Yankees sign a Gerrit Cole...

[cp176]

OK. so what moves would you have Chaim do for this coming season to have the big league club "stay competitive" under the mandate from JH that he needs to keep the payroll under $208MM? and what moves are you doing to build the Farm at the same time?

or are you suggesting that JH ignore the ~ $100MM "tax" he would have to pay for not resetting? he would have an icy cold bed for quite some time if he were to piss away $100MM on "tax"....dont you think?

 

I'm pretty sure that making suggestions about what to do and what not to do, is far above my pay grade as a fan. So JH has given a mandate to keep the payroll under 208 million? I did not read that. It is an assumption being made I think. The only thing that I am suggesting is that if moving some of the better players in the game today in order to save going above the luxury tax limit is the goal of the franchise at the expense of winning baseball games today so that that we will be a championship calibre team in the future, it will be a huge turnoff for many fans.

[cp176]

it's a completely different beat.

remind me who was the last GM before DD that left us with both a .500 big league club and a decimated Farm?

 

What a burden a GM has to live with in your world. A pitching staff best with injuries becomes the sole responsibility of the GM. He just never should have relied on all those old guys right. For the record, I don't care who the GM is, as a fan I support them. It is a job I could not do. I should have added that I will support them as long as I think that an honest attempt is being made to put a competitive team out there on the field.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

What a burden a GM has to live with in your world. A pitching staff best with injuries becomes the sole responsibility of the GM. He just never should have relied on all those old guys right. For the record, I don't care who the GM is, as a fan I support them. It is a job I could not do. I should have added that I will support them as long as I think that an honest attempt is being made to put a competitive team out there on the field.

 

Also, if you look back at posts last winter when the RED SOX -- not solely the GM -- signed Sale and Eovaldi, most fans were happy the ORGANIZATION was investing in the most important commodity... that just won a World Series: starting pitching.

 

Sure, there were concerns about health -- as there are with any veteran pitchers. But who here or anywhere suggested any better options a year ago? There were no 26-year-old Cy Young winners available (like the once-in-a-lifetime Pedro deal). And after the kajillions thrown around at free agent arms this past month, the Sale and Eovaldi contracts no longer look exorbitant across the industry.

 

Maybe instead of harping on bad financial planning, we should finally accept that the staff injuries/off years were both coincidental, unlucky and more likely attributed to poor recovery/preparatory planning by the coaches. I know I'm far from ready to agree with Yankee posters who insist that Sox pitching will suck now and for-evahhhhh more!!!!

[moonslav59]

Good posts cp and gg.

 

I don't feel all that optimistic about 2020, but I've felt this way before and been surprised.

[jacksonianmarch]

Optimism and realism don’t always mesh.

 

It isn’t that the Sox pitching is “gonna suck now and forevah!” It’s more that they hitched their fate to three pitchers who are now oft injured and/or diminished.

[Bellhorn04]

I'm pretty sure that making suggestions about what to do and what not to do, is far above my pay grade as a fan. So JH has given a mandate to keep the payroll under 208 million? I did not read that. It is an assumption being made I think.

 

As reported by numerous sources on Sept 27/19:

 

"This year we need to be under the CBT and that was something we've known for more than a year now," Henry said. "If you don't reset there are penalties so we've known for some time now we needed to reset as other clubs have done."

[Bellhorn04]

Optimism and realism don’t always mesh.

 

Yankee fans have certainly seen that over the last decade.

 

Seriously, Jax, what kind of tripe is that.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Optimism and realism don’t always mesh.

 

I agree. Optimism is signing a top free agent pitcher and hoping another All-Star starter stays healthy an entire year.

 

Realism is that Cole and Severino have won zero rings combined... and that they both lost to Boston in the playoffs, a little over a year ago.

 

Optimism is also hoping that a rival's rotation that suffered even more injuries will continue to break down into a morass of mediocrity before spiraling down the drain through the dark pipes that snake into the basement and eventually underground.

 

Realism is that Sale and Eovaldi won the World Series, combined to pitch in 11 postseason games, and each beat New York in the ALDS... a little over a year ago.

Edited December 14, 2019 by 5GoldGloves:OF,75
typo

[jacksonianmarch]

Optimism and realism don’t always mesh.

 

I agree. Optimism is signing a top free agent pitcher and hoping another All-Star starter stays healthy an entire year.

 

Realism is that Cole and Severino have won zero rings combined... and that they both lost to Boston in the playoffs, a little over a year ago.

 

Optimism is also hoping that a rival's rotation that suffered even more injuries will continue to break down into a morass of mediocrity before spiraling down the drain through the dark pipes that snake into the basement and eventually underground.

 

Realism is that Sale and Eovaldi won the World Series, combined to pitch in 11 postseason games, and each beat New York in the ALDS... a little over a year ago.

 

I feel like I’m in a f***ing alternate universe here. You’re stuck in the past. Are you sure you haven’t had a psychotic break?

 

Sale is damaged goods. Lost velocity due to a shoulder issue from 2018. Lost the last two mo the of 2019 with a still u resolved elbow issue. And I’m the one who isn’t in reality thinking that he isn’t gonna make it through the year healthy?

 

Price is damaged goods. He’s an older pitcher who hasn’t been healthy two of the last three seasons, lost velocity and is now coming off wrist surgery. But he’s a good bet to stay healthy?

 

Nate Eovaldi had one magical month in October 2018. He’s never been healthy, ever. He is coming off another poor year with poor health. And I’m the delusional one?

 

You added the king of durability and production in Perez. But he’s a great signing, of course, because YOU want him to be, lol

 

Erod has a good year last year with great run support and he stayed healthy for once. Of course, he’s gonna stay healthy forever!

Edited December 15, 2019 by jacksonianmarch

[oldtimer]

 

I feel like I’m in a f***ing alternate universe here. You’re stuck in the past. Are you sure you haven’t had a psychotic break?

 

Sale is damaged goods. Lost velocity due to a shoulder issue from 2018. Lost the last two mo the of 2019 with a still u resolved elbow issue. And I’m the one who isn’t in reality thinking that he isn’t gonna make it through the year healthy?

 

Price is damaged goods. He’s an older pitcher who hasn’t been healthy two of the last three seasons, lost velocity and is now coming off wrist surgery. But he’s a good bet to stay healthy?

 

Nate Eovaldi had one magical month in October 2018. He’s never been healthy, ever. He is coming off another poor year with poor health. And I’m the delusional one?

 

You added the king of durability and production in Perez. But he’s a great signing, of course, because YOU want him to be, lol

 

Erod has a good year last year with great run support and he stayed healthy for once. Of course, he’s gonna stay healthy forever!

 

I don't disagree with you when you make a good point, just to be disagreeable to a Yankee fan, but the signing of Cole for $36 mil for the next 9 years seems like an incredible risk to me. How many pitchers hang around to pitch that many seasons? If he is damaged goods in 3 years, the Yankees will have to carry a competitive balance tax hit for years to come. Its hard to believe Yankee fandom is unconcerned about such a high risk. If the Sox had enough to sign him, I would have been against the length of contract and there are others here to express similar concerns.

[notin]

I don't disagree with you when you make a good point, just to be disagreeable to a Yankee fan, but the signing of Cole for $36 mil for the next 9 years seems like an incredible risk to me. How many pitchers hang around to pitch that many seasons? If he is damaged goods in 3 years, the Yankees will have to carry a competitive balance tax hit for years to come. Its hard to believe Yankee fandom is unconcerned about such a high risk. If the Sox had enough to sign him, I would have been against the length of contract and there are others here to express similar concerns.

 

Like me

[Bellhorn04]

 

I don't disagree with you when you make a good point, just to be disagreeable to a Yankee fan, but the signing of Cole for $36 mil for the next 9 years seems like an incredible risk to me. How many pitchers hang around to pitch that many seasons? If he is damaged goods in 3 years, the Yankees will have to carry a competitive balance tax hit for years to come. Its hard to believe Yankee fandom is unconcerned about such a high risk. If the Sox had enough to sign him, I would have been against the length of contract and there are others here to express similar concerns.

 

The fact is that to obtain a pitcher of Cole's caliber on the free agent market, that was what you had to do. Reportedly the Angels and Dodgers were willing to go 8 years at the same rate and drew the line there. The Yanks went to 9 to win the auction.

 

We're lucky in a sense that the Angels and Dodgers were there to push the Yanks to this level.

 

If I was a Yankee fan I'd be very happy to have Cole, while also very aware that at some point this will be an albatross. It's just the way it works.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

 

I feel like I’m in a f***ing alternate universe here. You’re stuck in the past. Are you sure you haven’t had a psychotic break?

 

Sale is damaged goods. Lost velocity due to a shoulder issue from 2018. Lost the last two mo the of 2019 with a still u resolved elbow issue. And I’m the one who isn’t in reality thinking that he isn’t gonna make it through the year healthy?

 

Price is damaged goods. He’s an older pitcher who hasn’t been healthy two of the last three seasons, lost velocity and is now coming off wrist surgery. But he’s a good bet to stay healthy?

 

Nate Eovaldi had one magical month in October 2018. He’s never been healthy, ever. He is coming off another poor year with poor health. And I’m the delusional one?

 

You added the king of durability and production in Perez. But he’s a great signing, of course, because YOU want him to be, lol

 

Erod has a good year last year with great run support and he stayed healthy for once. Of course, he’s gonna stay healthy forever!

 

I'm not going to say you can't read, but apparently your psychosis comes from regularly visiting a RED SOX forum and constantly having to defend yourself and your storied franchise that won so many titles last century... because in my post I personally didn't mention Price (who's a goner), Perez (a cheaper Porcello) or ERod (who I've never championed, but instead have pointed out that he led the AL in walks).

 

My post was in response to your optimism and reality. The living-in-the-past facts -- again -- are that Sale and Eovaldi have won the World Series recently, like 14 months ago... unlike Gardner, who celebrated the last pinstripe title 122 months ago; or compared to the never-in-the-past rings of Cole and Severino.

 

That's not to say that the latter two can't or won't win soon -- or that my guys can't or won't again (because at least there can be no dispute that Sale and Evo know how).

 

A lot can change in one year -- no one here needs to be reminded of that -- except maybe the most optimistic NY fans who refuse to acknowledge that's it's not automatic that they'll have another Next-Man-Up 103-win club. Reality is how many fellow Yankee fans aren't just a tad uneasy about who their powerhouse is counting on manning the two most important defensive positions on the field (SS and C).

[notin]

 

I feel like I’m in a f***ing alternate universe here. You’re stuck in the past. Are you sure you haven’t had a psychotic break?

 

Sale is damaged goods. Lost velocity due to a shoulder issue from 2018. Lost the last two mo the of 2019 with a still u resolved elbow issue. And I’m the one who isn’t in reality thinking that he isn’t gonna make it through the year healthy?

 

Price is damaged goods. He’s an older pitcher who hasn’t been healthy two of the last three seasons, lost velocity and is now coming off wrist surgery. But he’s a good bet to stay healthy?

 

Nate Eovaldi had one magical month in October 2018. He’s never been healthy, ever. He is coming off another poor year with poor health. And I’m the delusional one?

 

You added the king of durability and production in Perez. But he’s a great signing, of course, because YOU want him to be, lol

 

Erod has a good year last year with great run support and he stayed healthy for once. Of course, he’s gonna stay healthy forever!

 

I do disagree on Sale. If you look at his career, his velocity has been going up and down from season to season for years. And even with all that, he still managed top 6 Cy Young seasons nearly every year.

 

I’ve never been a fan of the Eovaldi health history. He is definitely an oddity to throw as hard as he does for his size. But part of me always wonders - is that maybe the root cause here?

 

I do think Price will be someone else’s problem. Don’t care who’s.

 

 

And I think te rotation will be Sale-Eovaldi-Rodriguez (in whatever order) probably followed by two openers, one of whom will be Darwinzon Hernandez...

[jacksonianmarch]

The fact is, the Sox are entering a down phase. The Astros are at the end of their window. Our time comes now with no other big AL power

[notin]

The fact is, the Sox are entering a down phase. The Astros are at the end of their window. Our time comes now with no other big AL power

 

Chicken counter.

 

BTW the Astros are not dead yet. Unless Hector Rondon was a bigger factor than I realized....

[Bellhorn04]

Chicken counter.

 

BTW the Astros are not dead yet. Unless Hector Rondon was a bigger factor than I realized....

 

Cole?

[notin]

Cole?

 

They already replaced him with Greinke. Pro-active.

 

Also with Preston Tucker, Chase Whitley, Jose Urquidy, and Abraham Toro ready to join the first full season of Yordan Alvarez, I’d say the Astros are not dead yet...

[Bellhorn04]

They already replaced him with Greinke. Pro-active.

 

Also with Preston Tucker, Chase Whitley, Jose Urquidy, and Abraham Toro ready to join the first full season of Yordan Alvarez, I’d say the Astros are not dead yet...

 

Fair enough.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Claiming a team is in a down phase or at the end of its window sure sounds like opinion to me. The only definite facts about a lot of good players on both Boston and Houston is that they are proven winners.

[jacksonianmarch]

Chicken counter.

 

BTW the Astros are not dead yet. Unless Hector Rondon was a bigger factor than I realized....

 

Losing Gerrit Cole doesn’t help

[notin]

Losing Gerrit Cole doesn’t help

 

Gaining Greinke full time along with Chase Whitley does...

[S5Dewey]

 

I feel like I’m in a f***ing alternate universe here. You’re stuck in the past. Are you sure you haven’t had a psychotic break?

 

Sale is damaged goods. Lost velocity due to a shoulder issue from 2018. Lost the last two mo the of 2019 with a still u resolved elbow issue. And I’m the one who isn’t in reality thinking that he isn’t gonna make it through the year healthy?

 

Price is damaged goods. He’s an older pitcher who hasn’t been healthy two of the last three seasons, lost velocity and is now coming off wrist surgery. But he’s a good bet to stay healthy?

 

Nate Eovaldi had one magical month in October 2018. He’s never been healthy, ever. He is coming off another poor year with poor health. And I’m the delusional one?

 

You added the king of durability and production in Perez. But he’s a great signing, of course, because YOU want him to be, lol

 

Erod has a good year last year with great run support and he stayed healthy for once. Of course, he’s gonna stay healthy forever!

 

 

I don't disagree with you when you make a good point, just to be disagreeable to a Yankee fan, but the signing of Cole for $36 mil for the next 9 years seems like an incredible risk to me. How many pitchers hang around to pitch that many seasons? If he is damaged goods in 3 years, the Yankees will have to carry a competitive balance tax hit for years to come. Its hard to believe Yankee fandom is unconcerned about such a high risk. If the Sox had enough to sign him, I would have been against the length of contract and there are others here to express similar concerns.

 

Like me

 

And me.

[moonslav59]

Gaining Greinke full time along with Chase Whitley does...

 

They also have McCullers back.

[notin]

They also have McCullers back.

 

That clinches it. I'm penning them in for the AL pennant. I don't even see a point in playing out the season.

 

Houston-Atlanta World Series. Let's just play this out next week and then there is still time to start the 2020-2021 offseason...

[moonslav59]

That clinches it. I'm penning them in for the AL pennant. I don't even see a point in playing out the season.

 

Houston-Atlanta World Series. Let's just play this out next week and then there is still time to start the 2020-2021 offseason...

 

I do think the Astros look slightly better than the Yanks, right now, but there is more wheeling and dealing to come.

[notin]

I do think the Astros look slightly better than the Yanks, right now, but there is more wheeling and dealing to come.

 

The Yankees have some trade chips. Some good (Andujar), some overrated but not bad (Frazier), and some flat out bad (Happ).

 

But I think Cashman spent his allowance...

[TylerD]

Good posts cp and gg.

 

I don't feel all that optimistic about 2020, but I've felt this way before and been surprised.

Agreed. It’s nice to have low expectations lol

[notin]

Agreed. It’s nice to have low expectations lol

 

Honestly, before the 2018 season started I was not sure this team was going to make the post-season that year...

[jacksonianmarch]

Gaining Greinke full time along with Chase Whitley does...

 

Greinke is not Cole. And Whitley had a 7.99 ERA in the minors last year with 7.5 walks per 9. He ain’t ready.