Sale to IL with elbow injury

[kenmeister]

When it comes to those starters, we are between the proverbial rock and hard place. You can either hope that Sale, Price and Eovaldi come back to form or you can try to trade them and eat a pile of money in the process. With the latter you also have to replace them.

 

My guess is we hope.

 

I think there's a lot of good reasons to hope. Sale I'm already expecting the Tommy John announcement in spring training or a few weeks into the season, but Price and Eovaldi I am optimistic will have much better years next year, just by virtue of doing the right things over the offseason to be in better shape.

[moonslav59]

I think all 4 get non-tendered. Hembree might be offered arbitration. Might.

 

And like last year, Leon might be re-signed anyway...

 

I think Leon signs before arb for near min. We will keep Hembree.

 

Wright is a tough call.

 

I happen to think JBJ has trade value, and he'll be dealt not non tendered.

[FredLynn]

I think Leon signs before arb for near min. We will keep Hembree.

 

Wright is a tough call.

 

I happen to think JBJ has trade value, and he'll be dealt not non tendered.

 

Wright is a sleeze ball. I don't want him on my team. As for JBJ, I agree. He has trade value. Maybe someone will give us a marginal AA player for him.

[fxkatt]

It doesn't count against the 2020 cap. It was already counted in because it was part of the guaranteed money in the contract.

 

What about salary paid a player traded to another team as in we trade pitcher X and pay 60% of his salary to his new team. Is this part of the cap or just an owner loss. I assume it counts against the cap, but not totally sure. (I can't google this properly to find the answer)

[moonslav59]

Wright is a sleeze ball. I don't want him on my team. As for JBJ, I agree. He has trade value. Maybe someone will give us a marginal AA player for him.

 

I'm disgusted by Wright, too, but the guy has been a good pitcher with a few stretches of very good pitching. I'm thinking he has trade value, too.

 

Maybe someone would give us a decent prospect for JBJ, Wright & Johnson.

[moonslav59]

According to one website, David Price, Nathan Eovaldi and Chris Sale have median negative values of $44.8 million, $26.6 million and $14 million, respectively:

 

https://www.baseballtradevalues.com/trade-simulator/

 

Wow, that's $85M in projected "sunken cost".

 

I want to keep Sale.

 

So, Price is owed $96M. We'd have to pay $45M just to get someone to take him for a bag of balls. We'd save $50M, but $45M is a lot to pay for nothing. Maybe there is some team with a guy making close to $45M that we can trade straight -up.

 

Eovaldi is owed $51M. That $26.6M is over half of what he's owed. It probably makes sense to let him comeback in hopes that he builds up value, either for us going forward or to trade at the deadline.

 

I doubt we trade any of the 3.

 

The only other big contract that can even be considered for a trade might be (assuming a reset & rebuild) a JD trade. I wonder, if we'd have to pay much for him.

[Bellhorn04]

What about salary paid a player traded to another team as in we trade pitcher X and pay 60% of his salary to his new team. Is this part of the cap or just an owner loss. I assume it counts against the cap, but not totally sure. (I can't google this properly to find the answer)

 

That counts against the cap.

[moonslav59]

That counts against the cap.

 

Yes. If not, we'd be seeing a lot of trades with cash attached (by the Sox, anyways).

[fxkatt]

Yes. If not, we'd be seeing a lot of trades with cash attached (by the Sox, anyways).

 

Yes, that's exactly what I was thinking (too big an advantage to the already advantaged), but I wasn't 100% sure... I wonder if this $$ falls under the category of dead money or does it have a name all its own. (google got me nowhere) To me, it's plain old dead money.

[moonslav59]

Yes, that's exactly what I was thinking (too big an advantage to the already advantaged), but I wasn't 100% sure... I wonder if this $$ falls under the category of dead money or does it have a name all its own. (google got me nowhere) To me, it's plain old dead money.

 

I'm not sure there is an official MLB name for that money.

 

I do know this is how I view our remaining dead money:

 

$14.3M Castillo (2020) Does not count against luxury tax

$5M Sandoval (2020) Does not count against luxury tax

 

$25.3M Pedroia (2020+2021) $13.75M x 2 on luxury tax budget

 

Pending...

$145M Sale ($29M x 5) $25.6M luxury tax due to defered money

$96M Price ($32M x 3) $31M luxury tax

$51M Eovaldi ($17M x 3 years) $17M Luxury tax

 

 

[oldtimer]

I'm not sure there is an official MLB name for that money.

 

I do know this is how I view our remaining dead money:

 

$14.3M Castillo (2020) Does not count against luxury tax

$5M Sandoval (2020) Does not count against luxury tax

 

$25.3M Pedroia (2020+2021) $13.75M x 2 on luxury tax budget

 

Pending...

$145M Sale ($29M x 5) $25.6M luxury tax due to defered money

$96M Price ($32M x 3) $31M luxury tax

$51M Eovaldi ($17M x 3 years) $17M Luxury tax

 

 

 

It smells of Dog Doo all over it.

[Bellhorn04]

It smells of Dog Doo all over it.

 

Castillo, Sandoval and Pedroia were all left over from Ben, of course.

[jacksonianmarch]

Any Sandoval money counts. Rusney’s Money doesn’t.

[Bellhorn04]

Any Sandoval money counts. Rusney’s Money doesn’t.

 

But Sandoval's 5 million buyout was already counted in 2015-2019 payroll for tax purposes because it was part of the 95 million guaranteed value.

[moonslav59]

But Sandoval's 5 million buyout was already counted in 2015-2019 payroll for tax purposes because it was part of the 95 million guaranteed value.

 

Exactly. It DID count, but we are done with it counting after this season.

 

FINALLY!

[oldtimer]

Exactly. It DID count, but we are done with it counting after this season.

 

FINALLY!

 

Yes, but DD got us out f the fring pan but right back into the fire. Pedey, Eovaldi, Sale, Price. We have to cross our fingers that a couple of our starters will come back and at least be viable 2nd or 3rd starters if no longer ace material. I don't see trade possibilities for any of the above. Even with us eating part of the contracts it is unlikely.

[Bellhorn04]

Yes, but DD got us out f the fring pan but right back into the fire. Pedey, Eovaldi, Sale, Price. We have to cross our fingers that a couple of our starters will come back and at least be viable 2nd or 3rd starters if no longer ace material. I don't see trade possibilities for any of the above. Even with us eating part of the contracts it is unlikely.

 

DD had nothing to do with Pedey.

[notin]

Yes, but DD got us out f the fring pan but right back into the fire. Pedey, Eovaldi, Sale, Price. We have to cross our fingers that a couple of our starters will come back and at least be viable 2nd or 3rd starters if no longer ace material. I don't see trade possibilities for any of the above. Even with us eating part of the contracts it is unlikely.

 

Would you trade Price straight up for Jason Heyward?

 

Heyward has a lower AAV ($23mill) than Price ($31mill) and could take over CF or allow for Betts to move to CF, allowing the Sox to non-tender Bradley. Price would be reunited with Madden in Chicago. That's a savings of $18-20mill towards the luxury tax, minus what it takes to replace Price.

 

baseballtradevalues.com gives both players roughly the same surplus trade value. Heyward has a $(-50.2) million with Price having a $(-44.8)million...

[Slasher9]

I'm not sure there is an official MLB name for that money.

 

 

if they ever give it a name it should be "bobby bonilla"

[moonslav59]

Yes, but DD got us out f the fring pan but right back into the fire. Pedey, Eovaldi, Sale, Price. We have to cross our fingers that a couple of our starters will come back and at least be viable 2nd or 3rd starters if no longer ace material. I don't see trade possibilities for any of the above. Even with us eating part of the contracts it is unlikely.

 

Pedey wasn't on DD, but your point is well taken.

[moonslav59]

Would you trade Price straight up for Jason Heyward?

 

Heyward has a lower AAV ($23mill) than Price ($31mill) and could take over CF or allow for Betts to move to CF, allowing the Sox to non-tender Bradley. Price would be reunited with Madden in Chicago. That's a savings of $18-20mill towards the luxury tax, minus what it takes to replace Price.

 

baseballtradevalues.com gives both players roughly the same surplus trade value. Heyward has a $(-50.2) million with Price having a $(-44.8)million...

 

How about Price, JBJ and Johnson for Heywood and Chatwood (owed $13M next year) and get the Cubs to pitch in some cash?

[jacksonianmarch]

Your system is entirely devoid of pitching talent. Dealing off Price for an overpriced asset that doesn’t pitch is a bad decision

[notin]

Your system is entirely devoid of pitching talent. Dealing off Price for an overpriced asset that doesn’t pitch is a bad decision

 

Except that non-pitcher makes has an AAV $8mill lower.

 

If Price bounces back, it’s a horrible deal. But if Price continues to decline, they’d be better off replacing. $8mill alone won’t do that, but it at least creates a bigger headroom in the budget...