moonslav59

The worst quick pivot was after he said we'd never sign anyone good, and we signed Suarez, and he was back to the same rant like 3 minutes after, saying, "Golly gee, that surprised me." (just razzin' ya Fred. You know I'm okay with pessimistic fans. I was one for decades.)

Yup, and not Bregman as a plan C.

Still can't answer a simple question. and, we don't know exactly what happened, except we lost out on a close negotiation by a team that offered more money, a no trade clause and maybe less deferred money. Maybe it was only closer than we think because Berggie wanted Boston. Nobody knows, so let's stop the pretending based on a few talking heads all jacked up about losing another first prize star.

You are assuming they did not have Suarez high on their list. I admit, after getting Gray and Oviedo, it looked like a frantic pivot. The point about Alonso signing before Breggie might have messed up our order of thinking, but one hopes that was one of the contingencies. If these guys are continually messing up, then sure, it's a major issue, but when I keep hearing their best offer was far short (not on Breggie but others) I'm thinking it's not messing up the strategy of negotiations its messing up knowing the market and wasting time on players you actually thought you might get but are in la-la land or something. Then, I think maybe its just going through the motions so the fans think you are really trying to get good players, but these bad, bad super looney owners are ruining the game by offering the world to marginal stars. Eventually, I accept I don't know jack about what the hell is going on in baseball negotiations by anyone, including the Sox. I think we did pretty good, this winter, except for the one missing piece. I went in hoping we went full quality over quantity, even if it meant just two mega adds, 3 at most. We've added 4 but missed the two biggest goals: big RHB and 3B/2B. That part is not good, at all, but there are many ways to build a winning team, and while I prefer filling biggest need areas first and as best u can, we added 3 really good players plus Oviedo. Last year, we added 3 kinda biggies: Bregman, Buehler & Chapman, and one of em burned us badly. Then, we dumped Devers but got lucky with Gio. Baseball is a strange game to figure out, and I'm not sure figuring out front offices is any easier.

This really getting silly. Nobody knows exactly what happened. Even if some missteps or misguesses were made, isn't that kinda the nature of negotiations when multiple entities are involved.

It's not often we mostly agree on one thing. This could be it.

Exactly. Setting a criteria like that is not well thought out. Lets trade for Altuve- NOT IP!!!

Bregman would have been enough? Being career .820+? I would not be one bit surprised if IP outhits Bregman year 1 of Breggie's deal.

I think your idea of mediocre is pretty stringent, as you called Gray a #4. I do agree that we settle for less than good enough, too often. I think we've stepped it up the last 2 winters, but not by enough, and we swung and missed on Buehler at $21M. Had he pitched like a $21M guy, maybe we finish with a much better record. I get the point about how high AAV on short term deals isn't going to get you the talent a $21M x 6 years gets you, let alone a $28M x 6 year might get. The odds go up on a swing and miss when you go one and done, so often. We did step it up to 2 years with Gio, and he did his best to make it a one and done. LOL

So, Paredes doesn't count. (He's over 50 points below .820, career and 30 below over the last 3 seasons combined. He was 10 below in '25. Since 2016, these are the only 2B and 3Bmen above .820: .879 Ramirez .862 Altuve... LOL .855 Devers .854 Arenado... LOL .846 Bregman (I doubt he hits .820 over this contract) .835 Machado .833 Muncy .827 KMarte .826 Riley

If we dont add an infielder, I'm assuming Mayer is at 3B FT and DHam/Romy platoon at 2B. It would look like this: C: Narvaez/Wong 1B: Contreras 2B: DHam/Romy SS: Story 3B: Mayer LF: Anthony (some RF) CF: Rafaela RF: Abreu DH: Duran (some LF & CF) with Masa/Casas/Romy as secondary options with Paredes minus an OF'er: C: Narvaez/Wong 1B: Contreras 2B: Mayer/Romy SS: Story 3B: Paredes LF: Anthony or Duran CF: Rafaela RF: Anthony or Abreu DH: Masa/Casas/Romy as secondary options ___________________________ That's if we don't play Rafaela at 2B.

Well, "the process" involves watching suspects become superstars, but you poo-poo that idea. Can you for just once answer what you think? Did Brez botch the negotiations? Iy yes, do you think Breggie signs with the Sox if Brez does everything right but can't offer the no trade clause or even match the Cubs numbers?

That could very well be true, and also the next step. They felt they made a competitive offer to Breggie, and for once, I agree that they did, and when they were outbid and beat by a no trade clause, they knew they were not taken out of the Suarez bidding, since it was lower.

Ive never argued against the need to go large and long on the right players. I thought Alonso fit the need, until we got Contreras, of course. To me, Suarez just barely meets the requirement of "large" or "long" and some players make 3-4 times what he got and 2-4+ years more, but it was a significant signing. I'm not happy with just one year deals, but Contreras has 2 years plus a team option for year 3, so you missed that. We have locked up 4 young players for long term, when we used to have zero to one, at any given time. That is a positive shift in one area. I'm with you on hoping we start paying what it takes to get the best of the best, which normally means large and long.

With no trades, I see Duran at DH nearly FT. The other OF'ers are just too much better to have any sort of rotation beyond just norm rest time at DH. I don't think Cora plans on platooning Abreu and he never has with Duran, except maybe year one. Maybe Romy could DH vs LHPs, but we'd need him at 2B (unless Rafaela is there.) I'm against the idea of Rafaela at 2B for any time, except as an emergency, but that is one way to play Masa more at DH. I'm not sure I'm even saying those words. Why am I moving a GG CF'er off position so Masa can DH not Duran/Romy/Casas/Campbell.

What does "back down" mean? He didn't go higher than his top offer? Sorry, I'm just not sure he "botched" anything. Even if he misread the room and didn't believe the Cubs offer was that high: so what? It doesn't matter if he was never going to go higher and give the no trade clause. That's not to say I'm not concerned, if Brez is continuously "misreading the room," but negotiations often take turns like this. The Cubs aren't going to tell the Sox what their offer was, and if they do, they could be lying.

I've been searching and re-searching any and almost all options. If it's a defensive guy, I'd hope he's on the young side with some O potential, but that will be costly. We can't afford to offer Mayer for an infielder, because we'd still be one short. K Campbell has too much serious upside to sell low, now. Plus, I'm not sure he brings us a solid infielder. (I doubt HOU gives us Paredes for KC and Sandlin.) Duran for a young infielder has to be to a contending team not in need os said young infielder. Who is that? The 4 years of control on Abreu makes him more attractive to all teams- win now and those looking 1-3 years down the road. That seems like Houston, but I'm not sure the Paredes value is close enough to swap for Abreu. I'd probably do it, if they added King and maybe for Sousa or Janek. One year of Abreu thrown in doesn't quite get me to yes, but then I think: for 2 years we'd have a better line-up with Paredes over Abreu, since whoever replaces Abreu looks just as good, so there is little drop off, except on D. Lastly, I consider Tolle or Early, and I recoil at the idea of trading one, but it seems like as long as they are options, other teams don't want Crawford, Sadnoval, Harrison and maybe even Bello. (I'm not sure Bello for Paredes is fair, either, but again, we'd be better with Paredes and they guy who replaces Bello than DHam/Romy at 2B.) I'm at a loss on who we can get. I've made a few suggestions, and maybe one comes true. I do think we certainly need one more guy.

You are the guy that always says the final result is all that matters. Does the result or process matter to you? You didn't want Breggie at that price, and neither did I, but now, for some reason, the results are not what matters, and you seemingly are going along for the Brez roast ride. Would you be happier if Brez did not botch the talks and we got Breggie for $180M? (Still waiting for the answer from the last question I presented 3 times.)

Could very well be. I've never claimed Brez botched or didn't botch it. They have their opinions and supposedly some facts. They could be right. My position is I don't know, and I'm glad Brez didn't offer more. I like the results, even if the process was messed up (or not.)

Yup. Because the Cubs offered more, Brez misread the market? The Cubs offered more. Whether Brez thought they did or not doesn't matter, if $165M was all he'd ever offer, not to mention no trade clauses and...

I'm pretty comfortable thinking JH & the rest of the top brass determined the no trade thing and set some sort of short and long term budget guideline that takes approval, if a GM intends to stray too far from the blueprint. Maybe Brez had some budget space to offer Bregman more, and it wasn't JH giving a firm "No." Maybe JH said, "okay, but X amount needs to be deferred." Maybe it was all Brez's call. I'm not it matters much. We didn't grossly overpay for a 32 year old player, and we somewhat overpaid for a 30 year pitcher, instead. I have no issues with the results: I'm glad we got Suarez.

I suggested that? When? Where?

It's really... 3B Paredes & DH Masa/Romy/Casas vs RF Abreu & DHam/Romy at 2B (No Masas at DH, as Duran DHs)

Do you think, if not trade is made, Masa DHs over Duran? The only way Masa starts over Duran is if an OF'er is hurt or Rafaela is at 2B.

When you think about it, that one major "sidetrack" is the difference maker. We may not have gotten Contreras, had we still had Devers and he was okay w 1B. 1. L Anthony LF 2. L Devers 3B 3 R Contreras 1B 4. L Dura DH 5. R Story SS 6. L Abreu RF 7. R Narvaez C 8. L Mayer/ R Romy 2B 9. R Rafaela CF