just wondering

[moonslav59]

Of course, this means they'll just sign two low end SPs, a reliever and 3 UTIL guys.

 

Let's say we only get $40M to spend- same as last winter.

 

Keeping ERod $18M would be a push with the hope he improves by pitching like the second half of 2021. That would leave $22M to essentially replace Ottavino, Richards and Iggy.

 

Not easy to do, but possible.

[mvp 78]

Let's say we only get $40M to spend- same as last winter.

 

Keeping ERod $18M would be a push with the hope he improves by pitching like the second half of 2021. That would leave $22M to essentially replace Ottavino, Richards and Iggy.

 

Not easy to do, but possible.

 

The issue is that at some point, these guys need to be replaced by prospects from the minors.

 

Maybe they just call up Feltman to take the Richards bullpen spot?

 

Do they try to start the season with Seabold in the rotation?

[moonslav59]

The issue is that at some point, these guys need to be replaced by prospects from the minors.

 

Maybe they just call up Feltman to take the Richards bullpen spot?

 

Do they try to start the season with Seabold in the rotation?

 

That could happen, but it's not something I'd feel like we improved on paper by doing.

 

I do think adding Houck to the pen and keeping Whitlock there reduces the need to spend big on the pen over the winter, and allows us to spend more on a quality starter or two.

 

Houck

Whitlock

______

Barnes

Taylor

DHern

Sawamura

Brasier

Davis/Valdez/Bazardo/Feltman/Ort (maybe Seabold/Winckoski/Crawford)

 

Or, if we make Whitlock a starter, we'd need just one more starter- not two, but 2 more pen pieces- not 1.

 

Sale

____

Eovaldi

Whitlock

Pivetta

Seabold

 

Houck

_____

_____

Barnes

Taylor

DHern

Sawamura

Brasier

Davis/Valdez/Bazardo/Feltman/Ort (maybe Seabold/Winckoski/Crawford)

[moonslav59]

The issue is that at some point, these guys need to be replaced by prospects from the minors.

 

Maybe they just call up Feltman to take the Richards bullpen spot?

 

 

I think Houck takes Richard's slot and maybe Feltman takes Ottavino/Robles spot

[jacksonianmarch]

Feltman is interesting to me. He moved up to AAA and was more effective, yet his K rate went down as did his GB rate. I wonder if they took away a sinker and moved him to a 4SFB guy. This would account for more FB's and if he got a jump in velocity, the softer contact.

 

I do think Houck is a starter for you next year out of the gate, but he is miscast in that role without learning some other pitch. He is a 3-4 inning pitcher as a starter as most teams can adjust and hit FB and slider especially as the pitcher gets a bit tired.

 

There is little chance the sox build a pen from within. I absolutely believe you'll see some BP signings this offseason, if not the splashy types.

[mvp 78]

Feltman is interesting to me. He moved up to AAA and was more effective, yet his K rate went down as did his GB rate. I wonder if they took away a sinker and moved him to a 4SFB guy. This would account for more FB's and if he got a jump in velocity, the softer contact.

 

I do think Houck is a starter for you next year out of the gate, but he is miscast in that role without learning some other pitch. He is a 3-4 inning pitcher as a starter as most teams can adjust and hit FB and slider especially as the pitcher gets a bit tired.

 

There is little chance the sox build a pen from within. I absolutely believe you'll see some BP signings this offseason, if not the splashy types.

 

They absolutely are not able to rebuild from within in 2022. Maybe 2023 some more arms could come up? Right now, the strength of their farm is much further away than 2022. I'm not sure they have anyone they can rocket through the system unless they are throwing Bello in the pen.

[jacksonianmarch]

They absolutely are not able to rebuild from within in 2022. Maybe 2023 some more arms could come up? Right now, the strength of their farm is much further away than 2022. I'm not sure they have anyone they can rocket through the system unless they are throwing Bello in the pen.

 

They need an experienced closer. Richards will be gone. Ottavino will likely move far away from the northeast so he can recover from his shellings. Barnes will be around, but he is not a closer. DHern doesn't have the command to close. Whitlock will be a starter and I expect them to use Houck as a starter early on as well. So what does that leave you with in the pen?

 

Barnes

DHern

Brasier

Sawamura

 

You don't start with that above and decide to add rooks to it and roll unless you plan on losing 90 games

[moonslav59]

Feltman is interesting to me. He moved up to AAA and was more effective, yet his K rate went down as did his GB rate. I wonder if they took away a sinker and moved him to a 4SFB guy. This would account for more FB's and if he got a jump in velocity, the softer contact.

 

I do think Houck is a starter for you next year out of the gate, but he is miscast in that role without learning some other pitch. He is a 3-4 inning pitcher as a starter as most teams can adjust and hit FB and slider especially as the pitcher gets a bit tired.

 

There is little chance the sox build a pen from within. I absolutely believe you'll see some BP signings this offseason, if not the splashy types.

 

Houck seems better suited for the pen, unless he proves he can have an effective third pitch.

 

IMO, Whitlock is better suited for the roatation, but keeping them both in the pen avoids the need to replace Ottavino/Richards- leaving more money on starter upgrades.

 

I'd love to see us improve our D, but that seems too problematic for this winter, so our focus should be on the rotation.

[mvp 78]

They need an experienced closer. Richards will be gone. Ottavino will likely move far away from the northeast so he can recover from his shellings. Barnes will be around, but he is not a closer. DHern doesn't have the command to close. Whitlock will be a starter and I expect them to use Houck as a starter early on as well. So what does that leave you with in the pen?

 

Barnes

DHern

Brasier

Sawamura

 

You don't start with that above and decide to add rooks to it and roll unless you plan on losing 90 games

 

I honestly think Houck and Whitlock flip roles and Houck becomes the high leverage guy. Does he close? IDK.

[mvp 78]

Not sure they are comfortable ponying up for Rosenthal.

 

I don't think they'll pay for Jansen.

 

Kimbrel's ship has sailed.

 

I guess they'd try to get Raisel Iglesias?

[moonslav59]

Not sure they are comfortable ponying up for Rosenthal.

 

I don't think they'll pay for Jansen.

 

Kimbrel's ship has sailed.

 

I guess they'd try to get Raisel Iglesias?

 

I'd say he's our #1 pen target, unless we can trade for a cheaper option.

[notin]

Not sure they are comfortable ponying up for Rosenthal.

 

I don't think they'll pay for Jansen.

 

Kimbrel's ship has sailed.

 

I guess they'd try to get Raisel Iglesias?

 

They should pass on Rosenthal. Trevor Rosenthal has all of 39 IP since 2017. They’d be better off counting on Ken Rosenthal…

[notin]

Of these players, the only real keepers are:

Verdugo

Kiké

Renfroe

Whitlock

Schwarber

 

The rest you can throw back in the pond and it won't affect the team.

 

Yeah all three of those innings from Connor Seabold did paint a pretty grim picture moving forward…

[Bellhorn04]

Yeah all three of those innings from Connor Seabold did paint a pretty grim picture moving forward…

 

Especially the second one!

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

There's no way Bloom spends big bucks on "proven" relievers. The Rays never do; instead, they constantly deal for young power arms to stockpile and develop -- and as soon as one becomes established and possibly expensive, they trade him while he's still good, but always for two more pitchers.

 

Bloom had a chance to sign plenty of "proven" relievers last winter and refused, while they landed instead all over the MLB map. He finally caved and extended Barnes this summer... and got burned. Expect our CBO to turnover the bullpen, but via trades and promotions.

[mvp 78]

They should pass on Rosenthal. Trevor Rosenthal has all of 39 IP since 2017. They’d be better off counting on Ken Rosenthal…

 

I only thought it could be a cheaper option. I'm not really psyched on a lot of the pitching FA's this offseason.

 

Max is old and will want too many years.

 

Stroman and Gausman are the two I'd lobby for. Roll the dice for a healthy Syndergaard?

 

I think Robbie Ray is a flash in the pan.

 

DeSclafani as a lower tiered guy? Alex Wood?

[mvp 78]

Yeah all three of those innings from Connor Seabold did paint a pretty grim picture moving forward…

 

He could wind up being ok. However, his "stuff" has been greatly diminished this season in AAA. Maybe he can get healthy this offseason? If not, he'll never make an impact in the rotation.

[mvp 78]

There's no way Bloom spends big bucks on "proven" relievers. The Rays never do; instead, they constantly deal for young power arms to stockpile and develop -- and as soon as one becomes established and possibly expensive, they trade him while he's still good, but always for two more pitchers.

 

Bloom had a chance to sign plenty of "proven" relievers last winter and refused, while they landed instead all over the MLB map. He finally caved and extended Barnes this summer... and got burned. Expect our CBO to turnover the bullpen, but via trades and promotions.

 

The Red Sox have a budget that the Rays never do. Bloom has the ability to sign expensive guys, but should be able to focus on the MiLB guys and get some undervalued players to supplement the $$$ guys.

[moonslav59]

The Red Sox have a budget that the Rays never do. Bloom has the ability to sign expensive guys, but should be able to focus on the MiLB guys and get some undervalued players to supplement the $$$ guys.

 

Yes, and although we all felt like Bloom's hands were tied, last winter, he still spent $40M, which is way more than the Rays ever spend.

[mvp 78]

Yes, and although we all felt like Bloom's hands were tied, last winter, he still spent $40M, which is way more than the Rays ever spend.

 

The "Tampa Rays North" narrative needs to go away.

[Bellhorn04]

The "Tampa Rays North" narrative needs to go away.

 

God yes.

[notin]

The Red Sox have a budget that the Rays never do. Bloom has the ability to sign expensive guys, but should be able to focus on the MiLB guys and get some undervalued players to supplement the $$$ guys.

 

Forgive 5Gold. He operates on the assumption that Bloom doesn’t know the Red Sox have money and will continue to operate the Sox as a small market team, much like how Dan Duquette did when he came over from Montreal or like how Bloom’s predecessor in Tampa is doing with the Dodgers, frantically scavenging and cost-cutting to keep that payroll below the $500 million mark. Just look at his team! He has 3 starters whose previous jobs were all utility infielder!!

[notin]

I only thought it could be a cheaper option. I'm not really psyched on a lot of the pitching FA's this offseason.

 

Max is old and will want too many years.

 

Stroman and Gausman are the two I'd lobby for. Roll the dice for a healthy Syndergaard?

 

I think Robbie Ray is a flash in the pan.

 

DeSclafani as a lower tiered guy? Alex Wood?

 

Alex Wood? When it comes to durability, he makes Eovaldi look like Tim Wakefield…

[notin]

I only thought it could be a cheaper option. I'm not really psyched on a lot of the pitching FA's this offseason.

 

Max is old and will want too many years.

 

Stroman and Gausman are the two I'd lobby for. Roll the dice for a healthy Syndergaard?

 

I think Robbie Ray is a flash in the pan.

 

DeSclafani as a lower tiered guy? Alex Wood?

 

One thing in favor of Stroman and Gausman, besides both having AL East experience, is neither is eligible for a QO (assuming those are still a thing). That cannot be said about Desclafini and Ray…

[harmony]

Not sure they are comfortable ponying up for Rosenthal.

 

I don't think they'll pay for Jansen.

 

Kimbrel's ship has sailed.

 

I guess they'd try to get Raisel Iglesias?

Veteran reliever Joe Smith will be available after posting a 2.04 ERA, 0.91 WHIP and .188 BAA in 22 apperances to date this year with the upstart Seattle Mariners.

[notin]

Veteran reliever Joe Smith will be available after posting a 2.04 ERA, 0.91 WHIP and .188 BAA in 22 apperances to date this year with the upstart Seattle Mariners.

 

That’s not his real name…

[mvp 78]

Alex Wood? When it comes to durability, he makes Eovaldi look like Tim Wakefield…

 

It would be Alex Wood as a 5th starter with Seabold and others at the ready. I wouldn't expect him to be a thrilling signing.

[mvp 78]

One thing in favor of Stroman and Gausman, besides both having AL East experience, is neither is eligible for a QO (assuming those are still a thing). That cannot be said about Desclafini and Ray…

 

Yes. I have always liked Stroman. Gausman was surprisingly good this year. I'd probably overpay for Stroman. I think he's a good guy to have on your club in terms of energy.

[notin]

It would be Alex Wood as a 5th starter with Seabold and others at the ready. I wouldn't expect him to be a thrilling signing.

 

 

Good thing. He’d probably injure himself putting his name on the contract….

[mvp 78]

Veteran reliever Joe Smith will be available after posting a 2.04 ERA, 0.91 WHIP and .188 BAA in 22 apperances to date this year with the upstart Seattle Mariners.

 

Bloom: "Old woman!"

 

Joe Smith: "Man."

 

B: "Sorry. Old man! Whose clubhouse is that?"

 

J: "I'm 37!"

 

B: "What?"

 

J: "I'm 37, I'm not old!"

 

B: "Well, I can't just call you 'man'."

 

J: "Well, you could say 'Joe Smith'."

 

B: "I didn't know you were called Joe Smith."

 

J: "You never bothered to find out, did you?"

 

B: "I did say sorry about the old woman, but from behind you looked--"