Red Sox Trade Deadline 2017 Thread

[Hugh2]

Everyone seems to agree that there's usually a certain transition period when a player goes up a league. The thing we may forget is that that period may be longer for some players than others and consequently we sometimes give up on a player too soon. I see it as possible that we gave up on Shaw too soon. It was justified at the time because he'd had one season (spread over two years) of sub-par performance and as a large market team we can't always wait for players to develop.

 

Another player whom many gave up on is JBJ. C'mon now..., without revisionist history, how many of you really were clamoring for a trade of him when he was hitting around .200? IIRC you can count those of us who wanted to keep him - if only for his defense - on one hand. If DD had been listening to the fans JBJ would be playing for someone else now.

 

Now we're looking at Marrero and Lin. Marerro has been around a while and has developed the rep of 'good glove, no hit" who's carrying an unexpected ML OPS of >.600. I'm not claiming that .600 is acceptable for a 3b but it's more than expected. Is it possible that his transition period is still going on and he'll be at least respectable?

 

And then we have Lin with the OPS of almost .900. If someone says that's not sustainable I'm going to agree, but this start reminds me of that guy who's currently playing Lf for the Sox (minus the hype). Do we give up on him when he comes back to earth like Beni did?

 

I'm in no rush to make a bad trade to fill our issues at 3b when we're in 1st place and we have two guys getting the job done now, and fortunately DD isn't either.

 

Yes but JBJ hit well in the minors and scouts loved his tools at the plate. You can't say the same thing about Lin and Marrero.

[Jack Flap]

Lin was also having a breakout year in the minors when called up, hitting .302/.379/.491 in 184 PA in Portland (which dwarfs anything he'd done in previous years). Not that I think he'll repeat that in the majors long-term, but it certainly seems possible that he's turned some kind of a corner.

[Hugh2]

Lin was also having a breakout year in the minors when called up, hitting .302/.379/.491 in 184 PA in Portland (which dwarfs anything he'd done in previous years). Not that I think he'll repeat that in the majors long-term, but it certainly seems possible that he's turned some kind of a corner.

 

Yes he's put on some weight, so he has that going in his favor. We will have to wait and see, but he's doing a fine job right now.

[mvp 78]

Personally, I don't think we will be having a rule 5 roster crunch this fall, but some posters disagree. Perhaps trading a couple rule 5 candidates at the deadline would solve any further issues there. We already trade Longhi, who is going to be rule 5.

 

I'm sure there will be a few other rule 5 guys moved, but I don't really see it as a crunch. There are more than enough guys you could take off the current 40 man roster for any prospect they really want to keep.

 

Furthermore, if our farm system is so barren, how could there possibly be any rule 5 guys that would be taken?

[mvp 78]

Yes he's put on some weight, so he has that going in his favor. We will have to wait and see, but he's doing a fine job right now.

 

The biggest thing is he changed his swing to create more loft. It's worked out so far. He's fine as a bench guy.

[Hugh2]

The biggest thing is he changed his swing to create more loft. It's worked out so far. He's fine as a bench guy.

 

I agree, I do think his stock has risen from a guy who looked to have no MLB future to a guy who could be useful in the utility role. I wonder if he can play the OF? He's got speed and I know his defense on the left side is exceptional.

 

Guys like that a still very important.

[OH FOY]

Lin has shocked me with his bat, I'm glad. I give credit like his style, doesn't look nervous at each at bat. Good composure, works the Pitcher. Good stuff.

[bowman]

Just for argument sake, what would it take for us to get Arenado from the Rockies if they were looking to trade him. Would you trade JBJ, Devers, and Lin to get him. Might take more than that. Arenado would take us to the next level. Hanley being Hanley can't be relied on. This is one guy I might give up the farm for..

[harmony]

Just for argument sake, what would it take for us to get Arenado from the Rockies if they were looking to trade him. Would you trade JBJ, Devers, and Lin to get him. Might take more than that. Arenado would take us to the next level. Hanley being Hanley can't be relied on. This is one guy I might give up the farm for..

What would a team need to offer to land Boston shortstop Xander Bogaerts, who like Nolan Arenado has two more years of team control?

 

Since the start of last season Arenado has posted 10.3 bWAR and 8.1 fWAR while Bogaerts has posted 5.7 bWAR and 7.4 fWAR.

 

I doubt the Red Sox would trade Bogaerts for the equivalent of Jackie Bradley, Rafael Devers and Tzu-Wei Lin. Arenado should command a more substantial package.

[jacksonianmarch]

You're not dealing Bogaerts

[Hugh2]

You're not dealing Bogaerts

 

Why not?

 

We can just stick Lin at SS once we pick up a 3B or promote Devers?

[Jack Flap]

You're not dealing Bogaerts

 

That wasn't the point...

[S5Dewey]

You're not dealing Bogaerts

 

In the current vernacular..... WORD!

[moonslav59]

Trading Shaw was a blunder. No sense crying about it now. Lin is batting .333 with an .871 OPS. The assumption is that he will drop off considerably due to his minor league stats. But that was also said about Shaw. Why not wait and see? Anyway, there should be no urgency in trading for a third baseman. We are 3 1/2 games up. Devers is waiting in the wings. As is Holt. And possibly Peralta or maybe even Panda. Sit tight until the deadline. We should also know more about Carson Smith by then.

 

Shaw had a few stretches of showing he could hit in the minors. Lin has never showed life until this year. Lin's been in professional ball for 6 years. Sometimes, very rarely, a player will do significantly better in the majors than in the minors, but I seem to only remember okay hitters doing better- not bad hitters doing great or even .750ish.

 

Shaw had an .803 minor league OPS. He had numerous stretches of .900+ ball:

 

2012 A+ (423 PAs- not a tiny sample size): .957

..... (50 XBHs in 99 games)

 

2013 Fall League (73 PAs) 1.157

 

2014 AA (208 PAs) .954

.....(20 XBHs in 47 games )

 

That was 3 years in a row that he had a significant hot streak.

 

 

Lin has a career .638 minor league OPS. He was apples to oranges compared to Shaw.

 

Until this season, Lin's best minor league stretch was .698 in 2015 at A+ ball (307 PAs)

 

He followed that with a .525 Fall league OPS in 54 PAs and a .580 OPS in 2016 at AA (411 PAs- not a tiny sample size).

 

 

Look, I'm rooting for Lin like all hell. It would be a great story for a player with a sub .640 OPS in 6 years on the farm to have an extended, productive streak or career in the majors.

 

It could happen, but basing your plans on it happening is a huge risk to take. I suppose we can try a waiver-wire deal, if Lin flops in August. I suppose we could call up Devers, against what appears to be the team's current organizational judgment.

 

I'd be okay, if we don't trade for a 3Bman, but we should look hard to find a deal without a massive overpay. If there's none out there, I'm okay with rolling the dice on the circus carousel that has been the Sox 3B position since Beltre (and even he was just here for one great year).

 

 

[a700hitter]

Trading Shaw was a blunder. No sense crying about it now. Lin is batting .333 with an .871 OPS. The assumption is that he will drop off considerably due to his minor league stats. But that was also said about Shaw. Why not wait and see? Anyway, there should be no urgency in trading for a third baseman. We are 3 1/2 games up. Devers is waiting in the wings. As is Holt. And possibly Peralta or maybe even Panda. Sit tight until the deadline. We should also know more about Carson Smith by then.

There's no crying in baseball, but DD can live it down by winning a Championship-- and we will still bring it up. LOL!!

[moonslav59]

"Just win, baby!"

 

A lot can be forgiven and forgotten once a ring is secured.

[a700hitter]

"Just win, baby!"

 

A lot can be forgiven and forgotten once a ring is secured.

I will still bash the FO. They are always fair game. Edited July 11, 2017 by a700hitter

[Jack Flap]

I will still bash the FO. They are always fare game.

 

Word!

[moonslav59]

I will still bash the FO. They are always fair game.

 

Except bashing over impending cliffs is off limits.

[harmony]

You're not dealing Bogaerts

And the Colorado Rockies, who have a better record than the Red Sox, aren't trading Nolan Arenado.

[moonslav59]

And the Colorado Rockies, who have a better record than the Red Sox, aren't trading Nolan Arenado.

 

An overblown stat, I admit, but he's on pace to lead the NL in RBIs for the 3rd straight year.

 

He's not going anywhere.

 

Also, his ,775 career away OPS would scare the bejesus out of me. (.538 OPS at Fenway in a tiny 20 PA sample size.)

 

[a700hitter]

Except bashing over impending cliffs is off limits.

LOL! touche

[oldtimer]

The Sox as constituted have a lot of really good field players, but by and large our guys are small and lack power as compared to some of the other HR hitting teams. When you look at Beni, JBJ, Mookie, Pedey and Lin, anyone 6 feet tall looks big. Also Bogey, while bigger doesn't hit big. I would like to see us try to develop some power in the minors. Devers is not huge but does have power. Also the idea of getting Beltre back for the rest of the season and possibly next is a dream but it is a pleasant one. Why did we let him go? Perhaps Beltre could offer an alternative to Hanley, who has talent but appears to me to lack the kind of game smarts that make guys like Pedroia so valuable. We will have to live with Hanley through 2018 and hope he can catch on and provide us at least a solid middle of the lineup guy. I hope that will be the case but don't really expect it.

[illinoisredsox]

The Sox as constituted have a lot of really good field players, but by and large our guys are small and lack power as compared to some of the other HR hitting teams. When you look at Beni, JBJ, Mookie, Pedey and Lin, anyone 6 feet tall looks big. Also Bogey, while bigger doesn't hit big. I would like to see us try to develop some power in the minors. Devers is not huge but does have power. Also the idea of getting Beltre back for the rest of the season and possibly next is a dream but it is a pleasant one. Why did we let him go? Perhaps Beltre could offer an alternative to Hanley, who has talent but appears to me to lack the kind of game smarts that make guys like Pedroia so valuable. We will have to live with Hanley through 2018 and hope he can catch on and provide us at least a solid middle of the lineup guy. I hope that will be the case but don't really expect it.

 

 

A few things about Beltre and why he left:

 

1. Beltre came to the Sox on a one-year deal for the 2011 season to resurrect his career; as I recall, he was coming off an injury and took a substantial pay cut (25-30%) from his previous contract with the Mariners. He had every intent of going free agent after that season.

 

2. His agent was Scott Boras, so resigning him was not going to be easy.

 

3. While he performed well here, I'm not sure he liked playing in Boston; he really wanted to play on the west cost and settled on the Rangers.

 

4. They had Will Middlebrooks ready from the minors, and he (Middlebrooks) performed pretty well for the half season he played (OPS of .835, 15 homers and 54 RBIs in 75 games). Unfortunately, that was the highwater mark of his career, but at the time he represented big power at a very low cost.

 

And the biggest reason of all:

 

5. The Sox had a money crunch. 2012 was the year Adrian Gonzalez's contract escalated from around $6 million to over $20 million. The Sox also resigned David Ortiz that same season. Lackey and Beckett were in the middle of large contracts and they had a lot of $ tied up in Carl Crawford.

[mvp 78]

I agree, I do think his stock has risen from a guy who looked to have no MLB future to a guy who could be useful in the utility role. I wonder if he can play the OF? He's got speed and I know his defense on the left side is exceptional.

 

Guys like that a still very important.

 

He can play the OF. They used him there in the minors and he works on it before games.

[mvp 78]

Except bashing over impending cliffs is off limits.

 

The FO is real. The cliff is not.

[mvp 78]

2. His agent was Scott Boras, so resigning him was not going to be easy.

 

Boras is not the bogeyman.

[Kimmi]

Trading Shaw was a blunder. No sense crying about it now. Lin is batting .333 with an .871 OPS. The assumption is that he will drop off considerably due to his minor league stats. But that was also said about Shaw. Why not wait and see? Anyway, there should be no urgency in trading for a third baseman. We are 3 1/2 games up. Devers is waiting in the wings. As is Holt. And possibly Peralta or maybe even Panda. Sit tight until the deadline. We should also know more about Carson Smith by then.

 

I agree completely about there being no urgency in trading for a 3B.

 

I think Shaw is playing over his head right now, but that trade looks worse and worse every day. That said, I was fully on board with the trade when it happened.

 

As far as Lin is concerned, his BABIP is .448. He will return to earth as well. In the meantime, however, he and Marrero are doing an acceptable job at 3B.

[Kimmi]

Except bashing over impending cliffs is off limits.

 

Word!

[Kimmi]

A few things about Beltre and why he left:

 

1. Beltre came to the Sox on a one-year deal for the 2011 season to resurrect his career; as I recall, he was coming off an injury and took a substantial pay cut (25-30%) from his previous contract with the Mariners. He had every intent of going free agent after that season.

 

2. His agent was Scott Boras, so resigning him was not going to be easy.

 

3. While he performed well here, I'm not sure he liked playing in Boston; he really wanted to play on the west cost and settled on the Rangers.

 

4. They had Will Middlebrooks ready from the minors, and he (Middlebrooks) performed pretty well for the half season he played (OPS of .835, 15 homers and 54 RBIs in 75 games). Unfortunately, that was the highwater mark of his career, but at the time he represented big power at a very low cost.

 

And the biggest reason of all:

 

5. The Sox had a money crunch. 2012 was the year Adrian Gonzalez's contract escalated from around $6 million to over $20 million. The Sox also resigned David Ortiz that same season. Lackey and Beckett were in the middle of large contracts and they had a lot of $ tied up in Carl Crawford.

 

All good points. The Sox were not going to match Texas' 6 year contract, taking Beltre into his mid to late 30s, and rightly so.

 

Another big reason they let Beltre go was for the draft picks. Theo was all about the draft picks when letting free agents walk. And who did the Sox draft with those comp picks? Jackie Bradley Jr. and Blake Swihart, so it's not all bad.