Is there anyone who thinks.......

[dustcover]

Is there anyone who thinks the Sox would have 78 w's and be up 8 1/2 games on the Yankees at this time if Farrell was still managing? Credit Dombrowski for not only the masterful job he has down in choreographing the roster but also in bringing on board Cora to serve as maestro. I'm impressed!

[royf19]

In answer to the question, maybe. The Farrell bashing IMO always was been over the the top. He won three division titles in five years, the only Sox manager to do that, and won a World Series. Benintendi, Bogaerts and Betts are all hitting better than last year. To say it's solely because of Cora ignores the fact that Bogaerts and Betts had very good years under Farrell in 2016 and ignores the fact that Bogaerts was hitting fine last year until he got hit in the Tampa game and ignore that Betts was having a decent year until the 30-game slump around August, which can happen to any player. Farrell didn't have J.D. Martinez, which is a huge upgrade over Hanley at DH, and although Devers hasn't quite hit like he did at the end of last year, he's still an upgrade at 3B over what the Sox had there the first four months last year. So the improved offense certainly would have made the record better than it was at this time last year. As for handling the pitching, Farrell was much better at it than he's given credit for by his critics. In fact, I would say it was his strength. So I don't know if the Sox would have 78 wins with Farrell, but I think they would definitely have more than they had at this point last year.

 

All this said, Cora was probably the right man for the job. In dealing with the young players on this roster and the make-up of the roster overall, I would say Cora is better suited for it. Farrell was probably better suited for a veteran roster like the team had in 2013.

[dustcover]

In answer to the question, maybe. The Farrell bashing IMO always was been over the the top. He won three division titles in five years, the only Sox manager to do that, and won a World Series. Benintendi, Bogaerts and Betts are all hitting better than last year. To say it's solely because of Cora ignores the fact that Bogaerts and Betts had very good years under Farrell in 2016 and ignores the fact that Bogaerts was hitting fine last year until he got hit in the Tampa game and ignore that Betts was having a decent year until the 30-game slump around August, which can happen to any player. Farrell didn't have J.D. Martinez, which is a huge upgrade over Hanley at DH, and although Devers hasn't quite hit like he did at the end of last year, he's still an upgrade at 3B over what the Sox had there the first four months last year. So the improved offense certainly would have made the record better than it was at this time last year. As for handling the pitching, Farrell was much better at it than he's given credit for by his critics. In fact, I would say it was his strength. So I don't know if the Sox would have 78 wins with Farrell, but I think they would definitely have more than they had at this point last year.

 

All this said, Cora was probably the right man for the job. In dealing with the young players on this roster and the make-up of the roster overall, I would say Cora is better suited for it. Farrell was probably better suited for a veteran roster like the team had in 2013.

 

All excellent observations,Roy. A man after my own heart, thoughtful, concise, and intelligent. Please don't take that the wrong way!

[notin]

In answer to the question, maybe. The Farrell bashing IMO always was been over the the top. He won three division titles in five years, the only Sox manager to do that, and won a World Series. Benintendi, Bogaerts and Betts are all hitting better than last year. To say it's solely because of Cora ignores the fact that Bogaerts and Betts had very good years under Farrell in 2016 and ignores the fact that Bogaerts was hitting fine last year until he got hit in the Tampa game and ignore that Betts was having a decent year until the 30-game slump around August, which can happen to any player. Farrell didn't have J.D. Martinez, which is a huge upgrade over Hanley at DH, and although Devers hasn't quite hit like he did at the end of last year, he's still an upgrade at 3B over what the Sox had there the first four months last year. So the improved offense certainly would have made the record better than it was at this time last year. As for handling the pitching, Farrell was much better at it than he's given credit for by his critics. In fact, I would say it was his strength. So I don't know if the Sox would have 78 wins with Farrell, but I think they would definitely have more than they had at this point last year.

 

All this said, Cora was probably the right man for the job. In dealing with the young players on this roster and the make-up of the roster overall, I would say Cora is better suited for it. Farrell was probably better suited for a veteran roster like the team had in 2013.

 

Agree. There was no way to tell.

[Bellhorn04]

Farrell was kind of an inscrutable, lantern-jawed sphinx.

 

The way he 'handled' the Pedroia/Machado and Price/Eckersley episodes reflected badly on his management skills and had a lot to do with his demise, I think.

 

FWIW I don't know if anyone else read this, but Pete Abraham reported that one of those 'highly placed sources' told him he witnessed Farrell and DD having quite a heated shouting match about the Pedroia/Machado thing. That's never good for your job security.

 

Anyway I think kudos are due to DD for the Cora hiring. He got the right guy and he did it in a quick and decisive fashion.

[oldtimer]

What Cora seems to bring to the table, in addition to new coaches, is the point of view of being aggressive at the plate and on the base paths. Maybe that also translates into a different morale on the team. That cannot really be inferred although is possible. I saw Farrell as passive during the game and jokingly referred to him as the standing Bhudda. Both Cora and Farrell had/have their questionable decisions but the results for both have been/are good.

[Thunder]

I give Cora a lot of credit here. To this point, he's only made a handful of managerial mistakes, and none that I can really pinpoint exactly. But, the offense is much better than last year, thanks to JD, and the pitching is much better. When we get a bad start this season, we have a higher chance at a win, because our offense is much more lethal than last year. We're a better team than what we were with Farrell the last two years.

[S5Dewey]

 

FWIW I don't know if anyone else read this, but Pete Abraham reported that one of those 'highly placed sources' told him he witnessed Farrell and DD having quite a heated shouting match about the Pedroia/Machado thing. That's never good for your job security.

 

That's interesting. I didn't see the article but I'd loved to have been a fly on the wall listening to that. If you stumble onto it again please send the link along.

[Bellhorn04]

That's interesting. I didn't see the article but I'd loved to have been a fly on the wall listening to that. If you stumble onto it again please send the link along.

 

This was in the first Yankees series when Holt got spiked and Kelly retaliated. PA wrote about how much better the Sox handled things this time around. I'm not sure if this particular statement came in an article or in a tweet.

[Kimmi]

In answer to the question, maybe. The Farrell bashing IMO always was been over the the top. He won three division titles in five years, the only Sox manager to do that, and won a World Series. Benintendi, Bogaerts and Betts are all hitting better than last year. To say it's solely because of Cora ignores the fact that Bogaerts and Betts had very good years under Farrell in 2016 and ignores the fact that Bogaerts was hitting fine last year until he got hit in the Tampa game and ignore that Betts was having a decent year until the 30-game slump around August, which can happen to any player. Farrell didn't have J.D. Martinez, which is a huge upgrade over Hanley at DH, and although Devers hasn't quite hit like he did at the end of last year, he's still an upgrade at 3B over what the Sox had there the first four months last year. So the improved offense certainly would have made the record better than it was at this time last year. As for handling the pitching, Farrell was much better at it than he's given credit for by his critics. In fact, I would say it was his strength. So I don't know if the Sox would have 78 wins with Farrell, but I think they would definitely have more than they had at this point last year.

 

All this said, Cora was probably the right man for the job. In dealing with the young players on this roster and the make-up of the roster overall, I would say Cora is better suited for it. Farrell was probably better suited for a veteran roster like the team had in 2013.

 

Very good post Roy. The offense was going to be better this year, even without the additions of Cora and JD. That said, I believe that Cora's more aggressive philosophy at the plate is part of the improvement.

 

Farrell doesn't deserve a lot of the criticism that he received. That said, it does appear that Farrell was perhaps putting some undue stress on the players by focusing too much on their daily numbers. I think last year's group was trying too hard.

 

Cora seems to have the players behind him 100%. I liked his signing from the get go.

[Kimmi]

What Cora seems to bring to the table, in addition to new coaches, is the point of view of being aggressive at the plate and on the base paths. Maybe that also translates into a different morale on the team. That cannot really be inferred although is possible. I saw Farrell as passive during the game and jokingly referred to him as the standing Bhudda. Both Cora and Farrell had/have their questionable decisions but the results for both have been/are good.

 

My focus with managers has always been the off field stuff, not the in game decisions.

 

Cora has found a way to get his players to buy into everything he is selling. The players know that Cora has their backs. As one of the players said, they will jump through hoops for Cora.

 

Also, I think that Roenicke is an excellent complement to Cora.

[Spudboy]

Everything is honky dory when your team has the best record in baseball.

[S5Dewey]

Everything is honky dory when your team has the best record in baseball.

 

Nothing solves problems like winning!!

[Kimmi]

Everything is honky dory when your team has the best record in baseball.

 

Good point.

[Maxbialystock]

I'm a big Cora fan and completely agree he was a great find by DD. But royf19, as always, makes a ton of sense. Cora has been helped by JDM, who leads MLB in dingers and rbi's and has an OPS over 1.000--Ortiz country. Moonslav has said repeatedly that he expected Betts, Beni, Bogey, et al, to be better this year than last. Price is way better this year, ditto Wright (until he went back on the DL) and ERod. Pom has been terrible, but, heck, I never liked him anyway.

 

Here's a little something to think about with respect to Farrell. Last year this board regularly erupted in denunciations of the unconscionable base running that Farrell seemed unwilling or unable to control. This year I think we have about the same number of mistakes--perhaps fewer now that HanRam is gone--but, more than that, the Sox currently lead MLB in stolen bases. Of some interest is that this year there are still the same complaints about Benintendi not being under control, but in fact he has 20 SB's, one less than Mookie, and has been caught just once. The Sox currently succeed 83% on attempted steals, which is pretty good. But I honestly think--maybe Bill James is whispering in my ear--that the key to the offense this year is what it has always been: a high OPS, including a high slugging percentage and plenty of dingers.

 

All that said, I don't think this team would be this good under Farrell. Hats off to Cora.

[Spudboy]

I suspect that the Sox success in stealing bases ( 2nd ) has a lot to do with our new 1st base coach.

 

That guy seems to know his s***.

[dgalehouse]

I think Farrell had become somewhat burned out. Cora brings a more energetic , enthusiastic approach. The players can pick up on that. The results are obvious.

[OH FOY]

Season is incomplete until its over. Post-season different animal. There is so many bad teams hard to determine, how good this team really is. 1 good series with the Yanks, is good, but it starts for me Post-Season.

[S5Dewey]

I suspect that the Sox success in stealing bases ( 2nd ) has a lot to do with our new 1st base coach.

 

That guy seems to know his s***.

 

I think it's that, and it's also this team's overall offensive success. In the past pitchers could throw a pitch fairly confident that they wouldn't 'pay the big price' for a mistake pitch. This year they know that every hitter can hit one out or find a hole if they make that mistake. That results in more nibbling which creates more pitches that are harder for the catcher to handle.

 

Tying in with 'that guy knowing his s***', I remember OB & Jerry saying that the Sox are picking up on a pitcher's tendencies. They may have done research to determine what pitch a pitcher will throw in certain situations and base their decisions as to when to run on those tendencies.

 

Or not. What do I know? :-)

[OH FOY]

Funny that Smoltz said in yesterdays game that speed matters. It's a shame the game is going away from it. Put a lot more pressure on the Pitchers, at least for him.

[Bellhorn04]

Funny that Smoltz said in yesterdays game that speed matters. It's a shame the game is going away from it. Put a lot more pressure on the Pitchers, at least for him.

 

Cora obviously loves that style of play.

[Slasher9]

JF should have been fired sooner than he was but it worked out perfect as we now have Cora who seems perfect for this team. He just needs to minimize rookie manager mistakes (which there haven’t been many).

[SoxHop]

I think it's that, and it's also this team's overall offensive success. In the past pitchers could throw a pitch fairly confident that they wouldn't 'pay the big price' for a mistake pitch. This year they know that every hitter can hit one out or find a hole if they make that mistake. That results in more nibbling which creates more pitches that are harder for the catcher to handle.

 

Tying in with 'that guy knowing his s***', I remember OB & Jerry saying that the Sox are picking up on a pitcher's tendencies. They may have done research to determine what pitch a pitcher will throw in certain situations and base their decisions as to when to run on those tendencies.

 

Or not. What do I know? :-)

 

You know what's I find hysterical. There has been a ton of steals this year where the runner has gone before the pitcher even starts the windup. Maybe it is the first base coach.

 

We've made a lot of pitchers look foolish this year.

[bosoxmal]

"Impressed" is putting it mildly. We made a quantum leap in going from one of the worst managers ever, to the best ever.I am also on the verge of calling the team, "Best Ever".Every player on this team is pulling for every other player. Tip and advise are allover the place. Guys come on from nowhere and hit consecutive slams. A pitcher who was VG, at one time with the Rays, comes in and looks like Dizzy Dean.

 

Only major question: What happens to Pedroia? Any guesses out there?

[vegasbob]

"Impressed" is putting it mildly. We made a quantum leap in going from one of the worst managers ever, to the best ever.I am also on the verge of calling the team, "Best Ever".Every player on this team is pulling for every other player. Tip and advise are allover the place. Guys come on from nowhere and hit consecutive slams. A pitcher who was VG, at one time with the Rays, comes in and looks like Dizzy Dean.

 

Only major question: What happens to Pedroia? Any guesses out there?

 

One guess is that he comes back with healed knee and works his way back into 2B , intending to play maybe 120 games, requiring a competent back up like Holt, Nunez, Lin, etc. which the team needs anyway as a utility guy. Another guess is that he tries , pushes it, but just can't regain enough mobility or knee endurance to play regularly at which point he becomes a problem due to contract length and you still need a consistent 2Bman ( like this year, to no detriment to the winning record) . Third guess is that he becomes a nuisance because he can't play well enough but won't go away , not sure what you do then.

[moonslav59]

What gets me is that this is the same team many were bashing or questioning a month or so ago.

 

Some expect the team to look sharp and championship caliber every game or every series.

 

We will likely have another down stretch at some point, hopefully not in October, and maybe some naysayers will come out again, but this team has always looked very good to great on paper, and they are showing that greatness now, just as they did to start the season.

 

The additions of Pearce, Eovaldi and Kinsler have helped a lot, as was the addition by subtraction of HRam, but our opening day roster was pretty tight.

 

Several of us projected 100+ wins, something the Sox have done just once (1946) in over 100 years!

 

This team is special. Our new manager is a big part of that. The addition of JD is another big part. The return to norms of many of our players, something several posters here doubted, has been a big part, if not the biggest part, of our improvement.

 

This is fun watching.

 

Bring us a ring!

[moonslav59]

Funny that Smoltz said in yesterdays game that speed matters. It's a shame the game is going away from it. Put a lot more pressure on the Pitchers, at least for him.

 

Great point about speed affecting the game more than just the SBs.

 

My childhood baseball hero (from my days living in the shadow of County Stadium in Milwaukee) was Tommy Harper. He was not all that fast, but he used his smarts and took one of the largest leads in the history of MLB.

 

Obviously, the Sox have done their homework of pitchers wind-up and motions. We're stealing on pitchers not catchers-- the way it should be.

[Spudboy]

I think it's that, and it's also this team's overall offensive success. In the past pitchers could throw a pitch fairly confident that they wouldn't 'pay the big price' for a mistake pitch. This year they know that every hitter can hit one out or find a hole if they make that mistake. That results in more nibbling which creates more pitches that are harder for the catcher to handle.

 

Tying in with 'that guy knowing his s***', I remember OB & Jerry saying that the Sox are picking up on a pitcher's tendencies. They may have done research to determine what pitch a pitcher will throw in certain situations and base their decisions as to when to run on those tendencies.

 

Or not. What do I know? :-)

 

That is a big part of what I am talking about.

 

Knowledge is power. Speed can only take you so far.

[Spudboy]

Funny that Smoltz said in yesterdays game that speed matters. It's a shame the game is going away from it. Put a lot more pressure on the Pitchers, at least for him.

 

Oh boy! Now we can re-hash the virtues and fallacies regarding disruptive base running.

 

Have at it gang!

[Spudboy]

JF should have been fired sooner than he was but it worked out perfect as we now have Cora who seems perfect for this team. He just needs to minimize rookie manager mistakes (which there haven’t been many).

 

It was interesting the other night when Cora came out to question the warning and he got tossed. The crowd went divia ( that is Newton, Ma speak for nuts ). I think he made and reinforced a lot of good will from fans. Of course later in the post-game interview he explained how his daughter called him about it and he apologized.

 

Lol.

 

I enjoy seeing managers confront umps on questionable stuff.

 

I miss Earl Weaver.