Roenicke

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I was wondering why RR didn't just order an intentional unintentional walk to Judge in the 8th, instead of letting yet another "pitcher" serve him a BP cookie. Not that anyone believed the Yankees weren't going to win anyway, once they tied it up.

 

But if and when the games matter again to Boston, I would expect such decisions to at least be discussed by the braintrust. Then again, I still don't get why the Yankees pitched to Altuve with the World Series at stake and Marisnick on deck...

[Maxbialystock]

His team has no PITCHING

 

True. However, it is my belief that the manager has more impact on the pitching than on the fielding and hitting. Last night was the first game in this series when the Sox had a shot and in fact had a 1 run lead in the 8th.

 

Roenicke's reliever in the 8th, Barnes, had just given up the tying run with 2 outs and now had a man on 1b with possibly the hottest hitter in MLB coming to the plate. First two pitches were balls. At that point it would have been reasonable to signal not to throw anything hittable--or even to give Judge a pass.

 

I am not saying Roenicke was responsible for last night's loss. Not at all. But I am saying that, given the situation after the game was tied in the 8th, he might have made a better choice on how to pitch to Judge with a 2-0 count.

[vegasbob]

Is there a manager anywhere in baseball history who can win when handed a team with Ryan Weber as the #3 starter?

 

Genius Joe Maddon is actually doing a worse job in terms of results with the Angels and more substantial pitching. Just be glad the Sox didn't win the Shohei Otahni $100million+ sweepstakes, but at least he can hit a bit.

[notin]

True. However, it is my belief that the manager has more impact on the pitching than on the fielding and hitting. Last night was the first game in this series when the Sox had a shot and in fact had a 1 run lead in the 8th.

 

Roenicke's reliever in the 8th, Barnes, had just given up the tying run with 2 outs and now had a man on 1b with possibly the hottest hitter in MLB coming to the plate. First two pitches were balls. At that point it would have been reasonable to signal not to throw anything hittable--or even to give Judge a pass.

 

I am not saying Roenicke was responsible for last night's loss. Not at all. But I am saying that, given the situation after the game was tied in the 8th, he might have made a better choice on how to pitch to Judge with a 2-0 count.

 

That may be, but even the best manager in baseball history is not going to win with a staff where Ryan Weber is the #3 pitcher...

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

That may be, but even the best manager in baseball history is not going to win with a staff where Ryan Weber is the #3 pitcher...

 

My over-35 team coulda used him in last summer's playoffs. I know he's underage, but the league coulda signed a waiver. As it was, we faced two ringers around 32 who threw harder than Weber.

[Swiharts Ghost]

RR is not the guy let’s all admit this now I’m calling Cora now and paving the way back as soon as the punishment is up .Boston has to get a manager like AC in order to get top FA in this rebuild effort .

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

RR is not the guy let’s all admit this now I’m calling Cora now and paving the way back as soon as the punishment is up .Boston has to get a manager like AC in order to get top FA in this rebuild effort .

 

When Cora comes back, don't be surprised if part of the deal behind the scenes will be the recruitment of some good players that relate to him. For instance, there has to be some Astros who didn't throw him under the bus or that he will have make amends with; Springer's free next winter, Correa (from Puerto Rico) the year after...

[Swiharts Ghost]

When Cora comes back, don't be surprised if part of the deal behind the scenes will be the recruitment of some good players that relate to him. For instance, there has to be some Astros who didn't throw him under the bus or that he will have make amends with; Springer's free next winter, Correa (from Puerto Rico) the year after...

 

Is Springer from Boston ? Can’t remember ? But yes in a perfect world AC comes back and is part of this type of transaction.AC represents much more than a garbage can fiasco to Boston .I hope for the sake of this team that I care for and will always support that they all sit down soon .I know AC isn’t a perfect person but who among us is? When looking at the splinter In someone’s eye don’t forget about the tree in your own .I know this is childish but how about getting a few thousand Fans to start the Get Alex Cora Back March on Fenway lol would it hurt ? Hell I may fly up for this .The very least should be flooding the Redsox wit His bring Cora back Calls emails Twitter Facebook Local Radio .

Edited August 4, 2020 by Swiharts Ghost

[notin]

Is Springer from Boston ? Can’t remember ? But yes in a perfect world AC comes back and is part of this type of transaction.AC represents much more than a garbage can fiasco to Boston .I hope for the sake of this team that I care for and will always support that they all sit down soon .I know AC isn’t a perfect person but who among us is? When looking at the splinter In someone’s eye don’t forget about the tree in your own .I know this is childish but how about getting a few thousand Fans to start the Get Alex Cora Back March on Fenway lol would it hurt ? Hell I may fly up for this .The very least should be flooding the Redsox wit His bring Cora back Calls emails Twitter Facebook Local Radio .

 

Springer is from New Britain, CT and attended UConn with Barnes...

[Swiharts Ghost]

Springer is from New Britain, CT and attended UConn with Barnes...

 

Oh wow that’s great .I wonder if he was a Redsox or Yankees fan growing up ? Like the kid .

[Maxbialystock]

That may be, but even the best manager in baseball history is not going to win with a staff where Ryan Weber is the #3 pitcher...

 

You're verb "win" is ill defined. The worst managers in MLB history, without exception, did in fact win games. And the best managers ever lost plenty of games.

 

I do agree no manager would have a winning record with this pitching staff, but do think there will be occasions when adeptness, insight, luck, whatever, by Roenicke can maybe produce a win here and there in a close game. Or put it this way. Is he being paid a salary and should not that salary come with expectations of doing his best to manage the team to wins whenever possible?

[Thunder]

RR is not the guy let’s all admit this now I’m calling Cora now and paving the way back as soon as the punishment is up .Boston has to get a manager like AC in order to get top FA in this rebuild effort .

 

Has it ever occurred to somebody that:

 

A) Cora might not want to come back?

Other teams might want him, and be willing to pay him more?

[mvp 78]

You're verb "win" is ill defined. The worst managers in MLB history, without exception, did in fact win games. And the best managers ever lost plenty of games.

 

I do agree no manager would have a winning record with this pitching staff, but do think there will be occasions when adeptness, insight, luck, whatever, by Roenicke can maybe produce a win here and there in a close game. Or put it this way. Is he being paid a salary and should not that salary come with expectations of doing his best to manage the team to wins whenever possible?

 

Do people think he's intentionally trying to lose?

[mvp 78]

Has it ever occurred to somebody that:

 

A) Cora might not want to come back?

Other teams might want him, and be willing to pay him more?

 

That has occurred to us, but is so outside the realm of reality that clearly he's much more likely to want to come back to BOS even if he had to prostrate himself in front of the media and fans. The real question is if Hang 'Em Chaim Blooming Idiot is smart enough to roll out the red carpet for him. He spent so much time down in TBR that the bats in the belfry have been deafened by the echoing cowbell noises bouncing off the cobwebs. Who know what that absolute madman will want to do. Maybe he's on the hunt for a good HS coach to come in and save Henry some money. HS coaches may be the new market inefficiency!

 

 

 

 

 

[Thunder]

All I know is that if Cora comes back as manager in 2021, it will be hard for me to respect that

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Has it ever occurred to somebody that:

 

A) Cora might not want to come back?

Other teams might want him, and be willing to pay him more?

 

Like LA? Before everyone laughs, a hated super-villain joining his rivals is not unprecedented. Hall-of-Fame Manager Leo Durocher managed the Dodgers for years in Brooklyn, before taking over the Giants in Harlem (when those two NL clubs shared NY, they didn't send each other Christmas cards).

 

Imagine if LA gags again the next couple of years, and if Betts and Price are part of the problem. Dave Roberts would definitely be on the hot seat. Would it be so unthinkable if Cora -- a former Dodger -- is brought in to reconnect Mookie and David with the chief motivator from their glory days?

[oldtimer]

That has occurred to us, but is so outside the realm of reality that clearly he's much more likely to want to come back to BOS even if he had to prostrate himself in front of the media and fans. The real question is if Hang 'Em Chaim Blooming Idiot is smart enough to roll out the red carpet for him. He spent so much time down in TBR that the bats in the belfry have been deafened by the echoing cowbell noises bouncing off the cobwebs. Who know what that absolute madman will want to do. Maybe he's on the hunt for a good HS coach to come in and save Henry some money. HS coaches may be the new market inefficiency!

 

 

 

 

 

 

I would guess that Bloom is a lot smarter than the guys who are calling him names.

[mvp 78]

All I know is that if Cora comes back as manager in 2021, it will be hard for me to respect that

 

Not to get too far into the weeds with the HOU stuff, but it's very odd to me that the only guys who faced the music were Beltran and Cora, two guys no longer with the team. The whole sign stealing program was set up even before Cora got there. I don't believe he was a ring leader any more than the HC, GM or owner. He was just the fallguy.

[mvp 78]

I would guess that Bloom is a lot smarter than the guys who are calling him names.

 

I would bet donuts to dollars that even the dumbest GM in baseball is far more smarter at running a team than any of us are.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

All I know is that if Cora comes back as manager in 2021, it will be hard for me to respect that

 

Why?

[notin]

You're verb "win" is ill defined. The worst managers in MLB history, without exception, did in fact win games. And the best managers ever lost plenty of games.

 

I do agree no manager would have a winning record with this pitching staff, but do think there will be occasions when adeptness, insight, luck, whatever, by Roenicke can maybe produce a win here and there in a close game. Or put it this way. Is he being paid a salary and should not that salary come with expectations of doing his best to manage the team to wins whenever possible?

 

Whenever possible?

 

The Sox are 3-7 with a pitching staff that would be mildly competitive in the Internatioal League. Has it occurred to you he is winning “ whenever possible”?

 

Pick the greatest manager in MLB history. Your choice. What record would he lead this roster through for 10 games?

[notin]

I would bet donuts to dollars that even the dumbest GM in baseball is far more smarter at running a team than any of us are.

 

Only 30 people get to be an MLB GM at a time. That’s the cream rising to the top considering the number who want the job.

 

Some of them build losing teams. But that doesn’t mean they don’t know what they’re doing. Losing is 50% of sports. And it’s going to happen when you’re among the elite even if you are the elite...

[Thunder]

Not to get too far into the weeds with the HOU stuff, but it's very odd to me that the only guys who faced the music were Beltran and Cora, two guys no longer with the team. The whole sign stealing program was set up even before Cora got there. I don't believe he was a ring leader any more than the HC, GM or owner. He was just the fallguy.

 

That doesn't mean he's innocent, or did nothing wrong

[mvp 78]

That doesn't mean he's innocent, or did nothing wrong

 

Would you respect the decision if the Sox brought in Correa, Altuve, Bregman or Springer?

[notin]

Not to get too far into the weeds with the HOU stuff, but it's very odd to me that the only guys who faced the music were Beltran and Cora, two guys no longer with the team. The whole sign stealing program was set up even before Cora got there. I don't believe he was a ring leader any more than the HC, GM or owner. He was just the fallguy.

 

Office Politics 101

 

Anyone no longer with the organization is immediately at fault for all remaining problems.

[Thunder]

Would you respect the decision if the Sox brought in Correa, Altuve, Bregman or Springer?

 

Nope. Springer is still my personal hero, but I no longer want him on my team

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Office Politics 101

 

Anyone no longer with the organization is immediately at fault for all remaining problems.

 

Pol- shut the front door! Just the facts, man: Cora lost his job for something that happened before he was manager of the Red Sox, that was devised before he was coach of the Astros.

[Maxbialystock]

Not to get too far into the weeds with the HOU stuff, but it's very odd to me that the only guys who faced the music were Beltran and Cora, two guys no longer with the team. The whole sign stealing program was set up even before Cora got there. I don't believe he was a ring leader any more than the HC, GM or owner. He was just the fallguy.

 

I buy what you say, which is why I would take Cora back.

[Maxbialystock]

Do people think he's intentionally trying to lose?

 

No. But managers do make mistakes, and I am well aware of the irony of my saying this because in the past I have argued at great length that every MLB manager knows more and is better prepared to make in-game decisions than any of us. In this case, he probably had immediate access to his bench coach and pitching coach. Of course, neither of them has my expertise in putting together a Broadway musical.

[Maxbialystock]

Whenever possible?

 

The Sox are 3-7 with a pitching staff that would be mildly competitive in the Internatioal League. Has it occurred to you he is winning “ whenever possible”?

 

Pick the greatest manager in MLB history. Your choice. What record would he lead this roster through for 10 games?

 

Meh. I honestly think the greatest managers benefited hugely from the players they had, so I can't argue that any of them would do better. But I am saying that this last loss, 9-7 to the Yankees, was a close game in which late inning pitching and pitching decisions played a decisive role for the Sox.

 

So let me ask you this question. Had you been managing, would you have done anything when Barnes went to a 2-0 count vs. Judge with a man on 1b, 2 outs, and the game tied? Can you honestly say you would have let Barnes throw any old pitch he wanted to because it was his job (and the catcher's) and certainly not yours as manager to figure out what to do with Judge in that situation?

 

I am not saying Roenicke's inaction cost the Sox a win because there were too many other ways (than Judge hitting a 2 run dinger) for the Sox to blow it. I am saying he had an opportunity to improve the Sox chances by ordering that Judge been pitched to differently.

Edited August 4, 2020 by Maxbialystock