2017/18 Hot Stove Thread

[a700hitter]

A700 is right again. Challenge him at your peril. LOL!!

Is it possible that they have a deal in place for him that hasn't been finalized? It is very strange.

Then why DFA him mid-deal?

 

I think they found no takers but clearly didn't want to pay $6mill-ish for his second half sub-.700 OPS...

 

Pirates Acquire Corey Dickerson From Rays

 

By Steve Adams | February 22, 2018 at 1:17pm CDT

1:17pm: The Pirates are sending the Rays $1MM as part of the trade, reports Rob Biertempfel of The Athletic (TwiTE]tter link). In essence, then, they’ll spend an additional $1.45MM to turn Hudson into Dickerson, while the Rays will add a reliever to their ’pen, a prospect to the lower levels of their farm system, and trim $1.45MM from their 2018 payroll.

[oldtimer]

For players 26-40 on our 40 man roster, good performance during spring training by non-rosters invitees may allow us to trade our 'surplus'.

 

I'm not into making changes without a road map. Some of the players at lower level need to make some major progress this year. CJ Chatham is someone who has to stay healthy and show us what he's got. It's also time for Jay Groome get some innings in this year. I'm also curious to see where Josh Ockimey is this year. He's someone that has shown power in batting cage but not during games.

 

We need to develop a major league ready 2B. I just don't think Pedey will ever be 100% and will need to DH from time to time. (rest Beni vs LP, let JD play left and Pedey DH, Nunez to 2B).

 

I think this is a big year for Xander. He has not followed up his world series performance. Yeah I get the hand injury. We need to find out if he's simply a mediocre SS or bona fide star.

 

Ian Brown's blog indicates the Sox lineup will be very hard to crack with his belief that Leon and Moreland are very likely to make the 25 man roster. He thinks that Swihart and Holt are the most likely to be the two others due to their versatility. He did name his dark horses and Marrero and Hernandez. It will no doubt come down to performance in spring training.

 

The longer term roadmap may require us to develop Pitching internally with Groome the obvious and most likely candidate.

 

We also no doubt would like to develop some candidates for up the middle play. One of those could be Chavis. So far they haven't looked at 2nd for him but instead third where he is blocked. I believe Chatham is a low power SS but haven't checked on him lately. Ockimey has some pop but isn't from my understanding a top athlete so not an up the middle prospect. Brannen is a potential CF who is at least a year away. Great athlete with a lot to prove at the plate and will only turn 20 during the year. Needs to add strength and pop.

 

Maybe we can trade some of our utility players for pitching prospects or other prospect we can see a need for in the pig picture road map you speak of. As Ian Browne has said in his blog, our lineup and 25 man roster will be difficult to crack this year so some of our utility guys are likely to be totally blocked. Possibly even some of our top prospects such as at first base or the outfield.

 

We definitely need Bogaerts this year and the hope is that he can raise his performance level to something approaching the promise he has shown in the past. If not, do we go after a major FA next year?

[moonslav59]

A700 is right again. Challenge him at your peril. LOL!!

 

 

Pirates Acquire Corey Dickerson From Rays

 

By Steve Adams | February 22, 2018 at 1:17pm CDT

1:17pm: The Pirates are sending the Rays $1MM as part of the trade, reports Rob Biertempfel of The Athletic (TwiTE]tter link). In essence, then, they’ll spend an additional $1.45MM to turn Hudson into Dickerson, while the Rays will add a reliever to their ’pen, a prospect to the lower levels of their farm system, and trim $1.45MM from their 2018 payroll.

 

So, he obviously was not just given away, as some here suggested was going on.

[a700hitter]

So, he obviously was not just given away, as some here suggested was going on.

I thought that would have been bizarre. An .829 career OPS guy at age 27 had to have some value besides a straight out salary dump.

[moonslav59]

We also no doubt would like to develop some candidates for up the middle play. One of those could be Chavis. So far they haven't looked at 2nd for him but instead third where he is blocked.

 

Please just let this idea go. Chavis is such a bad 3Bman, they are moving him to 1B, and he may end up too bad for that position. He'll likely be a DH and little more. He is not going to play 2B.

[moonslav59]

I thought that would have been bizarre. An .829 career OPS guy at age 27 had to have some value besides a straight out salary dump.

 

Especially when his salary was not all that high (for most teams).

[notin]

So, he obviously was not just given away, as some here suggested was going on.

 

They traded the starting DH from the All Star game making just under $6mill last year and received a $5.5mill reliever valued at 1. 7fWAR over the past 6 years (less than the immortal Alex Claudio last year alone) and an infielder who didn't crack the top 28 in the Pittsburgh prospects rankings. And a small amount of cashn

 

You sure they didn't give him away?

[oldtimer]

Please just let this idea go. Chavis is such a bad 3Bman, they are moving him to 1B, and he may end up too bad for that position. He'll likely be a DH and little more. He is not going to play 2B.

 

Just for the record, i am including the red sox official scouting report

 

Chavis hit his way into the first round of the 2014 Draft, winning the home run derby at the 2013 Perfect Game All-American Classic and batting .580 with 13 homers in 28 games as a high school senior. After signing for $1,870,500 as the 26th overall pick, he flashed some power but otherwise struggled his first two full years as a pro. He finally made some needed adjustments at the plate in 2017 and began to take off.

 

Chavis has plenty of bat speed, strength and loft in his right-handed stroke, so he can hit home runs without selling out for power. He's at his best as a hitter when he keeps his swing under control and uses the whole field, and he has stopped trying to pull everything out of the park. He has made significant strides with his pitch recognition, two-strike approach and ability to handle breaking balls.

 

A high school shortstop who became a full-time third baseman in instructional league after his pro debut, Chavis has improved with experience at the hot corner. He's not the rangiest third baseman but has a strong arm and should be at least an adequate defender. There are some scouts who think he could become a second baseman in the Dan Uggla mold.

[Kimmi]

More likely because he is playing for his contract to vest.

 

That can't hurt.

[Kimmi]

Me, too.

 

Just because I might do something differently, does not mean I think Cora is making a mistake.

 

Just about every time I criticized JF for his line-ups, I prefaced it with, "I don't pretend to be smarter than JF."

 

I did think batting Holt 1st or 2nd 10 times was idiotic, and yes, I was smarter than JF on that one... LOL. (Holt did end up with a .327 OBP in those 10 games/.250 BA)

 

 

Cora pretty much hit the nail on the head. The construction doesn't matter. What matters is you have your best guys in the lineup.

[Kimmi]

The manager should have insights that are not available to ordinary or even clued in fans. Slight injuries, fatigue, lack of confidence and a host of other insights are going to shape the managers decision. In general, we can form ideas based on stats or eye tests, but the manager and his coaches know more and it is the results which determine if they are doing a good job.

 

This is something that we fans tend to forget when we question a manager's decision. There is so much more that goes into the manager's decision than what we are privy to. I question decisions from time to time too, but I do try to give the manager the benefit of the doubt. Despite what some people think, they do know more than we do.

[a700hitter]

This is something that we fans tend to forget when we question a manager's decision. There is so much more that goes into the manager's decision than what we are privy to. I question decisions from time to time too, but I do try to give the manager the benefit of the doubt. Despite what some people think, they do know more than we do.

And despite all the additional information at their disposal, they still manage to screw up very often.

[moonslav59]

Cora pretty much hit the nail on the head. The construction doesn't matter. What matters is you have your best guys in the lineup.

 

Yes, you're right. The biggest mistake was even having Holt in the line-up. Batting him 1st or second 10 times just fanned my flames.

[notin]

Just for the record, i am including the red sox official scouting report

 

Chavis hit his way into the first round of the 2014 Draft, winning the home run derby at the 2013 Perfect Game All-American Classic and batting .580 with 13 homers in 28 games as a high school senior. After signing for $1,870,500 as the 26th overall pick, he flashed some power but otherwise struggled his first two full years as a pro. He finally made some needed adjustments at the plate in 2017 and began to take off.

 

Chavis has plenty of bat speed, strength and loft in his right-handed stroke, so he can hit home runs without selling out for power. He's at his best as a hitter when he keeps his swing under control and uses the whole field, and he has stopped trying to pull everything out of the park. He has made significant strides with his pitch recognition, two-strike approach and ability to handle breaking balls.

 

A high school shortstop who became a full-time third baseman in instructional league after his pro debut, Chavis has improved with experience at the hot corner. He's not the rangiest third baseman but has a strong arm and should be at least an adequate defender. There are some scouts who think he could become a second baseman in the Dan Uggla mold.

 

Dan Uggla wasn't much of a defensive second baseman.

 

Chavis could well end up being trade bait...

[moonslav59]

A high school shortstop who became a full-time third baseman in instructional league after his pro debut, Chavis has improved with experience at the hot corner. He's not the rangiest third baseman but has a strong arm and should be at least an adequate defender. There are some scouts who think he could become a second baseman in the Dan Uggla mold.

 

Having a no to low ranged 2Bman is not something I even want to consider.If Chavis is the hitter many think he will become, he can DH after JD opts out or play 1B after HRam fails to vest.

[Kimmi]

And despite all the additional information at their disposal, they still manage to screw up very often.

 

In your opinion.

 

Sometimes, the right decision is made even if the outcome is not the one we wanted.

[a700hitter]

In your opinion.

 

Sometimes, the right decision is made even if the outcome is not the one we wanted.

I was not referring to those instances. I was referring to instances when all the facts are known that the manager still makes the foolish move -- and that is without regard to whether the outcome is good.

[Spudboy]

That can't hurt.

 

Nope. It is strong motivation.

[notin]

I was not referring to those instances. I was referring to instances when all the facts are known that the manager still makes the foolish move -- and that is without regard to whether the outcome is good.

 

There are plenty of times when we as fans think all the facts are known, but there are one or two we don't know (and aren't expected to)...

[a700hitter]

There are plenty of times when we as fans think all the facts are known, but there are one or two we don't know (and aren't expected to)...

That is true.

[notin]

One of the stranger trends this off-season was to sign injured pitchers to low money two year deals, knowing full well the pitcher would not pitch at all the first season. The goal is to get a single season put of a good pitcher at a lower AAV. Michael Pineda and Drew Smyly both received such deals from the Twins and Cubs respectively.

 

With that in mind, two important facts.

 

1. Craig Kimbrel is a free agent after this year.

2. Trevor Rosenthal is injured and unlikely to pitch this season. ..

[Larry Cook]

As of today, we have pitchers Thornburg, Wright and Rodriguez not starting the season with us.

 

We have price’s and pomeranz’s seasons hanging by a ucl.

 

While I think we have a lot of quality relievers, I also think we could really use another quality starter just in case the youngsters (Velasquez, Elias, Haley, and Johnson) are not able to answer the bell.

[moonslav59]

As of today, we have pitchers Thornburg, Wright and Rodriguez not starting the season with us.

 

We have price’s and pomeranz’s seasons hanging by a ucl.

 

While I think we have a lot of quality relievers, I also think we could really use another quality starter just in case the youngsters (Velasquez, Elias, Haley, and Johnson) are not able to answer the bell.

 

There's not enough money left to get "quality", unless we get someone who over performs expectations.

 

I'm against this idea, but we could trade JBJ and Johnson for a quality pitcher and go with JD in LF, HRam at DH and Moreland/Swihart at 1B.

 

The only other way I can see is to find a taker for HRam and maybe Holt, while we pay a major portion of his deal, and then we can afford a better pitcher.

[moonslav59]

One of the stranger trends this off-season was to sign injured pitchers to low money two year deals, knowing full well the pitcher would not pitch at all the first season. The goal is to get a single season put of a good pitcher at a lower AAV. Michael Pineda and Drew Smyly both received such deals from the Twins and Cubs respectively.

 

With that in mind, two important facts.

 

1. Craig Kimbrel is a free agent after this year.

2. Trevor Rosenthal is injured and unlikely to pitch this season. ..

 

Not a bad idea, but haven't we too many recovering injured pitchers as it is?

[Nick]

There's not enough money left to get "quality", unless we get someone who over performs expectations.

 

I'm against this idea, but we could trade JBJ and Johnson for a quality pitcher and go with JD in LF, HRam at DH and Moreland/Swihart at 1B.

 

The only other way I can see is to find a taker for HRam and maybe Holt, while we pay a major portion of his deal, and then we can afford a better pitcher.

 

For real. Hey why not just go sign Arietta? It's about choices. We made the decision that JD Maritnez was needed. I rather give Elias, Johnson and the Mexican dude opportunity to pitch. We got some youngsters.

[moonslav59]

Hey why not just go sign Arietta? It's about choices.

 

Major penalties for going over $40M over.

[Natick to NC]

Major penalties for going over $40M over.

 

Are we really done this offseason ??? Sure sounded like JD may play 60 games in RF ....are we really done ?I don't think so bet we will see the next ten days .The fact remains we would need to toss another 10 to 15 million in payroll to even get Jake ...I think he's worth every penny .

Edited February 26, 2018 by Natick to NC

[mvp 78]

Major penalties for going over $40M over.

 

Plus, steamer projects a 4+ ERA. He was never a good pitcher until he made his way to the NL Central. His velo was way down last year and he became very hittable. He's a good arm, but not worth the penalties. He'll be 32 on Opening Day and is trending in the wrong direction.

[mvp 78]

Are we really done this offseason ??? Sure sounded like JD may play 60 games in RF ....are we really done ?I don't think so bet we will see the next ten days .

 

Are you expecting Mookie and JBJ to sit out 30 games each?

[Natick to NC]

JBJ and Benny would have to in this scenario wouldn't they ??? Or is someone on the block ?I think several are up for sale but we will see.