7/12 vs Royals

[mvp 78]

TBD vs Ragans

 

Criswell is scheduled to go for WOO tonight, is he called up instead? Bullpen game?

[Old Red]

TBD vs Ragans

 

Criswell is scheduled to go for WOO tonight, is he called up instead? Bullpen game?

 

The fact that this question has to be even asked is pretty ridiculous IMO. The Red Sox on July 12 are in a pennant race still early, or not, and are facing a team they are fighting for a postseason spot with. If Criswell comes up someone will have to be sent down. BIG deal! Wink got sent down to get stretched out as a starter, and he comes back up, and gets 1 start. I like Wink in the BP anyway, but WTF?

[notin]

That the Sox still only have 4 starting pitchers at this point and don’t have a bunch on the injured list makes me think starting pitcher should be their second priority at the deadline. Along with being the first…

[Old Red]

That the Sox still only have 4 starting pitchers at this point and don’t have a bunch on the injured list makes me think starting pitcher should be their second priority at the deadline. Along with being the first…

 

2 would be great, but even settling for 1 may be a big ask.

[mvp 78]

The fact that this question has to be even asked is pretty ridiculous IMO. The Red Sox on July 12 are in a pennant race still early, or not, and are facing a team they are fighting for a postseason spot with. If Criswell comes up someone will have to be sent down. BIG deal! Wink got sent down to get stretched out as a starter, and he comes back up, and gets 1 start. I like Wink in the BP anyway, but WTF?

 

Winckowski is not a starter. I don't mind him being stretched out a little, but I don't want him throwing more than 3 innings out of the pen. They were fooling themselves if they thought he'd actually become a starter.

 

He wasn't sent down to be stretched out, he was sent down because he wasn't following Bailey's plan.

[mvp 78]

That the Sox still only have 4 starting pitchers at this point and don’t have a bunch on the injured list makes me think starting pitcher should be their second priority at the deadline. Along with being the first…

 

Giolito

Whitlock

[notin]

Giolito

Whitlock

 

Yeah there was time to replace Giolito. That they didn’t activate Whitlock getting hurt is unfathomable to me. Get another SP ASAP…

[notin]

2 would be great, but even settling for 1 may be a big ask.

 

If Breslow doesn’t get one, then he should sell…

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

If Breslow doesn’t get one, then he should sell…

 

Give him a break! Don't you get how hard it is to pick a lane when you're going full idle?

 

... unless coasting downhill.

[mvp 78]

If Breslow doesn’t get one, then he should sell…

 

The rumor was that he was looking for a veteran starting pitcher. No idea what spot in the rotation that would be for or what he's willing to give up. Sammy stated that FSG is willing to SPEND for any player if the deal was right.

 

I won't believe it until I see it though.

[Old Red]

The rumor was that he was looking for a veteran starting pitcher. No idea what spot in the rotation that would be for or what he's willing to give up. Sammy stated that FSG is willing to SPEND for any player if the deal was right.

 

I won't believe it until I see it though.

 

I think most are still in the I’ll believe it when I see it camp despite the Sam Speak, and the Breslow jargon, and his I’ll pick a lane statement.

[mvp 78]

I think most are still in the I’ll believe it when I see it camp despite the Sam Speak, and the Breslow jargon, and his I’ll pick a lane statement.

 

I trust Breslow is doing due diligence to find moves to make this team better. Whether he has enough $$$ from Henry to make the moves, we don't know.

 

I disregard whatever Sam Wormtongue says now. It'd be nice to be able to like a local guy like that, but miss me with his ******** act.

[Dipre]

I think the Henry issue with money's a bit overblown at this point. Bloom's problem the past couple deadlines had more to do with his own indecision than aversion to spending money, if everything that has come out about him from outside parties is to be believed.

[mvp 78]

I think the Henry issue with money's a bit overblown at this point. Bloom's problem the past couple deadlines had more to do with his own indecision than aversion to spending money, if everything that has come out about him from outside parties is to be believed.

 

Oh, it was totally a good decision to let Mookie walk. That definitely didn't put this team on a downward spiral or anything.

[notin]

The rumor was that he was looking for a veteran starting pitcher. No idea what spot in the rotation that would be for or what he's willing to give up. Sammy stated that FSG is willing to SPEND for any player if the deal was right.

 

I won't believe it until I see it though.

 

“… if the deal was right” is such a ******** qualifier. It’s sad that Sam Kennedy still speaks in phrases we call each other out for on Talksox…

[Dipre]

Oh, it was totally a good decision to let Mookie walk. That definitely didn't put this team on a downward spiral or anything.

 

"Past couple of seasons" meaning '22 and '23, when he neither sold not bought.

[mvp 78]

"Past couple of seasons" meaning '22 and '23, when he neither sold not bought.

 

Henry's "problem with money" goes back before the previous two deadlines. You can't just ignore the elephant in the closet. At times, he has spent. At other times, he has not spent. We are in a spot where the spending is down and FSG is looking elsewhere. Can the Sox get the payroll up again? Maybe?

[Dipre]

You're arguing something entirely different. We've been talking about guys like Mark Canha and pítchers like Elfin. We're not talking high-level expenditures, just a general limit at least at the cap.

[mvp 78]

You're arguing something entirely different. We've been talking about guys like Mark Canha and pítchers like Elfin. We're not talking high-level expenditures, just a general limit at least at the cap.

 

I'm not arguing anything different. Henry has not spent recently. The only time they went over the cap since '19 was accidentally in '22. We have heard there's a firm budget. We don't know where that budget is. It could be lower than the CBT. It may not be. None of us on here knows. We do know that the guy who went over the cap got his ass fired.

[notin]

I'm not arguing anything different. Henry has not spent recently. The only time they went over the cap since '19 was accidentally in '22. We have heard there's a firm budget. We don't know where that budget is. It could be lower than the CBT. It may not be. None of us on here knows. We do know that the guy who went over the cap got his ass fired.

 

He did get fired, but over a year after going over the cap…

[Maxbialystock]

Oh, it was totally a good decision to let Mookie walk. That definitely didn't put this team on a downward spiral or anything.

 

Ahem. The "downward spiral" began in 2019 when the Sox had the biggest payroll in MLB and did not make the postseason. If you check, you will see the 2019 Sox had almost all of the lineup and pitching talent they had in 2018 when they won 108 games and the WS.

 

If we skip 2020, the covid season, the 2021 season--without Mookie Betts and Price and Sale--was pretty successful, which you and others always ignore. The Sox won 92 in the regular season, beat Cole and the Yankees in the wild card, beat the 100 win Rays in the ALDS, and finally lost to the Astros, 4 games to 2, in the ALCS. That was in fact a better season than 2016 and 2017 when the Sox lost 3 straight in the ALDS both seasons.

 

The actual downward spiral appears to have lasted two seasons, 2022 and 2023. Not coincidentally, the payroll has gone steadily down, in part because JH refuses to shell out big and long-term for great starting pitchers. Plus Mookie of course.

 

However, the 2024 Sox appear to be on par with the 2021 Sox and better than the 2019 Sox who still had almost all of the great talent the 2018 Sox had--and certainly the massive payroll. Moreover, the 2024 Sox are missing Sale (given away), Giolito (hired to replace Sale), Story, and Whitlock.

 

Nevertheless--despite the massive wailing in this game thread--the Sox pitching, over halfway through this season, is the best it's been in a long time with a team ERA, 3.65, ranked 5th in MLB. For reference, the 2018 Sox team ERA was 3.75, ranked 8th, and one of the most expensive pitching staffs in MLB with Price, Sale, Kimbrel, Porcello, Pomeranz, et al.

[mvp 78]

Tut tut, let's just skip over 2020 for the sake of MY argument!!!

[mvp 78]

He did get fired, but over a year after going over the cap…

 

Went over the cap and then signed two FA's that faceplanted the next offseason. That's a whoopsiedoodle!

[Old Red]

TBD vs Ragans

 

Criswell is scheduled to go for WOO tonight, is he called up instead? Bullpen game?

 

Criswell will start tonight. The Wing Man has been sent back down.

[mvp 78]

Criswell will start tonight. The Wing Man has been sent back down.

 

Not surprising. I will not point and laugh at those that wanted to keep Wingenter close to Bailey. He'll be fine down in WOO as well.

[Maxbialystock]

Tut tut, let's just skip over 2020 for the sake of MY argument!!!

 

Go ahead and count 2020 if you want to. It still has no effect on the simple fact that the 2021 season was better than 2016 or 2017.

 

2022 and 2023 were not good, agreed, but the 2012 season was much much worse and still average 36K+ attendance.

 

As for the last three seasons, 2022-2024, I think the attendance of 32K+ has mostly been affected by the lack of stars, especially expensive ones. Americans have enormous respect for rich people even when it's unearned. That's why I keep calling the 2024 Sox the "no-names." Who wants to go see Duran, who only makes $760K? Or Houck, $770K? Or Crawford, $760K? Or Wong, Abreu, Slaten, Hamilton, Bernardino, Winck? Heck, Rafaela, even with his longer contract, is only getting $1.25M this year--and Bello $1.166.

[mvp 78]

Refsnyder RF,

Duran LF,

O’Neill DH,

Devers 3B,

Wong C,

Gonzalez 1B,

Westbrook 2B,

Rafaela CF,

Hamilton SS

[Maxbialystock]

Against lefty Ragans, 5-6, ERA 3.38, 138K, the Sox are again going with 6 righties. In parentheses are OPS's vs lefties:

 

Ref RF (.934)

Duran LF (.628)

O'Neill DH (1.108)

Devers 3b (.702)

Wong C (.920)

Gonzalez 1b (.796)

Westbrook 2b (.782)

Rafaela CF (.775)

Hamilton SS (.431)

[Maxbialystock]

Royals are going with their 3 best starters--Ragans, Lugo, and Singer--in this series, so I have to give them the edge even though the Sox are 8-2 in their last 10 and the Royals 5-5.

 

However, if the Sox win tonight with Criswell going against lefty Ragans, I would favor the Sox to win the series.

 

So, make no mistake, I will be rooting like crazy for the Sox tonight.

Edited July 12, 2024 by Maxbialystock

[moonslav59]

The Sox have lost only one series out of the last 12 (SDP 2-1.)

 

We’ve tied a few, but just one lost series dating back to the end of May is pretty damn good.