A Realistic View at 2019: Part II

[Bellhorn04]

You guys are ok with a 22 mil a year DH?

 

Even Kimmi liked the JDM contract.

[moonslav59]

You guys are ok with a 22 mil a year DH?

 

I was at the time, and I thought he'd be playing OF more than he did, or he'd be tried at 1B.

[moonslav59]

You guys are ok with a 22 mil a year DH?

 

The point was about liking it at the time.

 

It worked. We won a ring, largely because of JD.

 

Now, it may not look all that great, but I'd do it again for 1 ring.

[SoxHop]

The point was about liking it at the time.

 

It worked. We won a ring, largely because of JD.

 

Now, it may not look all that great, but I'd do it again for 1 ring.

 

That's true.

[moonslav59]

That's true.

 

So, let me ask you the Q you asked us, "Are you OK with DH making $22M a year?

 

(If it directly leads to a ring.)

[SoxHop]

So, let me ask you the Q you asked us, "Are you OK with DH making $22M a year?

 

(If it directly leads to a ring.)

 

Totally. Last year was the most amazing thing I've ever seen. But the hangover is hurting.

[moonslav59]

Totally. Last year was the most amazing thing I've ever seen. But the hangover is hurting.

 

The Price hangover is worse.

[oldtimer]

So, let me ask you the Q you asked us, "Are you OK with DH making $22M a year?

 

(If it directly leads to a ring.)

 

Lets put it another way. Would I pay 22 Mil for a DH if I had that choice today? The answer is no. JDM has done what was expected of him and more but i aging now and is prone to injury with his back. He is a liability in the outfield defensively, so he has to be looked at as primarily a DH. He probably has helped some of our guys with their hitting, note Devers taking a deep breaath before stepping in for instance. The JDM contract is history and I wouldn't increase it to keep him, but we have to live with it for 2 more years unless he ops out.

[notin]

So, let me ask you the Q you asked us, "Are you OK with DH making $22M a year?

 

(If it directly leads to a ring.)

 

Yes if he can do his job and hit like JD.

 

If JD played 1b or LF but was a terrible fielder, would that make him worth $22mill?

[Slasher9]

So, let me ask you the Q you asked us, "Are you OK with DH making $22M a year?

 

(If it directly leads to a ring.)

 

i am OK with the $217MM for price due to the parade so i guess i would have to say yes.

I was OK with the JDM signing when it happened because i definitely thought he would be transitioning to first base.

i would not sign a $22MM DH. (without the devil guaranteeing parade)

Edited August 21, 2019 by Slasher9

[Bellhorn04]

i would not sign a $22MM DH.

 

What if, hypothetically speaking, that DH was the best hitter in baseball?

[Slasher9]

What if, hypothetically speaking, that DH was the best hitter in baseball?

 

on a 1 year contract i would def consider it. a 5 year / $110MM? not without the devils guarantee of a parade....

[Bellhorn04]

on a 1 year contract i would def consider it. a 5 year / $110MM? not without the devils guarantee of a parade....

 

I think 22 mill for one of the top hitters is perfectly fair.

 

The going rate for the top all-around players in the game now is about 35 mill.

 

So you're paying about 60% of that. And you don't have as much injury concern.

[moonslav59]

Yes if he can do his job and hit like JD.

 

If JD played 1b or LF but was a terrible fielder, would that make him worth $22mill?

 

Hell, no, but the DH argument would not be made.

 

That was kind of my point.

 

JD's bat has been worth $22M alone. I don't want him in the field, except in NL parks, and even then, I'd rest him on some those days, instead of others.

 

Will it be worth that much going forward?

 

Stay tuned.

[Slasher9]

I think 22 mill for one of the top hitters is perfectly fair.

 

The going rate for the top all-around players in the game now is about 35 mill.

 

So you're paying about 60% of that. And you don't have as much injury concern.

 

i can see your line of thought. to me there is only one player worth the 10 year $350MM contract. and IMO he will go down as the greatest baseball player ever when all is said and done....

[notin]

i would not sign a $22MM DH. (without the devil guaranteeing parade)

 

 

Why not? The DH is an important position. It's not where you put players you want to give a day off to.

 

Would you sign a closer to a $22mill contract before a DH? Assuming each is the best in the game at their respective positions?

 

Who would you give $22mill to first - JD Martinez or Aroldis Chapman?

[notin]

i can see your line of thought. to me there is only one player worth the 10 year $350MM contract. and IMO he will go down as the greatest baseball player ever when all is said and done....

 

Your prices are a little less than reality considering that player would probably not settle for a 10 year $350 mill contract, and in fact has a 12 year $430 mill contract already...

[Nick]

The problem is not JD. the problem is non performing contracts.

 

We're paying final year and player option for Sandoval. This has been a dead contract for what, three years now?

 

We're paying Pedey this year and next couple of years along with minimal participation out of him for past two years. I'm not blaming Pedey. He's hurt.

 

I am a big fan of Eovaldi signing. But his absence has taxed our entire pitching staff.

 

Porcello is struggling this year but he's in his final year.

 

We let Nunez go and eat his $5M contract.

 

There's now no point in bringing back Pearce.

 

Moreland just looks unathletic, struggling physically. Again, luckily he's in his last year.

 

I doubt JD will opt out this year. Why? What American league contender will pay him large sum to be a DH? More likely he opts out after the 2020 season when his annual salary takes a dip.

 

I'd offer Betts long term contract after this season with series of opt outs starting 2022. That means he's only tied to Red Sox for one additional season. You can front load the contract so both sides would be happy.

[Slasher9]

Your prices are a little less than reality considering that player would probably not settle for a 10 year $350 mill contract, and in fact has a 12 year $430 mill contract already...

 

sorry...i was off by 800k per season. your right...completely unrealistic!!!!

[Slasher9]

Why not? The DH is an important position. It's not where you put players you want to give a day off to.

 

Would you sign a closer to a $22mill contract before a DH? Assuming each is the best in the game at their respective positions?

 

Who would you give $22mill to first - JD Martinez or Aroldis Chapman?

 

i never said the DH wasnt important. and i never said its where you put players for a day off. why try and strawman me?

no, i would not sign a closer for $22MM.

i would easily give JDM a 1 year 22MM contract over any closer ever.

whats your point?

[Bellhorn04]

sorry...i was off by 800k per season. your right...completely unrealistic!!!!

 

The years matter too of course.

 

Even when it's Mike Trout, 12 years is a long freakin' time to be paying.

[notin]

i never said the DH wasnt important. and i never said its where you put players for a day off. why try and strawman me?

no, i would not sign a closer for $22MM.

i would easily give JDM a 1 year 22MM contract over any closer ever.

whats your point?

 

I'm just wondering why people undervalue DH. If the guy can hit, pay him. A lot of the best hitters in the league are awful fielders but make money, and that's actually a worse case scenario, beucae they can give a lot of runs back...

[Bellhorn04]

I'm just wondering why people undervalue DH. If the guy can hit, pay him. A lot of the best hitters in the league are awful fielders but make money, and that's actually a worse case scenario, beucae they can give a lot of runs back...

 

One of the things WAR is good for, IMO...

[Slasher9]

I'm just wondering why people undervalue DH. If the guy can hit, pay him. A lot of the best hitters in the league are awful fielders but make money, and that's actually a worse case scenario, beucae they can give a lot of runs back...

 

well i happen to be one of the baseball fans that values defense a whole heckuva lot. most times i am in the defense > offense camp.

but you are right...the DH is different as he is hitter only and cannot negatively effect the game with poor defense. i dont mind paying a premium for that and thats why i answered i would give JDM the 22MM before Chapman (or any other closer really). a #1 or #2 SP? that would be a different answer.

[Slasher9]

The years matter too of course.

 

Even when it's Mike Trout, 12 years is a long freakin' time to be paying.

 

i honestly believe year 12 of that contract will still be a bargain. it is a shame that he is stuck on the west coast. if he was Boston or NY i believe many would have a different view of him.

[Bellhorn04]

i honestly believe year 12 of that contract will still be a bargain.

 

I hope we're both around to find out.

[notin]

well i happen to be one of the baseball fans that values defense a whole heckuva lot. most times i am in the defense > offense camp.

but you are right...the DH is different as he is hitter only and cannot negatively effect the game with poor defense. i dont mind paying a premium for that and thats why i answered i would give JDM the 22MM before Chapman (or any other closer really). a #1 or #2 SP? that would be a different answer.

 

I would point out having a good dedicated DH can help defensively, as it allows for a good glove/no hit player at a key defensive position without really killing the team offensively.

 

Obviously a 1 or 2 SP typically costs more than a DH, but I think I'd be more apt to give the long term mega deal to a DH because those pitcher contracts can be very risky for injuries...

[notin]

One of the things WAR is good for, IMO...

 

Very true, although if having someone like Martinez at DH alloows the #9 hitter to be some Nick Ahmed type at SS with less risk offensively, that counters the defense issue...

[Maxbialystock]

I don't approve of the DH, but do like what the Sox have done with that position. JDM is definitely above average for a DH, but at $22M is also pricey. Last year that made a lot of sense because it was obvious that the addition of JDM made the whole lineup better. This year he's still pretty good, as is the lineup, but the drivers now are Devers and Bogie, both of whom are in the top ten in MLB in runs batted in. They are also #1 and #3 in doubles. And Betts is still #1 in runs scored.

[fxkatt]

Martinez has an opt-out clause within his contract for after the 2019 season and one for the next two contract years. Martinez, if he chooses to remain in Boston for 2020, will be gifted $23.750 million.J

 

I hope JD's opt-in doesn't turn out to be one more GIFT. May he play out the full season with eyes on either his next contract or a lower payout here.