2020-2021 Offseason Thread

[Bellhorn04]

I can see non-tendering that whole crowd...

 

The Fungibles.

[notin]

The Fungibles.

 

Good name for a non-descript band...

[Elktonnick]

He said they didn't average 100M in losses, just that they brought in 100M in less revenue. Contracts were prorated and teams still got tv money. That doesn't mean a whole bunch of teams LOST 100M this year.

 

Actually that is not what Spier reported. Here is the exact quote "@alexspeier

Kennedy says MLB teams lost over $100M per club this year. ‘We know we’re going to withstand operating losses. We’re prepared for that.’ Says the Sox expect to invest in team in a fashion similar to what they’ve done over last 20 years.

 

Spier said Kennedy was talking about operating losses not reduced revenues.

[Bellhorn04]

Actually that is not what Spier reported. Here is the exact quote "@alexspeier

Kennedy says MLB teams lost over $100M per club this year. ‘We know we’re going to withstand operating losses. We’re prepared for that.’ Says the Sox expect to invest in team in a fashion similar to what they’ve done over last 20 years.

 

Spier said Kennedy was talking about operating losses not reduced revenues.

 

But how could Kennedy possibly know what the operating losses of other teams were? It makes more sense he was talking about lost revenue.

[mvp 78]

But how could Kennedy possibly know what the operating losses of other teams were? It makes more sense he was talking about lost revenue.

 

And it was solely in relation to fans not being in the ballpark. It was the loss in revenue, not the operating losses.

[Elktonnick]

But how could Kennedy possibly know what the operating losses of other teams were? It makes more sense he was talking about lost revenue.

 

Not at all. The plain text says operating losses. If he had meant reduced revenue he would have said reduced revenue. I am sure Kennedy knows the difference To conclude he meant something other than what he said requires interjecting ones own bias into the plain text. In any case whether it is revenue or bottom line losses. we are unlikely to see many clubs except those with owners who are willing to assume the risk of large losses suddenly go on a spending spree.

[mvp 78]

The Orioles payroll was less than $25M, there's no way they had 100M in operating losses. No way.

[Elktonnick]

And it was solely in relation to fans not being in the ballpark. It was the loss in revenue, not the operating losses.

 

Except that is not what he actually said according to Spier.

[Elktonnick]

The Orioles payroll was less than $25M, there's no way they had 100M in operating losses. No way.

 

The Orioles have other expenses besides payroll

[Bellhorn04]

The Orioles have other expenses besides payroll

 

You don't give up easy.

[mvp 78]

The Orioles have other expenses besides payroll

 

They don't have 75M in Operating Expenses excluding player salaries. No f***ing way.

[mvp 78]

Except that is not what he actually said according to Spier.

 

Except that an ACTUAL DIRECT QUOTE isn't used by Speier. In fact, I couldn't find anything that was directly from Kennedy, just Speier's summation in his tweet. No other source has the full quote.

[Elktonnick]

You don't give up easy.

 

I went through all the data. Kennedy's statement is consistent with MLB's projection of a 4 Billion dollar loss if they played half a season with no fans and prorated salaries. Now others may dispute that but that has been MLB's position from the outset and Kennedy is merely restating MLB 's position.

[Elktonnick]

Except that an ACTUAL DIRECT QUOTE isn't used by Speier. In fact, I couldn't find anything that was directly from Kennedy, just Speier's summation in his tweet. No other source has the full quote.

 

So your position is Alex Spier misquoted Kennedy or Kennedy does not know what he is talking about but you who has no access to MLB's financial records do?

[mvp 78]

So your position is Alex Spier misquoted Kennedy or Kennedy does not know what he is talking about but you who has no access to MLB's financial records do?

 

My position is that my position makes more sense than you saying "the Orioles spend over 75M on non player salary operating expenses in 2020."

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

My position is that my position makes more sense than you saying "the Orioles spend over 75M on non player salary operating expenses in 2020."

 

My son still uses his Orioles alarm clock he got on Orioles Alarm Clock giveaway night.

[mvp 78]

My son still uses his Orioles alarm clock he got on Orioles Alarm Clock giveaway night.

 

Interesting. Maybe each clock cost $10k. That must be where all those operating losses come from!

[harmony]

They certainly used to. As the site owner frequents the comments sections, you can raise questions to him and he answers publicly. And if he thinks he made an error, he addresses them, too...

Baseball Trade Value revised Kyle Seager's trade value after an email to the site regarding Yusei Kikuchi and Seager.

 

Seager remains way undervalued.

[moonslav59]

Need to make room on the 40 for rule 5 guys like:

 

Eduard Bazardo

Kutter Crawford

Chad De La Guerra

Jay Groome

Bryan Mata

Hudson Potts

Roniel Raudes

Jeremy Rivera

Jeisson Rosario

Zach Schellinger

Alex Scherff

Connor Seabold

Connor Wong

 

Clearly, not all of these guys will put on the 40, but I bet the majority are.

 

I can name 18-20 guys I wouldn't even blink, if we traded for scraps or DFA'd.

 

I cannot remember the last time I have seen such a weak bottom 40 man roster on a Sox team.

 

We could add all those 13 and sign 5 FAs, and we wouldn't have to DFA a single highly promising player.

 

Peraza (non tender?)

Brice

Springs

Hall

Stock

Triggs

Kickham

Walden

Lin

Chatham

Hart

Wilson

Aybar

Covey

Godley

Puello

Grullon?

Tapia?

 

Plus, there's Pedey (60 day IL all year?), can trade Brasier, Brewer, Chavis, Barnes, Eovaldi, Beni...

 

IMO, no problem, this winter.

 

 

 

[moonslav59]

Is there anybody on this list anyone feels a strong attachment to?

Lin (out of options)

Peraza

Hart

Brice

Springs

Hall

Stock

Triggs

Kickham

Leyer

Wilson

Aybar

Puello

Edited October 3, 2020 by moonslav59

[notin]

is there anybody on this list anyone feels a strong attachment to?

Lin (out of options)

peraza

hart

brice

springs

hall

stock

triggs

kickham

leyer

wilson

aybar

puello

 

pway-oh!! Pway-oh!!!

[moonslav59]

pway-oh!! Pway-oh!!!

 

I had a feeling I'd hear from you.

[Larry Cook]

Is there anybody on this list anyone feels a strong attachment to?

Lin (out of options)

Peraza

Hart

Brice

Springs

Hall

Stock

Triggs

Kickham

Leyer

Wilson

Aybar

Puello

 

I would be willing to help pack any and/or all of them up and ship them out!

[notin]

Is there anybody on this list anyone feels a strong attachment to?

Lin (out of options)

Peraza

Hart

Brice

Springs

Hall

Stock

Triggs

Kickham

Leyer

Wilson

Aybar

Puello

 

On that list, I keep Stock, Puello and Wilson.

 

But I think I could DFA the suspiciously absent Phillips Valdez...

[moonslav59]

I would be willing to help pack any and/or all of them up and ship them out!

 

Those should be more than enough to add the rule 5's for this year and a couple FAs. If we sign more FAs, here's the second list:

 

Walden

Covey

Godley?

Chatham?

Grullon?

Tapia?

 

Like I said, we have no issues with making room on our 40 man roster for additions.

[Larry Cook]

Those should be more than enough to add the rule 5's for this year and a couple FAs. If we sign more FAs, here's the second list:

 

Walden

Covey

Godley?

Chatham?

Grullon?

Tapia?

 

Like I said, we have no issues with making room on our 40 man roster for additions.

 

The hardest part of this offseason is to sign the five or six free agent players we need to be a playoff calibre team next season while also improving the farm system so we can eventually have a competitively sustainable team.

[oldtimer]

The hardest part of this offseason is to sign the five or six free agent players we need to be a playoff calibre team next season while also improving the farm system so we can eventually have a competitively sustainable team.

 

To have a team that can sustain competitiveness, we have to have a conduit from the minors that brings up 3 to 5 players a year, probably closer to 5. That means maintaining a quality list of prospects and doing a good job of developing them. The ability to develop pitching has yet to be shown, but there is hope.

 

A second aspect of sustained competitiveness is to avoid the FA albatross contracts that has tied the hands of the club. Even resignings to big and unwarranted contracts for sentimental and other reasons has hurt the team and should be avoided. (Sale, Pedroia, Eovaldi are recent examples)

 

Competitive teams need at least average players at every position with enough stars thrown in to be a threat. in the work place today, you have to be an A or B level contributor to survive. People who don't cut it are replaced. How much rope do you give a guy?

 

Also, to be competitive, the team needs at least three quality starters, a closer, good setup men and a BP that doesn't implode under pressure.

 

I believe Bloom is a smart guy and has his own list of key points needed to make and keep the team competitive. Barring bad luck, I think we will see improvements in 2021 and a fully competitive team by 2023. We need to be patient with Bloom and lets see where he takes us.

 

[moonslav59]

The hardest part of this offseason is to sign the five or six free agent players we need to be a playoff calibre team next season while also improving the farm system so we can eventually have a competitively sustainable team.

 

With $60-80M to spend, depending on how Henry views the luxury tax, next year, the FA signing part should not be all that hard. We could sign 4 players at $12M/yr and 4 at $6M/yr and hope 5-6 work out.

 

The draft should help us improve the farm, but we might also be able to trade some FAs to be this winter or next summer to further strengthen it, but if we want to compete in 2021 that may not be something we do. We've been striking out with IFA signings, recently. That used to be one area we got some huge boosts from- Devers, Bogey, D Hern, Moncada>Sale, Margot>Kimbrel, Iggy and others.

 

Let's hope Bloom chooses wisely.

[Bellhorn04]

With $60-80M to spend, depending on how Henry views the luxury tax, next year, the FA signing part should not be all that hard. We could sign 4 players at $12M/yr and 4 at $6M/yr and hope 5-6 work out.

 

moon, we are $68 million under the threshold, but that's BEFORE E-Rod, Perez and all other players not under contract for 2021.

 

I don't think there's quite as much to play with as you're suggesting.

[moonslav59]

To have a team that can sustain competitiveness, we have to have a conduit from the minors that brings up 3 to 5 players a year, probably closer to 5. That means maintaining a quality list of prospects and doing a good job of developing them. The ability to develop pitching has yet to be shown, but there is hope.

 

A second aspect of sustained competitiveness is to avoid the FA albatross contracts that has tied the hands of the club. Even resignings to big and unwarranted contracts for sentimental and other reasons has hurt the team and should be avoided. (Sale, Pedroia, Eovaldi are recent examples)

 

Competitive teams need at least average players at every position with enough stars thrown in to be a threat. in the work place today, you have to be an A or B level contributor to survive. People who don't cut it are replaced. How much rope do you give a guy?

 

Also, to be competitive, the team needs at least three quality starters, a closer, good setup men and a BP that doesn't implode under pressure.

 

I believe Bloom is a smart guy and has his own list of key points needed to make and keep the team competitive. Barring bad luck, I think we will see improvements in 2021 and a fully competitive team by 2023. We need to be patient with Bloom and lets see where he takes us.

 

 

It's hard to disagree, but saying "avoid big FA albatross contracts" is always easy to say in hindsight.

 

How did we know beforehand, that the Manny signing was going to bring us our first 2 rings, but other big signings were going to implode as early as year one? It's a crapshoot.

 

All of our rings involved having and NEEDING at least one massive contract on the team. Can teams win without one or two? Yes, but they are rarities.

 

People point to the 2013 season as "the model" on how to win without signing massive contracts, but don't forget the 3 last place finishes surrounding that season. Also, while Lackey's $16M a year deal does not look "massive," now, it was a pretty big signing back then, and many felt it was an albatross signing after the first 2-3 years.

 

Your points are all correct, but I think signing a big name here and there is usually needed to get a team over the hump. If we swing and miss, yes, it hurts for years to come, but without some of our biggest signings, we may still be ringless.