A Realistic View at 2020: Part I

[Bellhorn04]

I'm 99% sure the Sox will find a way to reset, this season. Whether it's trading Betts or Price or Eovaldi & JBJ or some combination, they will reset.

 

Not sure why you're so convinced. They backpedaled on the re-set statement almost immediately, first saying it wasn't a mandate and then saying the top priority was a competitive team.

[Slasher9]

Not sure why you're so convinced. They backpedaled on the re-set statement almost immediately, first saying it wasn't a mandate and then saying the top priority was a competitive team.

 

come on bell. you know that was damage control because: season tix.

[Bellhorn04]

come on bell. you know that was damage control because: season tix.

 

And how are ticket sales going?

[moonslav59]

Not sure why you're so convinced. They backpedaled on the re-set statement almost immediately, first saying it wasn't a mandate and then saying the top priority was a competitive team.

 

To me, it makes much more sense to reset this year than next.

 

To me, they "backpedaled because they want to sell season tickets.

 

They may just trade JBJ and wait until July to decide, but since I don't think we will make the playoffs this year, I'm guessing they trade enough players to get under the line by season's end.

 

It's just my opinion. I've been wrong before.

[Bellhorn04]

To me, it makes much more sense to reset this year than next.

 

To me, they "backpedaled because they want to sell season tickets.

 

I don't necessarily disagree, but what do we know about how ticket sales are doing? Maybe the King of Talksox could give us some observations on that.

 

Right now the average Sox ticket buyer has to be rather befuddled about what team he's going to be seeing.

[Slasher9]

And how are ticket sales going?

 

i have no idea. i try and get up to Fenway for 1 game a year.

but that is the only reason i can come up with on how quickly they backpeddled the "mandate" statement.

marketing 101...don't undersell your product and don't piss off your clients.

the PR department had to be flipping out when the "mandate" statement was first made.

[Slasher9]

September 27th:

Boston Red Sox controlling owner John Henry said Friday the team plans to cut salary during the offseason in order to fall below the competitive balance tax threshold for the 2020 MLB season.

"This year we need to be under the CBT and that was something we've known for more than a year now," Henry said. "If you don't reset there are penalties so we've known for some time now we needed to reset as other clubs have done."

 

later that day Tom Werner walked it back (or tried to) per Alex Speier:

Werner then clarifies that Sox have a goal to stay under, but may end up going past the threshold depending on circumstances.

 

Me? i'll go with what the owner said.

[moonslav59]

I don't necessarily disagree, but what do we know about how ticket sales are doing? Maybe the King of Talksox could give us some observations on that.

 

Right now the average Sox ticket buyer has to be rather befuddled about what team he's going to be seeing.

 

I'm not sure it matters all that much, but I'm sure it makes some difference.

 

I remember not feeling so great going into 2013, but that was a very exciting year for Sox fans.

 

Henry will make a boatload of money no matter what, so it's basically up to him about us trying for one last hurrah or resetting the tax and maybe start back up with the spending in 2021 (including Betts?).

[moonslav59]

September 27th:

Boston Red Sox controlling owner John Henry said Friday the team plans to cut salary during the offseason in order to fall below the competitive balance tax threshold for the 2020 MLB season.

"This year we need to be under the CBT and that was something we've known for more than a year now," Henry said. "If you don't reset there are penalties so we've known for some time now we needed to reset as other clubs have done."

 

later that day Tom Werner walked it back (or tried to) per Alex Speier:

Werner then clarifies that Sox have a goal to stay under, but may end up going past the threshold depending on circumstances.

 

Me? i'll go with what the owner said.

 

If, somehow, we are looking like contenders in July, I can see Henry giving the okay to put off resetting another year.

 

The worst thing that can happen is us not spending this year, not winning, and also not resetting the tax.

[Bellhorn04]

September 27th:

Boston Red Sox controlling owner John Henry said Friday the team plans to cut salary during the offseason in order to fall below the competitive balance tax threshold for the 2020 MLB season.

"This year we need to be under the CBT and that was something we've known for more than a year now," Henry said. "If you don't reset there are penalties so we've known for some time now we needed to reset as other clubs have done."

 

later that day Tom Werner walked it back (or tried to) per Alex Speier:

Werner then clarifies that Sox have a goal to stay under, but may end up going past the threshold depending on circumstances.

 

Me? i'll go with what the owner said.

 

Except there have been further statements from the FO since then, echoing the walk-back theme.

[moonslav59]

Except there have been further statements from the FO since then, echoing the walk-back theme.

 

Has "the man," Henry walked it back?

[Bellhorn04]

Has "the man," Henry walked it back?

 

No, but he has often let others speak on these matters. You might remember this Lucchino guy...

 

It's reported that Henry actually owns only about 40% of the shares. He's 'principal shareholder', but he doesn't own a majority of shares, so he can't make any decisions on his own. He needs Werner's support.

[a700hitter]

And how are ticket sales going?

I am betting that they are not going that well just based on the marketing that I am seeing.

[a700hitter]

I don't necessarily disagree, but what do we know about how ticket sales are doing? Maybe the King of Talksox could give us some observations on that.

 

Right now the average Sox ticket buyer has to be rather befuddled about what team he's going to be seeing.

I just have anecdotal information. I let my season tickets go, because they raised the prices and the secondary market sucks. I got notified that they have not released my tickets into the pool yet and that I can still buy them. Translation: No one has purchased them yet.

 

The guy from Ace who would take a lot of my tickets each season, told me that they are cutting way back on their inventory of Red Sox tickets. Last season was a very bad year for that segment of their business and their outlook for 2020 is not good. They will usually ride out a bad season to keep the relationship going, but they are seeing a bad trend. The offer that he made to me was for all the best games at a substantial loss. I don't mind losing $500 -$1000 to keep the season plan going, but if I start out at with a loss on day 1, I would end up taking a bath as the season progresses.

[Bellhorn04]

I just have anecdotal information. I let my season tickets go, because they raised the prices and the secondary market sucks. I got notified that they have not released my tickets into the pool yet and that I can still buy them. Translation: No one has purchased them yet.

 

The guy from Ace who would take a lot of my tickets each season, told me that they are cutting way back on their inventory of Red Sox tickets. Last season was a very bad year for that segment of their business and their outlook for 2020 is not good. They will usually ride out a bad season to keep the relationship going, but they are seeing a bad trend. The offer that he made to me was for all the best games at a substantial loss. I don't mind losing $500 -$1000 to keep the season plan going, but if I start out at with a loss on day 1, I would end up taking a bath as the season progresses.

 

Thanks.

[a700hitter]

What is Jeremy Jeffress's asking price? And is Scooter Gennett damaged goods?

[S5Dewey]

I just have anecdotal information. I let my season tickets go, because they raised the prices and the secondary market sucks. I got notified that they have not released my tickets into the pool yet and that I can still buy them. Translation: No one has purchased them yet.

 

The guy from Ace who would take a lot of my tickets each season, told me that they are cutting way back on their inventory of Red Sox tickets. Last season was a very bad year for that segment of their business and their outlook for 2020 is not good. They will usually ride out a bad season to keep the relationship going, but they are seeing a bad trend. The offer that he made to me was for all the best games at a substantial loss. I don't mind losing $500 -$1000 to keep the season plan going, but if I start out at with a loss on day 1, I would end up taking a bath as the season progresses.

 

FWIW, the price of my Spring Training tickets doesn't seem to have gone up for 2020. I'm paying $30 more than I did last year but there are 18 games in 2020 rather than the 17 that were played in 2017. The face price on my ticket is $30 so it looks like the price hasn't gone up.

[notin]

What is Jeremy Jeffress's asking price? And is Scooter Gennett damaged goods?

 

Jeffress is the one who might be damaged goods. Milwaukee released him last year after rosters expanded and they had no real reason to clear the space. Possible indication of a serious physical problem...

[Slasher9]

I just have anecdotal information. I let my season tickets go, because they raised the prices and the secondary market sucks. I got notified that they have not released my tickets into the pool yet and that I can still buy them. Translation: No one has purchased them yet.

 

The guy from Ace who would take a lot of my tickets each season, told me that they are cutting way back on their inventory of Red Sox tickets. Last season was a very bad year for that segment of their business and their outlook for 2020 is not good. They will usually ride out a bad season to keep the relationship going, but they are seeing a bad trend. The offer that he made to me was for all the best games at a substantial loss. I don't mind losing $500 -$1000 to keep the season plan going, but if I start out at with a loss on day 1, I would end up taking a bath as the season progresses.

 

damn. sucks but i would understand walking away from that.

[Bellhorn04]

Ticket sales have to be impeded by the team's uncertain state. It's January 7 and we still have no clue if Betts, Price, Eovaldi, JBJ or possibly JDM will be on the team.

 

It's starting to feel like a bit of a fiasco.

[Bellhorn04]

Maybe the Sox picked the wrong time to attempt a re-set, and maybe no other teams are particularly interested in helping them out.

[moonslav59]

Maybe the Sox picked the wrong time to attempt a re-set, and maybe no other teams are particularly interested in helping them out.

 

The Dodgers were trying hard to get a top talent, but they have become more fiscally responsible, lately. I still think they are our best hope.

[Slasher9]

Maybe the Sox picked the wrong time to attempt a re-set, and maybe no other teams are particularly interested in helping them out.

 

thanks Dave!

[Bellhorn04]

The Dodgers were trying hard to get a top talent, but they have become more fiscally responsible, lately. I still think they are our best hope.

 

What's interesting is that Dodgers fans are apparently complaining quite loudly about the team's offseason, so much that Kasten went public to defend the front office's approach and spending.

[Bellhorn04]

thanks Dave!

 

I think if there's blame John Henry deserves a share too. He's been a great owner, but I don't think his grumbling about the payroll and the tax was necessary at all.

[notin]

What's interesting is that Dodgers fans are apparently complaining quite loudly about the team's offseason, so much that Kasten went public to defend the front office's approach and spending.

 

They’ve been ripped on MLB radio by multiple hosts.

 

But honestly, isn’t this a fairly typical off-season for them? Since Friedman took over, how many splashy off-seasons have they had?

[notin]

I think if there's blame John Henry deserves a share too. He's been a great owner, but I don't think his grumbling about the payroll and the tax was necessary at all.

 

Well, was having some of the highest payrolls in MLB history necessary?

 

 

Henry might have signed off on a lot of these deals, but I can guarantee he was promised a better ROI than he got in 2018 as well...

[Bellhorn04]

Well, was having some of the highest payrolls in MLB history necessary?

 

Henry might have signed off on a lot of these deals, but I can guarantee he was promised a better ROI than he got in 2018 as well...

 

Oh yeah. And I'm a big Henry fan.

 

But we can't forget that he personally stuck the knife in Ben and hired DD, knowing exactly what DD's game was.

[oldtimer]

The Dodgers were trying hard to get a top talent, but they have become more fiscally responsible, lately. I still think they are our best hope.

 

Unless there is a substantial change in the competitive balance tax I think that teams that get involved in very expensive long term contracts (especially for pitchers) will ultimately rue the day they took them on. We are in that boat now. The Yankees got themselves into that position with Cole.

 

I hope Bloom is one of the smarter executives and Friedman of the Dodgers is also smart and looking for an equitable trade. I think it is in both teams interests to move ahead, with the Dodgers main drive being to win the WS now while the Sox main drive is to reset, get rid of Price's contract and be in a position to try and resign Betts for 2021 and beyond. I'm assuming it will take Betts along with Price to cut a deal and the Dodgers will part with a couple of very good prospects and take the majority of Price's salary.

[jacksonianmarch]

Maybe the Sox picked the wrong time to attempt a re-set, and maybe no other teams are particularly interested in helping them out.

 

I disagree. They picked a great time for a re-set. Let the Yanks window come and go and by the time the team is rebuilt, the Yanks should be coming down. I honestly don’t think the Sox can just reset and be fine. They need to be rebuilt