August 18 Red Sox at Orioles

[moonslav59]

In his 10 years as a Red Sox Bill's W/L record was 94-68. His ERA over that period ws 3.64. He averaged 3 K's/game, 10 hits/game and 3 BB's/game. His WHIP over the 10 years was 1.380.

From 1973-1975 Bill was 51-35, winning 17 games in each of those 3 years. Also during that same period, Bill averaged 280 innings pitched.

In 1974 Mr Lee led all major league pitchers in hits allowed with 320.

And in the 7th game of the '75 WS Bill really pissed off YAZ. I wonder if they've talked since?

 

He had nerves of steal, and was the master at bearing down, when it mattered. Lots of GBs led to lots of DPs, too.

 

I was a huge Lee fan, and the way they dumped him pissed me off, big time.

[jad]

He had nerves of steal, and was the master at bearing down, when it mattered. Lots of GBs led to lots of DPs, too.

 

I was a huge Lee fan, and the way they dumped him pissed me off, big time.

 

Yeah, but think of the haul of prospects they must have gotten back.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

He had nerves of steal, and was the master at bearing down, when it mattered. Lots of GBs led to lots of DPs, too.

 

I was a huge Lee fan, and the way they dumped him pissed me off, big time.

 

I remember when Bill had his arm injured during a brawl with the Yankems back when both teams actually hated each other, not this phony promo crap today.

My one word to describe Bill Lee would be 'unique.'

[moonslav59]

Yeah, but think of the haul of prospects they must have gotten back.

 

They weren't even that smart.

 

I think they got a utility IF'er for him.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

They weren't even that smart.

 

I think they got a utility IF'er for him.

 

Stan Papi.

[dgalehouse]

Bill Lee was a good pitcher and was/is quite a character. And this just in ; MLB has issued a statement that the tape of last night's game/debacle will definitely not be going to Cooperstown. It has been incinerated before it could do any further harm to the sport.

[notin]

They weren't even that smart.

 

I think they got a utility IF'er for him.

 

 

He wasn’t traded for the same reason players like Betts were traded. It wasn’t rebuilding and it wasn’t financial. Don Zimmer didn’t like him (and a couple others, like Jim Willoughby) and wanted them off his team.

[dgalehouse]

He wasn’t traded for the same reason players like Betts were traded. It wasn’t rebuilding and it wasn’t financial. Don Zimmer didn’t like him (and a couple others, like Jim Willoughby) and wanted them off his team.

 

I liked Lee. I hated to see him traded. But he could be a headache to a manager. As for Mookie , trading him will go down in infamy . One of the worst decisions ever. The Lee trade is in no way comparable.

[notin]

I liked Lee. I hated to see him traded. But he could be a headache to a manager. As for Mookie , trading him will go down in infamy . One of the worst decisions ever. The Lee trade is in no way comparable.

 

 

So you think the right thing to do with Mookie was to keep him for one more year and let him walk for a draft pick? Those was the ONLY other option.

 

Signing him was not happening. Dombrowski couldn’t get it done, and expecting Bloom to do it later after Bogaerts and Salevwere both extended and taken up an additional $50mill AAV is the fantasy part of that whole saga…

[dgalehouse]

So you think the right thing to do with Mookie was to keep him for one more year and let him walk for a draft pick? Those was the ONLY other option.

 

Signing him was not happening. Dombrowski couldn’t get it done, and expecting Bloom to do it later after Bogaerts and Salevwere both extended and taken up an additional $50mill AAV is the fantasy part of that whole saga…

 

I have heard all the talking points both pro and con. My feeling is that they could have and should have found a way to sign him. If I thought they did that and he still walked away , I could accept it. But I think they gave up too quickly. No sense going through this again.

[Bellhorn04]

So you think the right thing to do with Mookie was to keep him for one more year and let him walk for a draft pick? Those was the ONLY other option.

 

Signing him was not happening. Dombrowski couldn’t get it done, and expecting Bloom to do it later after Bogaerts and Salevwere both extended and taken up an additional $50mill AAV is the fantasy part of that whole saga…

 

There's only one member of the Red Sox organization you can fairly blame for losing Betts, and that's Henry. He clearly sanctioned the hit.

[notin]

I have heard all the talking points both pro and con. My feeling is that they could have and should have found a way to sign him. If I thought they did that and he still walked away , I could accept it. But I think they gave up too quickly. No sense going through this again.

 

Yet you repeatedly bring it up. I think you like to start conversations that you don’t want other people to have…

[notin]

There's only one member of the Red Sox organization you can fairly blame for losing Betts, and that's Henry. He clearly sanctioned the hit.

 

I think when the Sox reached a $30mill AAV, they made an honest effort. Betts just wanted more at the time.

 

If he wanted to know how much he could get, the only way was free agency. And he had a very high price for being bough out of being bought out of that opportunity.

 

He also took 5 months and 2 months worth of cancelled games to extend with LA. I would never believe it took that long because LA wasn’t trying. More likely, it took Mookie that long to get his price within range.

 

I think it was more Mookie than Henry, and I don’t hold Mookie’s career plans against him. But Bloom? For what? Not foreseeing a global pandemic that shuts down the world and impacts MLB economics?

[moonslav59]

He wasn’t traded for the same reason players like Betts were traded. It wasn’t rebuilding and it wasn’t financial. Don Zimmer didn’t like him (and a couple others, like Jim Willoughby) and wanted them off his team.

 

...and they happened to be some of our better players.

 

The GM was also a clown. Not sending a contract to Fisk in time, so he became a FA. That's worse PR than trading him for Stan Papi.

 

He traded Lynn, Burleson, Cooper and others, too, but he did get some decent returns on some of those moves.

[moonslav59]

I have heard all the talking points both pro and con. My feeling is that they could have and should have found a way to sign him. If I thought they did that and he still walked away , I could accept it. But I think they gave up too quickly. No sense going through this again.

 

So, not giving up = giving more money or more years (or both) than they wanted to do.

 

I happen to agree, and wish they did offer more. Who knows, if he takes what the Dodgers ended up offering a year later.

[dgalehouse]

Yet you repeatedly bring it up. I think you like to start conversations that you don’t want other people to have…

 

Notin, think whatever you want. You were the first to bring it up. I just responded. But that's okay. Think whatever you want.

[dgalehouse]

So, not giving up = giving more money or more years (or both) than they wanted to do.

 

I happen to agree, and wish they did offer more. Who knows, if he takes what the Dodgers ended up offering a year later.

 

We can all speculate . Mookie is quoted as saying that he would have stayed had the Sox matched the Dodgers' offer. That is what I am going by. Henry may have hired Bloom with the instructions to trade Mookie. That is possible , but we may never know.

[moonslav59]

We can all speculate . Mookie is quoted as saying that he would have stayed had the Sox matched the Dodgers' offer. That is what I am going by. Henry may have hired Bloom with the instructions to trade Mookie. That is possible , but we may never know.

 

We won't ever know.

 

So, let's say we kept Betts at what the Dodgers paid and still cut the budget in 2020 to the same amount. Speculate on how we do that.

 

Who else do we trade with Price to dump his salary?

 

If we keep Price, how do we dump over $40M and that's not counting any additions.

 

Speculate on where that leaves us in 2021 and now...

 

(Note: I wanted us to extend Betts, so I'm not being a pain in the ass, here.)