9/3 Red Sox at Royals 2:10 EDT

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

One could argue, why would a team hurting to improve its D, trade away one of the best defensive RF'ers in 2023?

 

One could also argue that one very good year on D in RF does not make him a top defender.

 

I don't think Dugo has great trade value. To get a decent SP for him and a prospect, the prospect will have to be a very good one. I'm not sure how much his "antics" will cause Bloom to shop Dugo, or how much those antics might scare some Gms away from wanting him, but in some ways, it makes sense to deal him and re-sign Duvall.

 

Dugo had a brain fart and arrived late for one game and in one game he didn't hustle to 2nd base. Imho, Dugo and Cora don't get along and Dugo's become Cora's whipping boy. A change of scenery would probably be a good thing for Dugo.

Edited September 4, 2023 by SPLENDIDSPLINTER

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

There was another head scratcher in today's game. When Dugo got injured, why didn't Cora place REF in the OF immediately. Instead he put Abreu in RF and then promptly had REF pinch hit for him. Made no sense to me at all. Maybe I missed something.

 

I also liked how Sale pretty much told Cora to get out of my face when Cora came out to remove him with 2 outs in the bottom of the 5th.

Edited September 4, 2023 by SPLENDIDSPLINTER

[moonslav59]

There was another head scratcher in today's game. When Dugo got injured, why didn't Cora place REF in the OF immediately. Instead he put Abreu in RF and then promptly had REF pinch hit for him. Made no sense to me at all. Maybe I missed something.

 

Maybe he did not foresee the need to PH.

[moonslav59]

Dugo had a brain fart and arrived late for one game and in one game he didn't hustle to 2nd base. Imho, Dugo and Cora don't get along and Dugo's become Cora's whipping boy. A change of scenery would probably be a good thing for Dugo.

 

Until this season, I thought of Dugo as one of Cora's faves.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Until this season, I thought of Dugo as one of Cora's faves.

 

Well, that may be true, but it is kind of perplexing that I've seen too many SOX players not hustling to 1st on grounders, but Dugo was the only one benched for not hustling. As far as I'm concerned JBJ was Cora's favorite and I still believe he asked Bloom to get JBJ back on the team last year.

[moonslav59]

Well, that may be true, but it is kind of perplexing that I've seen too many SOX players not hustling to 1st on grounders, but Dugo was the only one benched for not hustling. As far as I'm concerned JBJ was Cora's favorite and I still believe he asked Bloom to get JBJ back on the team last year.

 

Kike was clearly Cora's top fave.

 

I'm not sure about JBJ, but that makes sense.

 

I remember when Dugo first played for us, he was really sucking vs lefties, and Cora nixed all talk of platooning him by saying he is our FT RF'er.

 

I'm not so sure that was the first time Dugo did not run out a grounder, but you are right: others have done it, too.

 

This should be a very interesting winter, and I really wish I knew what top brass is telling Bloom. It could be...

 

1. Make it look good, but we are still 1-2 years away from spending large.

2. We want to make a strong push in 2024 without making any major sacrifices for 2025 and beyond, as in no major prospect trades.

3. Go for it- very few limits, except the $20M over the tax line cut off. (Maybe one major prospect package allowed.)

4. No limits. Win or you are gone.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Kike was clearly Cora's top fave.

 

I'm not sure about JBJ, but that makes sense.

 

I remember when Dugo first played for us, he was really sucking vs lefties, and Cora nixed all talk of platooning him by saying he is our FT RF'er.

 

I'm not so sure that was the first time Dugo did not run out a grounder, but you are right: others have done it, too.

 

This should be a very interesting winter, and I really wish I knew what top brass is telling Bloom. It could be...

 

1. Make it look good, but we are still 1-2 years away from spending large.

2. We want to make a strong push in 2024 without making any major sacrifices for 2025 and beyond, as in no major prospect trades.

3. Go for it- very few limits, except the $20M over the tax line cut off. (Maybe one major prospect package allowed.)

4. No limits. Win or you are gone.

 

Your guess is as good as mine. In regards to Kike I will say yes he was a terrible SS, but he was forced tp play a position where failure was a certainty. Also, Kike will never be accused of not hustling. He gave his all in every game I saw him play. And he was a terrific CF'r.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

 

This should be a very interesting winter, and I really wish I knew what top brass is telling Bloom. It could be...

 

1. Make it look good, but we are still 1-2 years away from spending large.

2. We want to make a strong push in 2024 without making any major sacrifices for 2025 and beyond, as in no major prospect trades.

3. Go for it- very few limits, except the $20M over the tax line cut off. (Maybe one major prospect package allowed.)

4. No limits. Win or you are gone.

 

5. Status quo. Owners: "We're making more money, and keeping more money... Chaim, keep doing what you're doing... the illusion of contention... Sam will leak to the media that we're in on every expensive free agent pitcher, but dang, just got overbid. Underdog, UNderdog, UNDERdog!"

[Bellhorn04]

5. Status quo. Owners: "We're making more money, and keeping more money... Chaim, keep doing what you're doing... the illusion of contention... Sam will leak to the media that we're in on every expensive free agent pitcher, but dang, just got overbid. Underdog, UNderdog, UNDERdog!"

 

Chaim "the Underwhelmer" can definitely do it.

[Old Red]

Chaim "the Underwhelmer" can definitely do it.

 

The underwhelming underdog by Chaim Bloom made for New England, and parts unknown.

[moonslav59]

5. Status quo. Owners: "We're making more money, and keeping more money... Chaim, keep doing what you're doing... the illusion of contention... Sam will leak to the media that we're in on every expensive free agent pitcher, but dang, just got overbid. Underdog, UNderdog, UNDERdog!"

 

Your #5 is my #1 with future hopes.

[a700hitter]

5. Status quo. Owners: "We're making more money, and keeping more money... Chaim, keep doing what you're doing... the illusion of contention... Sam will leak to the media that we're in on every expensive free agent pitcher, but dang, just got overbid. Underdog, UNderdog, UNDERdog!"

Where is the like button? This is the off season plan! Are you a mole?

[Maxbialystock]

Your guess is as good as mine. In regards to Kike I will say yes he was a terrible SS, but he was forced tp play a position where failure was a certainty. Also, Kike will never be accused of not hustling. He gave his all in every game I saw him play. And he was a terrific CF'r.

 

Good summary of Kike, who seems to be doing OK with the Dodgers (and they with him).

[Maxbialystock]

I also liked how Sale pretty much told Cora to get out of my face when Cora came out to remove him with 2 outs in the bottom of the 5th.

 

In the postgame interview Cora said he went to the mound with an open mind and was satisfied when Sale basically said, "let me pitch to one more guy."

 

Sale threw 100 pitches in yesterday's game, and that's a lot of pitches for any Sox starter and especially for Sale.

 

So I think you are way off base in your assumption that Cora had no business going to the mound in the 5th inning.

[Maxbialystock]

Until this season, I thought of Dugo as one of Cora's faves.

 

He might still be. Who better than one of his faves to criticize?

 

Dugo has easily the best WAR, +3.7, on the team because he is the only good fielder on the team who can also hit the dang ball. I think he gets a reputation for being too casual because of the utter simplicity of his batting stance--and the same could apply to how he moves in the outfield, also a no frills approach.

[moonslav59]

He might still be. Who better than one of his faves to criticize?

 

Dugo has easily the best WAR, +3.7, on the team because he is the only good fielder on the team who can also hit the dang ball. I think he gets a reputation for being too casual because of the utter simplicity of his batting stance--and the same could apply to how he moves in the outfield, also a no frills approach.

 

All the more reason to trade him while his stock is highest. LOL

 

BTW, fWAR:

2.6 Devers

2.6 Dugo

2.4 Duvall (in about 40% less games)

2.3 Duran

1.8 Turner

1.5 Casas

1.0 Wong

0.9 Yoshida

0.6 McGuire & Reyes

 

Pitching

1.8 Sale

1.6 Crawford

1.4 Bello

1.3 Jansen

1.1 Martin

1.0 Pivetta & Paxton

0.9 Houck & Bernardino

0.7 Winckowski

0.5 Whitlock

[Maxbialystock]

All the more reason to trade him while his stock is highest. LOL

 

BTW, fWAR:

2.6 Devers

2.6 Dugo

2.4 Duvall (in about 40% less games)

2.3 Duran

1.8 Turner

1.5 Casas

1.0 Wong

0.9 Yoshida

0.6 McGuire & Reyes

 

Pitching

1.8 Sale

1.6 Crawford

1.4 Bello

1.3 Jansen

1.1 Martin

1.0 Pivetta & Paxton

0.9 Houck & Bernardino

0.7 Winckowski

0.5 Whitlock

 

Gotta love fWAR which ignores fielding--which I believe you think is important.

[moonslav59]

Gotta love fWAR which ignores fielding--which I believe you think is important.

 

It does not ignore D, at all.

 

It does weight some positions more so than others, but defense is a major part of their WAR.

 

They also count baserunning.

 

Verdugo is ranked 7th on their offense score:

16.3 Duvall

14.2 Casas

13.9 Duran

13.4 Turner

12.1 Devers

6.7 Yoshida

6.2 Verdugo

 

His D is the reason they have him tied with Devers and ahead of the others on this list. It's not his baserunning.

 

Conversely, it is bWAR that ranks Dugo higher based on his O and NOT his D.

OWAR

3.6 Devers

2.7 Duran

2.5 Duvall

2.4 Dugo

2.3 Casas & Turner

2.1 Yoshida

 

It's bWAR's O score that has him higher than fWAR, and not the D score.