June 3, Rays at Boston, Game 2

[Maxbialystock]

He was a great baseball player, he was a great fisherman, and he was an ace in the Korean War and crash landed his plane. I'm pretty sure that's more interesting then, let's say, most movies about real people. Oh, I forgot about his secret visits to the hospital to talk to kids suffering from cancer and how he pretty much created the Jimmy Fund. You're probably right; it wouldn't work in a movie. It would have to be a 5 part mini-series.

 

For a movie to work it has to engage the audience, a perfect example of which is Bull Durham. Gary Cooper as Lou Gehrig worked because of ALS and that speech at the end. Eight Men Out Worked because of the director/writer and telling the Black Sox Scandal story from the players perspective.

 

That Williams was a terrific fisherman is nice to know, but not very engaging. Same for being a great hitter. Lots of baseball players served in World War II, but a movie about Ted would omit the fact that he tried like the dickens not to join up--he played the entire 1942 season. When he did join and became a pilot, he never saw combat. And he was not an ace in the Korean War.

 

But the real problem with a Williams movie is coming up with a dramatic center. Few people know that the movie Patton succeeded because Francis Ford Coppola wrote the screenplay--and wisely chose to lead with that speech by Patton, delivered wonderfully by George C. Scott (but without Patton's high squeaky voice). Gary Cooper as Lou Gehrig is a boring movie right up until we found out he has ALS and then delivers that incredible speech at Yankee stadium. Nothing Williams did comes anywhere near that for dramatic impact.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

For a movie to work it has to engage the audience, a perfect example of which is Bull Durham. Gary Cooper as Lou Gehrig worked because of ALS and that speech at the end. Eight Men Out Worked because of the director/writer and telling the Black Sox Scandal story from the players perspective.

 

That Williams was a terrific fisherman is nice to know, but not very engaging. Same for being a great hitter. Lots of baseball players served in World War II, but a movie about Ted would omit the fact that he tried like the dickens not to join up--he played the entire 1942 season. When he did join and became a pilot, he never saw combat. And he was not an ace in the Korean War.

 

But the real problem with a Williams movie is coming up with a dramatic center. Few people know that the movie Patton succeeded because Francis Ford Coppola wrote the screenplay--and wisely chose to lead with that speech by Patton, delivered wonderfully by George C. Scott (but without Patton's high squeaky voice). Gary Cooper as Lou Gehrig is a boring movie right up until we found out he has ALS and then delivers that incredible speech at Yankee stadium. Nothing Williams did comes anywhere near that for dramatic impact.

 

They would allow some 'dramatic license' which is common in real life movies. Anyway, I do agree with you concerning Ted being too complex for John Wayne to portray. Imho, Wayne was dumb as a stick and just a moronic blowhard, who never served in the military, but made so many war movies, he probably thought he really was at Iwo Jima. His big claim to fame was working with Joe McCarthy and accusing fellow people in the movie business of being communists, even though a lot of those same people he accused actually had served in the military. He helped ruin many lives and should never be considered a hero by anybody. .

Edited June 4, 2023 by SPLENDIDSPLINTER

[Maxbialystock]

They would allow some 'dramatic license' which is common in real life movies. Anyway, I do agree with you concerning Ted being too complex for John Wayne to portray. Wayne was dumb as a stick and just a moronic blowhard, who never served in the military, but made so many war movies, he probably thought he really was at Iwo Jima. His big claim to fame was working with Joe McCarthy and accusing fellow people in the movie business of being communists, even though a lot of those same people he accused actually did serve in the military. He helped ruin many lives and should never be considered a hero by anybody. True Grit; more like True Shite.

 

John Ford used to give Wayne a hard time about his lack of service because in fact Ford did serve and did go in harm's way. Ford didn't like McCarthy or his front man in Hollywood, Cecil B. Demille.

[Maxbialystock]

To sort of wrap this up, I thought tonight's 2d game was a good one. I'm disappointed with the loss, but delighted it was a competitive game and with the competitiveness of our pitchers.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

John Ford used to give Wayne a hard time about his lack of service because in fact Ford did serve and did go in harm's way. Ford didn't like McCarthy or his front man in Hollywood, Cecil B. Demille.

 

My bad. You were correct about Ted never being an 'Ace.' He did fly 39 missions and was John Glenn's wingman. Mr Glenn was quite pleased to have Ted as his wingman. Glenn was quoted as saying that Ted never talked about baseball unless someone asked. He was truly committed to being the best fighter pilot he could be. I've always said that Teddy Ballgame did in real life what John Wayne did in the movies.

Btw, Williams admitted more than once that he loved fishing more than baseball. He is in the fly fishing HOF.

Ted wasn't the greatest family guy and was far from perfect, but in the long run his good easily outweighed his bad.

Edited June 4, 2023 by SPLENDIDSPLINTER

[jad]

They would allow some 'dramatic license' which is common in real life movies. Anyway, I do agree with you concerning Ted being too complex for John Wayne to portray. Imho, Wayne was dumb as a stick and just a moronic blowhard, who never served in the military, but made so many war movies, he probably thought he really was at Iwo Jima. His big claim to fame was working with Joe McCarthy and accusing fellow people in the movie business of being communists, even though a lot of those same people he accused actually had served in the military. He helped ruin many lives and should never be considered a hero by anybody. .

 

Right on the money about Wayne! Very much like those Giant-Flag folks in the NFL--Goodell, Jerry Jones, and many others--who never saw a square inch of camo or piece of stars-and-stripes bunting that didn't bring them to tears, but somehow avoided those situations (like the military) where they could actually wear the stuff.

[notin]

He was a great baseball player, he was a great fisherman, and he was an ace in the Korean War and crash landed his plane. I'm pretty sure that's more interesting then, let's say, most movies about real people. Oh, I forgot about his secret visits to the hospital to talk to kids suffering from cancer and how he pretty much created the Jimmy Fund. You're probably right; it wouldn't work in a movie. It would have to be a 5 part mini-series.

 

A Ted Williams movie would - like all movies - need struggling and an opposing character. If you just told the story of his life, you’d have a boring history lesson. People engage in a movie when there’s a struggle to watch a character overcome. We liked “Bill Durham” not because we were invested in Nuke LaLoosh, but because we cared if Crash could drag him to the Show kicking and screaming about having to do it Crash’s way.

 

“The Rookie” (the Jim Morris story starring Dennis Quaid) tried to force this controversy on us with the character of Morris’ father, and it flopped in a big way. Shame, because Morris’ story of a 36yo science teacher who suddenly vaulted himself into MLB should have been more fascinating.

 

So what would the Story of Ted Williams move be? What would Ted be trying to accomplish and who would be trying to stop him?

 

Until someone can tell that aspect, I don’t think there odd a good movie to be made…

[Bellhorn04]

A Ted Williams movie would - like all movies - need struggling and an opposing character. If you just told the story of his life, you’d have a boring history lesson. People engage in a movie when there’s a struggle to watch a character overcome. We liked “Bill Durham” not because we were invested in Nuke LaLoosh, but because we cared if Crash could drag him to the Show kicking and screaming about having to do it Crash’s way.

 

“The Rookie” (the Jim Morris story starring Dennis Quaid) tried to force this controversy on us with the character of Morris’ father, and it flopped in a big way. Shame, because Morris’ story of a 36yo science teacher who suddenly vaulted himself into MLB should have been more fascinating.

 

So what would the Story of Ted Williams move be? What would Ted be trying to accomplish and who would be trying to stop him?

 

Until someone can tell that aspect, I don’t think there odd a good movie to be made…

 

I think the real Ted Williams Story would be compelling, but also dark and tragic. Ted's relationship with Red Sox fans and media was so damaged that he famously wouldn't acknowledge the cheering when he homered in his final game.

 

Yaz also had a turbulent relationship with Red Sox fans and media, but he left on a much more uplifting note with his tour around the field pressing the flesh with the crowd.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

If anyone is interested there are two excellent books written by David Halberstam regarding Ted Willliams. The Summer of 49 and Teammates. I've read many books about Teddy Ballgame, but these two are my favorites.

[guinness22]

If anyone is interested there are two excellent books written by David Halberstam regarding Ted Willliams. The Summer of 49 and Teammates. I've read many books about Teddy Ballgame, but these two are my favorites.

 

I am and I noted this. Thanks.