Best Red Sox Manager---Ever?

[Dojji]

That may have been a hard sell to convince Tito of after the FO suggested that his use of pain killers affected his ability to manage.

 

Probably not. The FO was right and Tito knew it. That's why he had to take a year or two off and get his health back in line before he could manage again. I mean, Tito's ego could still have gotten in the way or something, but it's really hard to make a case for an organization being insulting over something that's absolutely accurate.

[Dojji]

He kind of "Olay'ed" Zim like a bull fighter with a charging bull.

 

There was a slight hint of malicious down trust applied by Pedro, but the situation was very heated.

 

 

I never got the outrage over the move. Zimmer's charging towards Pedro. Grounding him is actually one of the less violent ways he can respond to this. It's basically what any decent self defense teacher would tell you to do in that situation, as it minimizes risk of injury both to yourself and to the person attacking you. Yes given Zimmer's age there was still SOME risk, but it was still one of the gentler ways Pedro could have handled the decision, short of simply running away from Zimmer.

[Bellhorn04]

He kind of "Olay'ed" Zim like a bull fighter with a charging bull.

 

There was a slight hint of malicious down trust applied by Pedro.

 

Yep, that's exactly the way I would describe it.

[bosoxmal]

Kis biggest problem has yeet to e resolved. A tough one, that he will tackle very soon. JBJ. I've tried to think of a championship team that had a .150 hitter pplaying CF.Soon, Morlemad goes to 1st, Martinez to LF, Ramiriz to DH.

[oldtimer]

Good game last night with both starting pitchers holding solid offenses down to a couple of runs. In the Sox case, they made some solid defensive plays and many of the better hitters chipped in well considering the pitching they faced. The saame old warts also appeared for the Sox.

 

1. Devers made a throwing error for his 9th of the season to lead the majors in that category.

2. JBJ's hitting was pathetic while Moreland rode the bench.

3. Hembree had a bad outing. Seems to be a bit of a head case. The Sox BP is strong in some areas but Hembree is not one of those. Barnes is better but also subject to having problems.

 

Cora managed well with the possible exception of leaving Moreland on the bench in favor of JBJ. In a tight game like that, a single extra base hit can make a big difrference.

 

On to the next game

[bosoxmal]

His biggest (toughest) decision yet: JBJ

[mvp 78]

Good game last night with both starting pitchers holding solid offenses down to a couple of runs. In the Sox case, they made some solid defensive plays and many of the better hitters chipped in well considering the pitching they faced. The saame old warts also appeared for the Sox.

 

1. Devers made a throwing error for his 9th of the season to lead the majors in that category.

2. JBJ's hitting was pathetic while Moreland rode the bench.

3. Hembree had a bad outing. Seems to be a bit of a head case. The Sox BP is strong in some areas but Hembree is not one of those. Barnes is better but also subject to having problems.

 

Cora managed well with the possible exception of leaving Moreland on the bench in favor of JBJ. In a tight game like that, a single extra base hit can make a big difrference.

 

On to the next game

 

Also, a single hit that falls in CF can be the difference. JBJ just needs to pull himself out of this.

[bosoxmal]

JBJ out. Cora makes another tough call. But the right one! Edited May 9, 2018 by bosoxmal

[MADSTORK]

The Manager they never should have gotten rid of in the first place

 

Francona

 

Not to mention the GM who should have never been let go as well

 

Thanks Larry

[Slasher9]

looks like we can cool our jets on proclaiming Cora the second coming of Tito......

[Natick to NC]

It's Terry and then there's a bunch of guys ....I'm hopeful that Cora becomes Franconaesque .

[notin]

Also, a single hit that falls in CF can be the difference. JBJ just needs to pull himself out of this.

 

Or a sac fly. Neither Betts nor Benintendi have a comparable arm...

[bosoxmal]

Cora has managed this team for 3 weeks. How is he even in the argument yet? He's managed this team for less time than Torey Lovullo...

 

Which makes hisaccomplishments all the more remarkable.

[bosoxmal]

Mal is my role model.

Thank you, Dewey. The day we met at Denway South is still a Florida Highlight. (And I've been here since 1978!.

Nostalgia is one thing,but realism is always an issue. Foxx an Williams were two of the greatest hitters that eve lived. But their lousy fielding is also memorable. I haven't looked at the stats but I think if the stats were the only think to consider he would rate high. But everyone who was around then moanes every time a ground ball was more than 2 feet away. This was because of clumxyness, I suppose, but Ted had no excuse. he was just plain lzy!.

 

I just hope the Betts Martinez twosome will do as well, and we know they'll be a lotbetter in the field.

 

I find it very hard to compare the twosomes, but I feel fortunate to be around to appreciate them both. Sometimes we forget that Ted once said that he got out of baseball just in time. (the slider was just coming in) And the pitching is quite different today, thanks to the slider. In spite of not throwing anything but a 100mph fastball for several hundred innings and a curve that broke three feet, I'd take Bob Feller over any pitcher---even Grove! My father took me to that Grove-Feller matchup at Fenway. I don't remember even the year, but Bobbuy Doerr won it with the only run of the game (I think) with a home run. God, I wish thee was film around to show some of those single moments.

[CharlieWhigg]

Honestly this conversation should begin and end with Francona

[Maxbialystock]

Honestly this conversation should begin and end with Francona

 

Really? You don't think in 2004 Francona inherited a team that hit like crazy and had decent pitching? I sure do. The hitting was still good in 2007 because the Sox still had Ortiz and Ramirez and a pretty good supporting cast. Plus Beckett had a great year and Lester was pretty good too. Then a decline for 4 years, including the collapse in 2011 which cost Francona his job. Yet 2 years and 2 managers later the Sox win another WS. Then 2 bad years and 2 decent years under the guy, Farrell, who won in 2013. Now Cora is looking pretty good 1/4 way into his first season. You can make a fair argument that in the John Henry era the managers are just along for the ride.

[notin]

Really? You don't think in 2004 Francona inherited a team that hit like crazy and had decent pitching? I sure do. The hitting was still good in 2007 because the Sox still had Ortiz and Ramirez and a pretty good supporting cast. Plus Beckett had a great year and Lester was pretty good too. Then a decline for 4 years, including the collapse in 2011 which cost Francona his job. Yet 2 years and 2 managers later the Sox win another WS. Then 2 bad years and 2 decent years under the guy, Farrell, who won in 2013. Now Cora is looking pretty good 1/4 way into his first season. You can make a fair argument that in the John Henry era the managers are just along for the ride.

 

Bobby Valentine?

[illinoisredsox]

Bobby Valentine?

 

Didn't say WHERE he was riding.

[Dojji]

Really? You don't think in 2004 Francona inherited a team that hit like crazy and had decent pitching? I sure do. The hitting was still good in 2007 because the Sox still had Ortiz and Ramirez and a pretty good supporting cast. Plus Beckett had a great year and Lester was pretty good too. Then a decline for 4 years, including the collapse in 2011 which cost Francona his job. Yet 2 years and 2 managers later the Sox win another WS. Then 2 bad years and 2 decent years under the guy, Farrell, who won in 2013. Now Cora is looking pretty good 1/4 way into his first season. You can make a fair argument that in the John Henry era the managers are just along for the ride.

 

Ton of teams just as talented as 2004 Boston that never got to the promised land, much less did it twice.

[notin]

Ton of teams just as talented as 2004 Boston that never got to the promised land, much less did it twice.

 

On BDC, there were posters who used to think Francona was not a good manager because they only won two titles under him. That's ridiculous. There absolutely were plenty of talented teams. The Yankees won 101 games in 2004. Was Francona supposed to stop them from doing that?

[mvp 78]

On BDC, there were posters who used to think Francona was not a good manager because they only won two titles under him. That's ridiculous. There absolutely were plenty of talented teams. The Yankees won 101 games in 2004. Was Francona supposed to stop them from doing that?

 

BDC was 50% people that were rejected from TalkSox. Sad!

[Maxbialystock]

Bobby Valentine?

 

Won just 69 games in 2012, the year after the Sox won 90 in 2011. The Sox won 95 and the WS in 2013, but with the same manager lost 71 games in 2014.

 

Henry as owner has fired four managers in 15 years.

[oldtimer]

Really? You don't think in 2004 Francona inherited a team that hit like crazy and had decent pitching? I sure do. The hitting was still good in 2007 because the Sox still had Ortiz and Ramirez and a pretty good supporting cast. Plus Beckett had a great year and Lester was pretty good too. Then a decline for 4 years, including the collapse in 2011 which cost Francona his job. Yet 2 years and 2 managers later the Sox win another WS. Then 2 bad years and 2 decent years under the guy, Farrell, who won in 2013. Now Cora is looking pretty good 1/4 way into his first season. You can make a fair argument that in the John Henry era the managers are just along for the ride.

 

I think Larry Lucchino was a fly in the ointment that damaged the team and caused trouble for Francona, who has been shown to be a good manager. Sorry when he left and never a fan of Farrell who reminded me of Buddha standing in the dugout without seemingly being excited by the game. Valentine was not worth mentioning. Cora is so new that it would be foolish to judge him. Some good and some questionable, but very good results.

[notin]

Won just 69 games in 2012, the year after the Sox won 90 in 2011. The Sox won 95 and the WS in 2013, but with the same manager lost 71 games in 2014.

 

Henry as owner has fired four managers in 15 years.

 

Valentine was absolutely the wrong guy in 2012. His no-nonsense attitude was such a horrible fit for a team that had a complete break down and collapse, reportedly due to re-scheduling disagreements with upper management.

 

He basically had the same roster that dominated most of 2011, but the team went absolutely nowhere right out of the gate, and, while I can't quantify Valentine's attitude in there so easily, I do recall questioning some of the horrible decisions he was making. Cherington broke up that team in August and somehow managed to rebuild a winner that took the title a mere 14 months later...

[notin]

BDC was 50% people that were rejected from TalkSox. Sad!

 

I'd never even heard of talksox unitl BDC decided to close their forums. This and freeforum were the two that were recommended. I tried that other forum for a while, but it was so frustrating...

[mvp 78]

I'd never even heard of talksox unitl BDC decided to close their forums. This and freeforum were the two that were recommended. I tried that other forum for a while, but it was so frustrating...

 

I learned about this forum back in olden times when a Dodgers board I was posting on raided TalkSox because of SeaBeachFred (I wasn't a fan of los Doyers, but had just moved to LA and wanted to learn more about the team since I enjoyed listening to Vin Scully on the radio so much).

 

I've been asked to post on other forums from time to time, but they are always just shitshows. I prefer the TS shitshow more.

[notin]

I learned about this forum back in olden times when a Dodgers board I was posting on raided TalkSox because of SeaBeachFred (I wasn't a fan of los Doyers, but had just moved to LA and wanted to learn more about the team since I enjoyed listening to Vin Scully on the radio so much).

 

I've been asked to post on other forums from time to time, but they are always just shitshows. I prefer the TS shitshow more.

 

I started posting on ESPN.com. When I moved to the midwest and, before I was able to get Sox broadcasts, I used to listen to the online stream from WEEI. But I noticed I was able to get game updates faster from the message boards at ESPN. So I joined and eventually stating posting.

 

However, there was no bigger shitshow on the internet than a message board at ESPN.com, with the possible exception of Yahoo (where I have never posted). I registered for Sons of Sam Horn and SawxTalk, but never posted on either site.

 

BDC was nice when I joined because it was largely baseball talk all year long.

 

The only moniker I have ever used on any of these sites was "notin" (except for a brief time on BDC when notin wasn't working and I used "niton"). I don't even remember why I chose it, beyond being able to get it without using any numbers. The combination of letters means nothing to me. I do recall not being able to get the moniker on either SawxTalk or SOSH, which might be why I never posted there...

[mvp 78]

SOSH is the most unfun place in the Red Sox universe.

[notin]

SOSH is the most unfun place in the Red Sox universe.

 

Yes. Because I never posted there

[Spudboy]

SOSH is the most unfun place in the Red Sox universe.

 

A bunch of pretentious f***s if you ask me.