Red Sox sign Alex Bregman

[Bellhorn04]

1 minute ago, Old Red said:

I don’t know if Brez came up with that, or Sam?

I can't say it's anything special.  I've heard it used here plenty LOL

[Bellhorn04]

Unfortunately, Roster Destruction, AKA injuries, often has a big say in these decisions, too.

[moonslav59]

21 minutes ago, notin said:

Does this deal do anything except make the Sox more expensive?

It depletes both offensive depth and pitching depth.  The Sox get what else?  They get to bump their fifth starter (Giolito?) to the bullpen at the cost  of three starting pitchers on the 40man roster,  all to do what? Force Cora to employ a defensive lineup he already has?

I still see Castillo as a solid #2 type SP'er, so it is more than a bump of our #5 SP'er. I see Bello as a 3/4, Gio as a 4/5 with possibilities of sucking, and Crawford as a 4/5/6.

The only reason Castillo would not be our #2 is because we have Crochet and Houck. 

I guess I like him a lot more than you do. I realize the age issue and added money would put us clearly over the first tax line, but I think getting value for Yoshida is worth adding Crawford and Fitts/Priester. We'd still have Giolito (unless we go with a 6 man rotation) Criswell, Fitts or Priester, Dobbins and Fulmer as depth behind:

1. Crochet

2. Houck

3. Castillo

4. Buehler

5. Bello

6. Giolito, 7. Criswell, 8. Fitts or Priester, 9. Dobbins, 10. Fulmer

I still see our starter depth as being better than 25-28 teams, even by trading 2 SP'ers for 1.

I'd rather see us trade for a catcher or closer, but I'm not against upgrading the top of our rotation, either. I see Castillo as top of rotation (1 or 2) and not middle, just because he'd be slotted as our #3.

[notin]

26 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

I'm sure I'll get sick of hearing Roster Construction, but it does beat Bridge Year or Full Throttle, I guess. 

Bridge Year?  After Chicken Gate, most fabricated scandal ever.

 

Full Throttle was a blatant lie that actually looked worse when Werner tried to explain it.

 

Roster Construction is an old term Thats been used for decades.  Dont get worked up about one press conference…

[moonslav59]

Out of 146 SP'ers with 210+ IP since 2022, Luis Castillo places....

20th in fWAR (9.4, just behind Fried, Gilbert and Strider) Solid #1 number.

37th in ERA- at 85 (near Glasnow, Cease, Strider) Solid #2

39th in FIP 3.63 (making him a solid #2 here)

28th in K-BB% at 19.3% (near Burnes, Cease and Gallen) #1 number.

He's been a solid 1/2 for 3 years. He may be slipping due to age, but he's still a solid #2, in my book.

Anyway, the trade is not happening, and I'd rather trade for an area of need and not to upgrade an already plus rotation. I think we should look for a major upgrade at catcher, especially since we just traded Teel. A closer would be nice, but I doubt we trade for one.

 

 

[moonslav59]

12 minutes ago, notin said:

Bridge Year?  After Chicken Gate, most fabricated scandal ever.

 

Full Throttle was a blatant lie that actually looked worse when Werner tried to explain it.

 

Roster Construction is an old term Thats been used for decades.  Dont get worked up about one press conference…

We can't believe anything these guys say, and even trying to read between the lines gets too complex.

These guys think they have built a playoff contender while keeping the strong farm mostly intact. I have to admit, we do look way better, now than before 2023 and 2024.

Good enough? Hard to say. I think we are good enough to make the playoffs, but most services say no or too close to call. I'd like to see us make one more major trade, but I seriously doubt we do. We do have some areas of depth strength we coudl trade from and some duplicated values, here and there, but having depth is a value, too.

To me, if we could add a Sean Murphy, William Contreras, Mason Miller or even a one and done Helsley, we'd be clear playoff faves and maybe even a top 2-3 AL ranked team. (Not happening, sadly.)

[moonslav59]

To me, the news that no decisions have been made on where Bregman will play was almost as meaningful as the Bregman signing, itself.

I just don't see a $40M value for Bregman at 2B.

We are a way better team with Bregman at 3B, Devers at 1B/DH and Campbell or DHam-Romy at 2B.

By the middle or end of the season, we could see this:

1. L Duran LF/CF

2. R Bregman 3B

3. L Casas DH/1B

4. L Devers 1B/DH

5. R Campbell 2B

6. L Abreu RF/R Refsnyder LF

7. R Story SS

8. L Anthony CF/RF

9. R Wong or Narvaez C

Bench: Rafaela, Narvaez, Ref or Abreu, DHam or Romy

I'm not sure how anyone can view this line-up as average or worse. I also think this defense moves us from 29th or 30th to near 15th, assuming health for Story, Bregman, Duran, Abreu and a few others. (Rafaela provides late inning defense, too.)

[notin]

23 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

We can't believe anything these guys say, and even trying to read between the lines gets too complex.

These guys think they have built a playoff contender while keeping the strong farm mostly intact. I have to admit, we do look way better, now than before 2023 and 2024.

Good enough? Hard to say. I think we are good enough to make the playoffs, but most services say no or too close to call. I'd like to see us make one more major trade, but I seriously doubt we do. We do have some areas of depth strength we coudl trade from and some duplicated values, here and there, but having depth is a value, too.

To me, if we could add a Sean Murphy, William Contreras, Mason Miller or even a one and done Helsley, we'd be clear playoff faves and maybe even a top 2-3 AL ranked team. (Not happening, sadly.)

Outside of maybe Murphy, I’m not sure any of those players are available.

 

In any event, it looks like any future moves this spring will be dictated by how many players get moved to the 60 day IL.  Sandoval was already moved to accommodate Bregman..  Variuos sources around the internet will speculate about Murphy, Perales, Whitlock, and/or Giolito being added.  I do think first two promotions go to Fulmer and K. Campbell, assuming he hits.  Beyond that, anyone’s guess…

[Old Red]

37 minutes ago, notin said:

Bridge Year?  After Chicken Gate, most fabricated scandal ever.

 

Full Throttle was a blatant lie that actually looked worse when Werner tried to explain it.

 

Roster Construction is an old term Thats been used for decades.  Dont get worked up about one press conference…

I didn’t know anybody was worked up about the press conference. It was just said more than once that the roster construction would determine who plays where. Sounds pretty self explanatory to me. Transparent as transparent can be.

[notin]

Just now, Old Red said:

I didn’t know anybody was worked up about the press conference. It was just said more than once that the roster construction would determine who plays where. Sounds pretty self explanatory to me. Transparent as transparent can be.

It didn’t sound like anything new…

[Old Red]

On 2/13/2025 at 11:50 AM, FredLynn said:

Bregman is a huge upgrade defensively at 3B. Devers belongs at 1B/DH. Too bad if he doesn't like it.

The only thing new to me if only for a second was Boras with a Red Sox hat on his head.

[Old Red]

24 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

To me, the news that no decisions have been made on where Bregman will play was almost as meaningful as the Bregman signing, itself.

I just don't see a $40M value for Bregman at 2B.

We are a way better team with Bregman at 3B, Devers at 1B/DH and Campbell or DHam-Romy at 2B.

By the middle or end of the season, we could see this:

1. L Duran LF/CF

2. R Bregman 3B

3. L Casas DH/1B

4. L Devers 1B/DH

5. R Campbell 2B

6. L Abreu RF/R Refsnyder LF

7. R Story SS

8. L Anthony CF/RF

9. R Wong or Narvaez C

Bench: Rafaela, Narvaez, Ref or Abreu, DHam or Romy

I'm not sure how anyone can view this line-up as average or worse. I also think this defense moves us from 29th or 30th to near 15th, assuming health for Story, Bregman, Duran, Abreu and a few others. (Rafaela provides late inning defense, too.)

I don’t think what was said today, or wasn’t said today means anything more, or anything less than what Cora said the other day that Raffy was the 3B.

[moonslav59]

28 minutes ago, notin said:

Outside of maybe Murphy, I’m not sure any of those players are available.

 

In any event, it looks like any future moves this spring will be dictated by how many players get moved to the 60 day IL.  Sandoval was already moved to accommodate Bregman..  Variuos sources around the internet will speculate about Murphy, Perales, Whitlock, and/or Giolito being added.  I do think first two promotions go to Fulmer and K. Campbell, assuming he hits.  Beyond that, anyone’s guess…

Agreed, most of the players I mentioned are not on the block, and we'd have to blow that team away with an offer to convince them to trade.

I doubt Gio and Whitlock will go to the 60. Gio is supposed to be ready in february and Whitlock in March, maybe early April.

Perales and Murphy are sure bets. We would also likely ship 2-3 forty man roster players for Mason. I doubt ATL wants 2-3, as their roster is set and deep. They might take one plus Mayer and another prospect for Murphy.

These trades I am suggesting are super longshots. I realize that, but to me, the window is open, now, so max it out.

We can hold off adding Fulmer, until we need him on the 26. We may wait to add one or two to the 60, until we get a better idea where our top needs are, and in case of injuries, like Crawford or Bello's.

The Campbell decision may have already been made, but they are waiting to do it, until all the information is in. A couple key injuries could prolong the chocie to promote him or Anthony (or Fulmer.)

We have some nice chocies to make, ahead of us.

[moonslav59]

Just now, moonslav59 said:

 

18 minutes ago, Old Red said:

I don’t think what was said today, or wasn’t said today means anything more, or anything less than what Cora said the other day that Raffy was the 3B.

We all realize words have different meanings to some vs others, but it seemed pretty clear to me that no choice has been made, yet.

“We’ll talk about that later on,” Cora said when asked where Bregman will play, as relayed by Cotillo. “Right now, there’s a lot of stuff going on as far as we’re going to be roster-wise. We’ll make the decision when we have to make it… He’s a Gold Glove third baseman. He hasn’t played second base in the big leagues. I do believe he can be a Gold Glove second baseman, too. There’s other stuff that comes into play as far as roster construction and what’s better for the team and what can be the best lineup.”

 

[Old Red]

16 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

 

I watched in real time, and I think just, because something hasn’t been announced doesn’t mean a decision hasn’t been made.

[moonslav59]

4 minutes ago, Old Red said:

I watched in real time, and I think just, because something hasn’t been announced doesn’t mean a decision hasn’t been made.

Maybe it has, but clearly the language has changed.

Saying, "We'll talk about it later," sounds like no decision has been made, and earlier, Cora sounded more like Devers was the starting 3Bman.

A few weeks ago, Cora said, "Raffy Devers is our third baseman. Alex was a GG at 3B and we all know that, [but]... he needed to play 3B. I always envisioned Alex as a GG second baseman. His size, the way he moves--it felt kind of like- you will be a second baseman."

Cora has also sais, "I guarantee" I have not had any conversations with Devers over moving "off 3B. I don't know where that comes from."

Everyone is free to interpret what Cora says, but to me, he sounds more open to the idea of moving Devers, now, than he did before.

Nobody knows what the ultimate choice will be, and it might all depend on how Campbell looks, this spring.

The tell-tale sign will be, if we see Devers with a 1Bman's mitt, this spring, although, he could be moved to DH and have nothing to do with 1B.

I'm keeping an open mind, but I clearly have a strong opinion on where Bregman should play, regardless of Campbell's situation.

[harmony]

3 hours ago, Old Red said:

BTV doesn’t have a clue what Seattle would do. How many teams out there would want the Kut Man over Casas?

FWIW the ZiPS three-year WAR projections give Triston Casas 1.5, 1.5 and 1.7 WAR while giving Kutter Crawford 1.6, 1.8 and 1.5 WAR:

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/triston-casas/22514/stats?position=1B#zips-3-year-projections

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/kutter-crawford/20531/stats?position=P#zips-3-year-projections

Fenway Park (and the AL East) enhance hitters' traditional stats and suppressed pitchers' traditional stats.

[Old Red]

8 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Maybe it has, but clearly the language has changed.

Saying, "We'll talk about it later," sounds like no decision has been made, and earlier, Cora sounded more like Devers was the starting 3Bman.

A few weeks ago, Cora said, "Raffy Devers is our third baseman. Alex was a GG at 3B and we all know that, [but]... he needed to play 3B. I always envisioned Alex as a GG second baseman. His size, the way he moves--it felt kind of like- you will be a second baseman."

Cora has also sais, "I guarantee" I have not had any conversations with Devers over moving "off 3B. I don't know where that comes from."

Everyone is free to interpret what Cora says, but to me, he sounds more open to the idea of moving Devers, now, than he did before.

Nobody knows what the ultimate choice will be, and it might all depend on how Campbell looks, this spring.

The tell-tale sign will be, if we see Devers with a 1Bman's mitt, this spring, although, he could be moved to DH and have nothing to do with 1B.

I'm keeping an open mind, but I clearly have a strong opinion on where Bregman should play, regardless of Campbell's situation.

R O S T E R C O N S T R U C T I O N.🤫

[harmony]

2 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

The Castro part was suggested as being changed to Fitts or Priester.

Nobody knows if SEA likes Crawford or Fitts/Priester, but maybe Crawford's HR issues would be hidden in SEA.

Do you really view Castillo as "sideways to Crawford?"

Even if you do, doesn't adding Yoshida without his nearly full cost being paid as being reasonable?

Seattle podcasters have speculated that the Mariners like Kutter Crawford because T-Mobile Park would mask some of Cutter's shortcomings.

As an aside, Crawford tossed five shutout innings in each of the last two Red Sox games this poster attended in Seattle:

https://www.mlb.com/gameday/red-sox-vs-mariners/2022/06/12/662127/final/box

https://www.mlb.com/gameday/red-sox-vs-mariners/2023/08/02/717161/final/box

 

[moonslav59]

12 minutes ago, Old Red said:

R O S T E R C O N S T R U C T I O N.🤫

Okay.

The best roster construction has Bregman at 3B, Campbell or DHam-Romy at 1B and Devers and Casas on a pair-share at 1B/DH. Isn't this also "roster construction?"

Adding Bregman was constructive and is most constructive when he plays 3B, because he helps construct a better defensive team without hurting the offense construction, as it means Campbell or DHam-Romy play, instead of Rafaela (or Yoshida, if we sit our $18M man.)

Sounds like optimizing roster construction, to me. Thanks for the assistance in making my point.

🤣

[moonslav59]

3 minutes ago, harmony said:

Seattle podcasters have speculated that the Mariners like Kutter Crawford because T-Mobile Park would mask some of Cutter's shortcomings.

As an aside, Crawford tossed five shutout innings in each of the last two Red Sox games this poster attended in Seattle:

https://www.mlb.com/gameday/red-sox-vs-mariners/2022/06/12/662127/final/box

https://www.mlb.com/gameday/red-sox-vs-mariners/2023/08/02/717161/final/box

 

I acn certainly see Crawford's numbers improving with SEA. Maybe Casillo's decline by the move to BOS. Maybe not.

To me, the big gain for BOS is minimizing the cost of dumping Yoshida by getting a better player than Crawford in return. Is Castillo worth the added budget money? I'm not sure.

If some reports are correct, adding Castillo would put us over the tax line, when we are just under it, now. That may hurt future plans on spending in '26 and beyond.

Again, I'd rather trade Crawford and others for a catcher or lockdown closer than another SP'er, but I think the upgrade to Castillo is worth it. I also think Yoshia's slot on the 40 would be improved upon by adding Campbell or Anthony. (notin is right in pointing out, we can option Yoshida and add them anyway, but we'd still be paying Yoshida, not Castillo.)

[moonslav59]

How open is ATL to trading Murphy. They will not hand him away.

How much they like Story or Mayer is likely the main stumbling block or an impetuous to make the deal. Who else might be part of the deal could be the no or go aspect of a possible trade. They may not want 2 players from the 40, unless we take a second player from theirs, so maybe Cespedes, Bleis, Sandlin or Arias might be needed to complete a deal.

Story, Cespedes & Mullins for Murphy?

Mayer, Cespedes & Mullins for Murphy and some cash?

I think BTV has Murphy with a plus value of about 3, so giving up Mayer would be a gross overpay, by himself. We could ask for more.

Story is underwater, so maybe we'd have to include money or better prospects to get Murphy.

[Old Red]

38 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Okay.

The best roster construction has Bregman at 3B, Campbell or DHam-Romy at 1B and Devers and Casas on a pair-share at 1B/DH. Isn't this also "roster construction?"

Adding Bregman was constructive and is most constructive when he plays 3B, because he helps construct a better defensive team without hurting the offense construction, as it means Campbell or DHam-Romy play, instead of Rafaela (or Yoshida, if we sit our $18M man.)

Sounds like optimizing roster construction, to me. Thanks for the assistance in making my point.

🤣

One thing you should have learned long ago is how you see things, and how the Red Sox see things, and what they do about it is usually the opposite of what you predict, suggests, or anything else you want to call it. I’ll just wait, and see what happens . I’m pretty sure when the brain trust of the Red Sox say roster construction it has a different meaning as how you see it, It always has, but who knows you may actually turn out to be right this time, but either way I’m not going to lose any sleep, or pop the champagne cork waiting to find out. I’m just gonna wait.

[dgalehouse]

After a thorough and painstaking review of reams of data and all available metrics, I have concluded that it all comes down to this:  " Roster construction ".  Enjoy the games with this in mind. 

[moonslav59]

31 minutes ago, Old Red said:

One thing you should have learned long ago is how you see things, and how the Red Sox see things, and what they do about it is usually the opposite of what you predict, suggests, or anything else you want to call it. I’ll just wait, and see what happens . I’m pretty sure when the brain trust of the Red Sox say roster construction it has a different meaning as how you see it, It always has, but who knows you may actually turn out to be right this time, but either way I’m not going to lose any sleep, or pop the champagne cork waiting to find out. I’m just gonna wait.

Stop with the condescending talk.

"Should have learned." I know full well I see things differently than Cora, Brez and other posters. We all do. It's not something I "need to learn."

If you, Cora, Brez and others think Bregman at 2B and Devers at 3B is better, I think you are wrong.

I don't need to "learn" my opinion often varies from others, and BTW, I agree with the vast majority of moves Brez has made and have praised him, often. I'm also a big fan of Cora, and have repeatedly said he knows way more than I do.

We all tend to discuss things we disagree with, more often.

On the "roster construction" issue, I have said "nobody knows." It's no me pretending to know Cora's decision, beforehand. That was another poster. I just gave my opinion and said we don't know.

My point was that the talk seems to indicate the choice is still not made vs the earlier hints that Breg was likely to play 2B and Devers 3B. This is not about anything but that,

[Old Red]

51 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Stop with the condescending talk.

"Should have learned." I know full well I see things differently than Cora, Brez and other posters. We all do. It's not something I "need to learn."

If you, Cora, Brez and others think Bregman at 2B and Devers at 3B is better, I think you are wrong.

I don't need to "learn" my opinion often varies from others, and BTW, I agree with the vast majority of moves Brez has made and have praised him, often. I'm also a big fan of Cora, and have repeatedly said he knows way more than I do.

We all tend to discuss things we disagree with, more often.

On the "roster construction" issue, I have said "nobody knows." It's no me pretending to know Cora's decision, beforehand. That was another poster. I just gave my opinion and said we don't know.

My point was that the talk seems to indicate the choice is still not made vs the earlier hints that Breg was likely to play 2B and Devers 3B. This is not about anything but that,

I can’t speak for Brez, or Cora, but I’ve NEVER said that I thought Bregman at 2B, and Devers at 3B is better, so that is fake news, so it’s kind of hard to be wrong on that. The only thing I have said is that as the roster stands today without any additions, or subtractions I thought Bregman would be the 2B, because that’s what I think the Red Sox will do. Once again what the Red Sox will do. Not what I would do. Of course I’m not honed in on every word to try, and fathom the meaning of what the Red Sox will do either. I didn’t hear anything at the press conference today that I didn’t expect to hear, and was I looking for anything.

[moonslav59]

5 minutes ago, Old Red said:

I can’t speak for Brez, or Cora, but I’ve NEVER said that I thought Bregman at 2B, and Devers at 3B is better, so that is fake news, so it’s kind of hard to be wrong on that.

I said "IF you and others think Bregman is better at 2B and Devers at 3B, I think you are wrong.," not that you said or think it.

The "if" makes it no "news" at all, lat alone "fake news."

You do seem more against the idea of a DHam-Romy platoon at 2B, so it seems to me, you'd be more okay with Breg at 2B than some of us, but feel free to correct that assumption.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

AC said AB already tried helping out KC the first day. 

Don't trust WAR projections; how does fangraphs factor in Bregman's leadership intangibles?

Plus, what other free agent signed by Boston or anyone else had a dad who sat on Ted Williams' lap?

The front office recruited reinforcements this winter to hopefully reverse negative positions from last year (according to bb-ref's Wins Above Average By Position), including 2B at -1.5 and C -0.5.

It looks like the Red Sox will be counting on healthier seasons to address 1B -2.0 and DH -0.3.

Our worst position -- which was almost twice as bad as any other -- was the bullpen at -3.9... so we signed Chapman? 

[harmony]

3 hours ago, harmony said:

FWIW the ZiPS three-year WAR projections give Triston Casas 1.5, 1.5 and 1.7 WAR while giving Kutter Crawford 1.6, 1.8 and 1.5 WAR:

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/triston-casas/22514/stats?position=1B#zips-3-year-projections

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/kutter-crawford/20531/stats?position=P#zips-3-year-projections

Fenway Park (and the AL East) enhance hitters' traditional stats and suppressed pitchers' traditional stats.

The ZiPS three-year WAR projections for Triston Casas are curious: 1.5 in 2025, 1.5 in 2026 and 1.7 in  2027.

Compare the ZiPS three-year WAR projections for Vaughn Grissom (1.7,1.5,1.5), Richard Fitts (1.2,1.3,1.5) and Quinn Priester (1.5,1.5,1.6).

Other projections are more bullish on Casas in 2025:

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/triston-casas/22514/stats?position=1B#dashboard

[FredLynn]

3 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Stop with the condescending talk.

"Should have learned." I know full well I see things differently than Cora, Brez and other posters. We all do. It's not something I "need to learn."

If you, Cora, Brez and others think Bregman at 2B and Devers at 3B is better, I think you are wrong.

I don't need to "learn" my opinion often varies from others, and BTW, I agree with the vast majority of moves Brez has made and have praised him, often. I'm also a big fan of Cora, and have repeatedly said he knows way more than I do.

We all tend to discuss things we disagree with, more often.

On the "roster construction" issue, I have said "nobody knows." It's no me pretending to know Cora's decision, beforehand. That was another poster. I just gave my opinion and said we don't know.

My point was that the talk seems to indicate the choice is still not made vs the earlier hints that Breg was likely to play 2B and Devers 3B. This is not about anything but that,

The only thing that might keep Bregman off 3B is a tantrum by Devers. Hopefully it won't come to that. We are a better team with Bregman at 3B and Devers at 1B/DH. I think thats pretty much indisputable.