MLB FA Collusion

[jacksonianmarch]

Brad Brach joins a growing list of players charging MLB owners with collusion. The players haven’t actually publicized any evidence until Brach did yesterday. Brach said that he had almost no contact with teams until very late in the FA season. Once teams starting coming to his door, they were coming with the same 1 year, $3-ish million dollar offers. This is similar to the early 2000s, when players like Fernando Vina were given the exact same contract offers in FA and it was later found to be collusion. The owners agreed to pay $12 mil to the MLBPA and avoid admitting the charges back then. I anticipate the players are suspecting the same thing now.

[notin]

The C-word gets thrown around every off-season when contract records aren’t shattered before Christmas. That teams weren’t throwing big money at Brad Brach while bigger names were still available is hardly proof. Brach needs to realize his best selling point was that he was the cheap alternative reliever. And he needs to understand that when your selling point is a lower cost, it’s not something anyone is willing to pay extra for...

[dgalehouse]

There may or may not be " collusion " , but that is certainly the player's perception. Just about every player interviewed says the same thing . Whatever you want to call it , the owners do seem to have a " game plan ."

[Bellhorn04]

Well, in the last 2 weeks or so we've had the following expenditures:

 

Harper 330 million

Machado 300

Arenado 260

Total 890 million

 

That's not chump change.

[notin]

There may or may not be " collusion " , but that is certainly the player's perception. Just about every player interviewed says the same thing . Whatever you want to call it , the owners do seem to have a " game plan ."

 

Is this slow off-season even coming from the owners?

 

“Collusion” implies the owners worked it out together. Typically the charge is the owners work together to not sign each other’s free agents. That the Dodgers weren’t even in on Machado and the Nats dropped out on Harper very early does seem contradictory.

 

I think a lot of owners or GMs or both realized the flaw in paying players heavily for the downside of their careers based on what they did on the rise and peak...

[moonslav59]

Well, in the last 2 weeks or so we've had the following expenditures:

 

Harper 330 million

Machado 300

Arenado 260

Total 890 million

 

That's not chump change.

 

...and rumors that contract prices will start falling might be wrong.

[Northern Star]

Comes back to my idea of an ebay for GMs, where bids are made and everyone sees the highest bid but not which team made it. This would prevent teams overpaying through being told that the guy had other offers.

[Bellhorn04]

Comes back to my idea of an ebay for GMs, where bids are made and everyone sees the highest bid but not which team made it. This would prevent teams overpaying through being told that the guy had other offers.

 

I have no idea how those 'bid' rules work.

 

In the Jon Lester auction the numbers were reported very publicly that the Sox final bid was 135 million and the Cubs beat that by 20 million to seal the deal. And I don't think those numbers were ever disputed.

[notin]

Comes back to my idea of an ebay for GMs, where bids are made and everyone sees the highest bid but not which team made it. This would prevent teams overpaying through being told that the guy had other offers.

 

 

So basically turning it into a Yahoo auction league...

[Slasher9]

1st world problems.....

[mvp 78]

The collusion was caused by the penalties imposed by the tax cap. They need to fix this in the next MLBPA negotiations and also install a salary floor for teams.

[SCM33]

The collusion was caused by the penalties imposed by the tax cap. They need to fix this in the next MLBPA negotiations and also install a salary floor for teams.

 

That wont happen.

 

Owners want a salary cap, players don't.

Players want a salary floor, owners don't.

 

Can't have it both ways. The future of baseball might be in jeopardy with these hard stances, especially with the owners appearing to be getting the upperhand in the last couple offseasons. The strike nearly killed baseball in 1994. With less and less youth involved in baseball across the world.....this could really, really hurt the game as we know it.

[mvp 78]

That wont happen.

 

Owners want a salary cap, players don't.

Players want a salary floor, owners don't.

 

Can't have it both ways. The future of baseball might be in jeopardy with these hard stances, especially with the owners appearing to be getting the upperhand in the last couple offseasons. The strike nearly killed baseball in 1994. With less and less youth involved in baseball across the world.....this could really, really hurt the game as we know it.

 

MLBPA signed a s***** deal. They need to hold out as long as they can. I won't hold my breath though.

[jacksonianmarch]

The MLBPA gave up the stronger lux tax penalties and didn't really get anything in the deal. The stronger penalties have turned the top bracket into a salary cap while really encouraging teams to stay below the first line after multiple years of exceeding it. The MLBPA should fight this. Maybe owners have learned their lesson and aren't willing to dish out big contracts for older players. Well then, lessen the control on rookies and the players will hit the market earlier. The owners and the players don't want a salary floor. With a salary floor will come a hard salary cap. In baseball, you don't have what you have in the other leagues. Some teams are raking in no money and are subsidized by the rest of the league. Those teams cannot come close to the cap or else become bankrupt. The cap will only limit a select few teams while not increasing the impetus of the low income squads and you'll run into what you ran into these past two seasons. If I were Tony Clark, I would offer the owners two options. 1. No luxury tax or 2. Lux tax caps as is without progressive penalties and draft pick or INTL fund machinations while shortening rookie control to 4 years and arb after 2. I would also add in a year of service time being activated at ANY point during a season. This would get rid of the manipulation

[moonslav59]

The MLBPA gave up the stronger lux tax penalties and didn't really get anything in the deal. The stronger penalties have turned the top bracket into a salary cap while really encouraging teams to stay below the first line after multiple years of exceeding it. The MLBPA should fight this. Maybe owners have learned their lesson and aren't willing to dish out big contracts for older players. Well then, lessen the control on rookies and the players will hit the market earlier. The owners and the players don't want a salary floor. With a salary floor will come a hard salary cap. In baseball, you don't have what you have in the other leagues. Some teams are raking in no money and are subsidized by the rest of the league. Those teams cannot come close to the cap or else become bankrupt. The cap will only limit a select few teams while not increasing the impetus of the low income squads and you'll run into what you ran into these past two seasons. If I were Tony Clark, I would offer the owners two options. 1. No luxury tax or 2. Lux tax caps as is without progressive penalties and draft pick or INTL fund machinations while shortening rookie control to 4 years and arb after 2. I would also add in a year of service time being activated at ANY point during a season. This would get rid of the manipulation

 

Option 1 would not help the players much, if that was all they got.

 

It's more important for the players to ask for these things...

 

1. double the minimum wage

2. player control is for 5 years

3. abs years begin after year 2

4. expand roster to 27 players (29 in September with non more than 15 pitchers)

5. expand 40 man roster to 44

6. create a min total salary threshold for teams with penalties for not reaching it at double the amount.

7. keep luxury tax

 

[Jack Flap]

No collusion! Witch hunt! Sad!!

[SCM33]

Option 1 would not help the players much, if that was all they got.

 

It's more important for the players to ask for these things...

 

1. double the minimum wage

2. player control is for 5 years

3. abs years begin after year 2

4. expand roster to 27 players (29 in September with non more than 15 pitchers)

5. expand 40 man roster to 44

6. create a min total salary threshold for teams with penalties for not reaching it at double the amount.

7. keep luxury tax

 

 

That is a lot.

1. Why? Baseball is already the highest paid player annual salaries, by a lot.

2. Player control should be less than that. 3 years.....if the team cant figure out what to do with a player in 3 years (most cases, he is 24/25/26 by this point) then allow the player to leave.

3. ok

4. Why do they need 27 players? What is wrong with 25? I know this it nitpicking, but......rosters already have guys that never play, or never pitch. I could see MAYBE 1 extra spot for a pitcher, as sometimes teams get burned out in blowouts or extra inning games......but that doesnt happen often enough.

5. Fine, give 4 more players the opportunity to be called up without designating someone.

6. Owners will never go for this. Never.

7. Yes, keep the luxury tax. If anything, increase the penalties for going over (Sox would be screwed if that happened).

[moonslav59]

That is a lot.

1. Why? Baseball is already the highest paid player annual salaries, by a lot.

2. Player control should be less than that. 3 years.....if the team cant figure out what to do with a player in 3 years (most cases, he is 24/25/26 by this point) then allow the player to leave.

3. ok

4. Why do they need 27 players? What is wrong with 25? I know this it nitpicking, but......rosters already have guys that never play, or never pitch. I could see MAYBE 1 extra spot for a pitcher, as sometimes teams get burned out in blowouts or extra inning games......but that doesnt happen often enough.

5. Fine, give 4 more players the opportunity to be called up without designating someone.

6. Owners will never go for this. Never.

7. Yes, keep the luxury tax. If anything, increase the penalties for going over (Sox would be screwed if that happened).

 

I don't expect they'd get half of this, but that's what they should start with.

 

The vast majority of the money goes just a few players. Doubling min wage while keeping the luxury tax would even the money more, which most players would like.

 

Shortening years of team control is fine, but owners would want a lot to give that up.

 

[mvp 78]

I just can't feel bad for the owners. They rip off young talent like Blake Snell, but then cry poor when they have to pay market rate. The system is broken.

[Slasher9]

I just can't feel bad for the owners. They rip off young talent like Blake Snell, but then cry poor when they have to pay market rate. The system is broken.

 

we will get the best people to fix this.

[notin]

we will get the best people to fix this.

 

 

Robot arbiters now!!

[BillyWilliams]

Jeff Passan

‏

Verified account

 

@JeffPassan

37m37 minutes ago

More

In the last week, Major League Baseball teams have guaranteed more than $1 billion to 10 players via contract extensions. Five of those deals -- Mike Trout, Chris Sale, Jacob deGrom, Paul Goldschmidt and Alex Bregman -- were for nine figures. The total spent: $1,073,000,000.

[bkzwhitestrican]

Jeff Passan

‏

Verified account

 

@JeffPassan

37m37 minutes ago

More

In the last week, Major League Baseball teams have guaranteed more than $1 billion to 10 players via contract extensions. Five of those deals -- Mike Trout, Chris Sale, Jacob deGrom, Paul Goldschmidt and Alex Bregman -- were for nine figures. The total spent: $1,073,000,000.

 

Get Mueller on the case!!

[mvp 78]

https://mlb.nbcsports.com/2019/03/29/mlb-awards-a-championship-belt-to-the-team-which-keeps-salaries-lowest-in-arbitration/

 

If you think this is anything other than a challenge to pay the players as little as they can legally get away with, get a load of this:

 

"The​ Belt changes hands shortly​ after season’s​ end,​ in a crowded​ conference​ room​ at​ a luxury resort,​ where​ delegates​ from every​​ MLB team have been summoned for a symposium on arbitration. For three hours, they will work together at the direction of the league to set recommendations, which teams will use in negotiations with their players. It’s a thankless job. So before the meeting adjourns, they’ll celebrate an unsung hero in this battle over dollars. The ceremony ends with the presentation of a replica championship belt, awarded by the league to the team that did most to “achieve the goals set by the industry.” In other words: The team that did the most to keep salaries down in arbitration."

 

Yes, an actual belt. There have been rumors about this for some time — when I went to that arbitration competition last year I spoke to people who mentioned it — but thanks to Carig’s excellent reportage, Major League Baseball has now admitted that that’s a thing.

 

Whenever money matters come up, people who take ownership’s side said say “hey, it’s a business.” What they fail to understand is that while, yes, it’s all about the money, in some respects beating the players and holding down salaries as much as possible is a game to them too.

 

STOP ROOTING FOR THESE BILLIONAIRES AND THEIR CHECKBOOKS. THEY DIDN'T BECOME BILLIONAIRES BY PINCHING PENNIES, THEY DID IT BY BEING ABJECT *******S.

[Bellhorn04]

https://mlb.nbcsports.com/2019/03/29/mlb-awards-a-championship-belt-to-the-team-which-keeps-salaries-lowest-in-arbitration/

 

If you think this is anything other than a challenge to pay the players as little as they can legally get away with, get a load of this:

 

"The​ Belt changes hands shortly​ after season’s​ end,​ in a crowded​ conference​ room​ at​ a luxury resort,​ where​ delegates​ from every​​ MLB team have been summoned for a symposium on arbitration. For three hours, they will work together at the direction of the league to set recommendations, which teams will use in negotiations with their players. It’s a thankless job. So before the meeting adjourns, they’ll celebrate an unsung hero in this battle over dollars. The ceremony ends with the presentation of a replica championship belt, awarded by the league to the team that did most to “achieve the goals set by the industry.” In other words: The team that did the most to keep salaries down in arbitration."

 

Yes, an actual belt. There have been rumors about this for some time — when I went to that arbitration competition last year I spoke to people who mentioned it — but thanks to Carig’s excellent reportage, Major League Baseball has now admitted that that’s a thing.

 

Whenever money matters come up, people who take ownership’s side said say “hey, it’s a business.” What they fail to understand is that while, yes, it’s all about the money, in some respects beating the players and holding down salaries as much as possible is a game to them too.

 

STOP ROOTING FOR THESE BILLIONAIRES AND THEIR CHECKBOOKS. THEY DIDN'T BECOME BILLIONAIRES BY PINCHING PENNIES, THEY DID IT BY BEING ABJECT *******S.

 

Weird.

 

It seems to me that arbitration salaries should be just about the least of the players' concerns, though.

[mvp 78]

Weird.

 

It seems to me that arbitration salaries should be just about the least of the players' concerns, though.

 

I think the drag on arb salaries should be a huge concern. Why should these guys get paid pennies on the dollar just because they've only been in the league a certain amount of time?

[Slasher9]

No Collusion!

sad!

[Bellhorn04]

I think the drag on arb salaries should be a huge concern. Why should these guys get paid pennies on the dollar just because they've only been in the league a certain amount of time?

 

I hear what you're saying. But Mookie's making 20 million this year and it'll be closer to 30 million next year.

 

Arb salaries have been steadily going up, that's why I'm saying it doesn't really seem to be the problem.

 

The players who are really getting short-changed are the pre-arb guys who have big seasons.

[mvp 78]

I hear what you're saying. But Mookie's making 20 million this year and it'll be closer to 30 million next year.

 

Arb salaries have been steadily going up, that's why I'm saying it doesn't really seem to be the problem.

 

The players who are really getting short-changed are the pre-arb guys who have big seasons.

 

Mookie deserved to make $20M in 2017. You know how much he made that year? $1M. What if he had a catastrophic injury? These players need to make the right amount of money.

 

After amassing 20.2 fWAR in 3.5 years, he still only earned $10.5M in 2018. He was unpaid...

[dgalehouse]

The owners are not colluding to hold down salaries . They have worked out a " plan " to do it . All a matter of semantics .