lol. I think Pivetta most likely accepts the Q.O. and a deal is worked out. I think there's a decent chance he rejects and goes to FA. In that scenario my roster stays the same, someone gets bumped or hurt in ST.

Teel starts the year in Worcester and Jansen is resigned, can't figure out how to edit.

C: Connor Wong ($0.80M) 1B: Tristan Casas ($0.80M) 2B: David Hamilton ($0.80M) 3B: Rafael Devers ($27.07M) SS: Trevor Story ($22.50M) LF: Kristian Campbell ($0.80M) CF: Ceddanne Rafaela ($1.25M) RF: Roman Anthony ($0.80M) DH: Masataka Yoshida ($18.60M) 4th OF: Rob Refsnyder ($2.25M) Utility: Vaugh Grissom ($0.80M) Utility: Wilyer Abreu ($0.80M) Backup C: Kyle Teal ($0.80M) SP1: Max Fried ($27.00M) SP2: Tanner Houck ($4.50M) SP3: Garret Crochet ($25.00M) SP4: Brayan Bello ($2.66M) SP5: Lucas Giolito ($19.00M) RP: Liam Hendricks ($6.00M) RP: Kutter Crawford ($3.50M) RP: Garrett Whitlock ($5.50M) RP: A.J. Minter ($8.00M) RP: Michael Fulmer ($1.50M) RP: Tanner Scott ($15.00M) RP: Justin Slaten ($0.80M) RP: Brennan Bernardino ($0.80M) Payroll is 1.33% under budget

Yeah, it's not like a light switch. The marriage was likely on the rocks before the day it failed. But I can tell you from personal experience the day it happens or the day you're served those papers it's like getting hit by a truck.

Best gosh darn team money can buy because I'm always right and I know everything. Those are the facts...and the facts are undisputed. C: Connor Wong ($0.80M) 1B: Tristan Casas ($0.80M) 2B: Vaughn Grissom ($0.80M) 3B: Rafael Devers ($27.5M) SS: Trevor Story ($22.50M) LF: Kristian Campbell ($.80M) CF: Ceddanne Rafaela ($1.25M) RF: Roman Anthony ($.80M) DH: Masataka Yoshida ($18.00M) 4th OF: Rob Refsnyder ($2.25M) Utility: David Hamilton ($0.80M) Utility: Wilyer Abreu ($0.80M) Backup C: Danny Jansen ($6.50M) SP1: Tanner Houck ($4.5M) SP2: Kutter Crawford ($3.5M) SP3: Brayan Bello ($2.5M) SP4: Garrett Whitlock ($5.5M) SP5: Lucas Giolito ($19.25M) RP: Liam Hendricks ($6.0M) RP: A.J. Minter ($11M) RP: Tanner Scott ($15M) RP: Garret Crochet ($21M) RP: Max Fried ($27M) RP: Michael Fulmer ($1.5M) RP: Justin Slaten ($0.80M) RP: Brennan Bernardino ($0.80M) Payroll is 0.97% over budget

I know I know my bad....doing it now

All good points, perhaps a year off from injury just didn't get his arm right but allowed him time to get his head right as well. Guy may be pitching with a chip on his shoulder and if he's healthy given his talent that might be a good thing.

I get that, but you can literally almost draw an exact line from his marriage failing to his poor performance, perhaps it's injury related too. Maybe he was so stressed out and started throwing harder with off mechanics that he hurt his arm and they're both related. I won't discount it. Giolito is only 30 and is a guy who finished top 10 for Cy Young voting 2 times. I'm not counting on him to lead the rotation but I'm hopeful he can add value in 2025.

I firmly believe Gio's problems were mental. You can almost draw an exact line from where he fell off vs. his struggles. However, he wasn't elite before then but he was good enough to be valuable in this rotation. If true, he could be a good #3#4 starter. If the Sox can get him back to where he was then they have a solid #1 #2 starter. The injury adds another monkey wrench into the equation. Today, more than ever guys come back fine from surgery, but surgery is still surgery and you just never know. Even if we witness best case scenario with Giolito, could we count on him down the stretch when his innings are getting high?

Trade Duran for Crochet (3 team deal). Extend Crochet Sign Max Fried. Sign Tanner Scott Sign A.J. Minter Sign Danny Jansen Lineup: C: Wong 1B: Casas 2B: Hamilton SS: Story 3B: Devers LF: Campbell CF: Rafaela RF: Anthony DH/Bench: Wilyer Abreu/Rob Refsnyder/Yoshida/Jansen/Grissom Rotation: Max Fried Garret Crochet Tanner Houck Bryan Bello Lucas Giolito Kutter Crawford Bullpen: Tanner Scott Liam Hendriks Garret Whitlock Justin Slaten A.J. Minter Michael Fulmer Brennan Bernardino ADDITIONS: (including rookies and Sox Debuts) Michael Fulmer/A.J. Minter/Liam Hendriks/Tanner Scott/Lucas Giolito/Garret Crochet/Max Fried/Roman Anthony/Kristian Campbell EDIT: OMG I can't believe I forgot about Abreu. I have removed RGON and added Wilyer back in.

It's perfectly plausible that Giolito comes back strong, pitches like a #2 Story is healhty and we have a healthy step forward from many of our young guys and this team is a playoff caliber team. Perfectly plausible. If they actually added a few premium arms I think they can guarantee that and if they spend the money AND get improved performance they could be WS caliber.

We will find out soon enough what Juan Soto is worth.