Trades before the deadline?

[User Name]

Parnell has a career-low K/9 to go along with a minuscule .241 BABIP and zero homers allowed. However, his ERA is not significantly outperforming his FIP and xFIP, meaning his line is not as flukish as it seems. You have to wonder however, if he can get away with the low K rate and allowing no homers at Fenway park.

[italstallianion]

I think he can be a useful piece for Boston, and I don't consider Brentz to be a player that we'd use full time in Boston, so I'm ok with parting with Brentz in that kind of deal.

 

Another thing to point out is that we have a lot of players that might be Rule 5 eligible so that might tip our hand into a couple of trades.

[mvp 78]

I honestly think you're overrating Brentz then. He has power, but he's a bona fide hacker, I doubt he's much more than a platoon bat at the big leagues.

 

I just think relievers are wildly inconsistent and that I'd rather go for some options that wouldn't cost prospects, like last year's Breslow trade.

[Standing Room]

Fangraphs did an excellent piece on why teams should be cautious about trading for Papelbon.

 

It’s not all doom and gloom of course. Papelbon hasn’t suddenly turned into a scrub. His strikeouts are down, but he is still generating plenty of swings and misses, and even with his contact percentage on the rise, it’s still a better than average contact percentage. Papelbon is also keeping his walks and home runs allowed in check. It’s just that so many things are trending in the wrong direction, and with his salary what it is, his days of being an attractive trade chip may be over before they really start.

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/jonathan-papelbon-buyer-beware/

[mvp 78]

If they didn't want the backend of his contract then, why get it now and give up prospects?

[Standing Room]

If they didn't want the backend of his contract then, why get it now and give up prospects?

 

Logic is such a bitch.

[Orange Juiced]

The Mets weren't expected to do anything this season so there was no pressure on him to close and he is pitching like it. Go back a few seasons when the Mets were contending and look at his numbers. A lot easier to pitch for a team that isn't suppose to go anywhere.

 

Parnell's career stats:

 

2008 (23) - 5.0 ip, 5.40 era, 84 era+, 1.00 whip, 5.4 k/9

2009 (24) - 88.1 ip, 5.30 era, 77 era+, 1.66 whip, 7.5 k/9

2010 (25) - 35.0 ip, 2.83 era, 140 era+, 1.40 whip, 8.5 k/9

2011 (26) - 59.1 ip, 3.64 era, 101 era+, 1.47 whip, 9.7 k/9

2012 (27) - 68.2 ip, 2.49 era, 153 era+, 1.24 whip, 8.0 k/9

2013 (28) - 41.0 ip, 2.41 era, 151 era+, 0.90 whip, 7.7 k/9

 

Dating back to 2011, his last 138 games have produced the following line:

 

138 g, 132.0 ip, 36 er, 107 h, 41 bb, 114 k, 2.45 era, 1.12 whip, 7.8 k/9

 

That's essentially two full seasons' worth of stats, from mid-2011 til the present. That's a REALLY good relief pitcher. I would never give up JBJ for him, of course, but Brentz? Sure.

[italstallianion]

I agree on Parnell.

 

I'm torn on Papelbon. I mean I think he's a total dick, and he's very much overpaid. Not to mention it defeats the purpose of letting him go in the first place if we're going to take on later years of his contract (the very years we let him go to avoid in the first place) PLUS having to give up prospects in order for the privilege to do so. But I do think with our current bullpen he could be a strong asset for the team and a help in the postseason. (Same with Cliff Lee)

 

I guess it all comes down to what the other teams want in terms of prospects. I'm ok with giving up money, and prospects I think we'd lose in the Rule 5 draft, but once you start getting into top 10 prospects in our system I get closer to hanging up.

[Standing Room]

Nick Cafardo

‏@nickcafardo

The Red Sox are looking everywhere for relief. Interested in White Sox trio Addison Reed, Matt Thornton and Matt Lindstrom

[italstallianion]

It's good to see that they acknowledge there is a problem and that they appear to be looking for a solution. I'm happy with pretty much any reliever in a deal that doesn't involve a top 10 prospect.

[mvp 78]

Yeah, I wouldn't trade the top 12 players listed on soxprospects as well as Christian Vazquez for a reliever.

[SoxFanForsyth]

Allen Webster was nearly unhittable in those 1-3 inning stints out of the pen during Spring Training. His control was substantially better, as well. It certainly wouldn't hurt for the Sox to see what he's got in the bullpen before sending him back down to AAA.

 

I actually really like getting young pitchers exposure in the bullpen before asking them to go out and get through a lineup 3 times. I think it's good for their development.

 

I'd like to see Webster and Workman coming out of the pen, and would also be interested to see how Britton's stuff plays out of the bullpen.

[User Name]

Allen Webster was nearly unhittable in those 1-3 inning stints out of the pen during Spring Training. His control was substantially better, as well. It certainly wouldn't hurt for the Sox to see what he's got in the bullpen before sending him back down to AAA.

 

I actually really like getting young pitchers exposure in the bullpen before asking them to go out and get through a lineup 3 times. I think it's good for their development.

 

I'd like to see Webster and Workman coming out of the pen, and would also be interested to see how Britton's stuff plays out of the bullpen.

 

David Price, Johan Santana, Matt Moore, among many others agree with you.

[User Name]

Nick Cafardo

‏@nickcafardo

The Red Sox are looking everywhere for relief. Interested in White Sox trio Addison Reed, Matt Thornton and Matt Lindstrom

 

SoxSport: "The FO is too passive, and they're not doing their due diligence in regards to finding help in the relief corps, wake up Ben!"

 

Nick Cafardo: "The FO is desperately looking for relief help.

 

 

Par for the course.

[jung]

Nick Cafardo: "The FO is desperately looking for relief help.

 

You would think we would see more signs of this "desperate" effort even as it related to our own organization. As for an effort outside the organization, I do not see many of the "almost" ever present rumors.

 

However I remain convinced that BC will do something.

[italstallianion]

They mentioned Wilhelmson from Seattle as another potential option to the White Sox trio, Papelbon, Parnell etc.

 

Maybe we can get Joba Chamberlain so he can throw at Youkilis head again.

[Behindenemylines]

The Sox should be seeing if any of these young arms they have in the minors can help them out of the pen these last few weeks of July. If no one is found then use some of the minor league trading chips they have to get a reliever from another big league roster. Bullpen is going to need some help or they will get over worked and become non-effective.

[italstallianion]

David Price, Johan Santana, Matt Moore, among many others agree with you.

 

On the flip side isn't there the potential that using a prospect groomed to be a starter as a reliever can jeopardize their chances of future success as a starter? The strategy seems like it could be a little short sighted if it doesn't work out.

[User Name]

It depends on the way it's used. Usually the SP prospects they bring up as relievers for MLB exposure are A: About to reach the big leagues full time. B: Close to their innings cap for that year.

 

And it's not that i'm flip-flopping on this either, given my RdLR argument. I usually endorse these types of moves to give kids MLB exposure. The problem with RdLR is that he's post-op, not close to his IP cap (which he should hit while starting if possible), and in dire need of some consistency.

[Dojji]

David Price, Johan Santana, Matt Moore, among many others agree with you.

 

Curt Schilling, Adam Wainwright, Nolan Ryan, and the list goes on.

[dupree]

How is Daniel Bard doing in the Minors? Just wondering... i agree with everyone i believe that the young guys should get a chance out of the pen in the majors to see if they can help the big league club this year instead of trading away prospects for an older more expensive reliever. But i think that is exactly what Ben will do he'll trade a prospect for a major league reliever.

[mvp 78]

Bard hasn't pitched in a game since May 15th.

[SoxFanForsyth]

Completely hypothetical, nothing has been said about this, I just want to get a feel for how everyone feels about trades.

 

Would you trade Bogaerts, Webster, and Workman for Chris Sale?

[italstallianion]

Completely hypothetical, nothing has been said about this, I just want to get a feel for how everyone feels about trades.

 

Would you trade Bogaerts, Webster, and Workman for Chris Sale?

 

I don't think I would. I'm not too sure though. I think Bogaerts is a special talent (kind of like a Hanley in terms of blue chip prospects) and I would value one higher at SS than SP. In addition, we'd have 6+ starters in Sale, Lackey, Lester, Dempster, Doubront, and Buchholz. Granted that problem could be solved in the offseason. In addition I feel like our present needs for the team are in the bullpen, and perhaps 3B, rather than SP.

 

On the flip side, Sale is an exceptional pitcher thus far, and in the postseason you need at least 1 ace. 2004 was aided by our trade for Schilling, and 2007 was aided by our trade for Beckett (albeit getting rid of Hanley and Anibal in the process) In addition, with Buchholz hurt and Lester sucking, we really need that ace pitcher in the postseason, and a 1-3 of Buchholz, Sale, and Lackey would be difficult to beat. Another argument for is that Sale would make Webster expendable and Workman is a nice piece but not one I'd lose sleep over.

 

On paper I think it's a good deal for us but I don't think it matches what we are looking for (and looking to give up) this season.

[SoxFanForsyth]

I don't think I would. I'm not too sure though. I think Bogaerts is a special talent (kind of like a Hanley in terms of blue chip prospects) and I would value one higher at SS than SP. In addition, we'd have 6+ starters in Sale, Lackey, Lester, Dempster, Doubront, and Buchholz. Granted that problem could be solved in the offseason. In addition I feel like our present needs for the team are in the bullpen, and perhaps 3B, rather than SP.

 

On the flip side, Sale is an exceptional pitcher thus far, and in the postseason you need at least 1 ace. 2004 was aided by our trade for Schilling, and 2007 was aided by our trade for Beckett (albeit getting rid of Hanley and Anibal in the process) In addition, with Buchholz hurt and Lester sucking, we really need that ace pitcher in the postseason, and a 1-3 of Buchholz, Sale, and Lackey would be difficult to beat. Another argument for is that Sale would make Webster expendable and Workman is a nice piece but not one I'd lose sleep over.

 

On paper I think it's a good deal for us but I don't think it matches what we are looking for (and looking to give up) this season.

 

Agree. I'm torn on the decision. He's an absolute stud, he's right in line with MLB SP averages in terms of GB and FB percentages. K rates going up, BB rates going down.

 

Then again, you've got Bogaerts, who could be a perennial MVP candidate and could give you 30+ HR year in and year out.

 

A deal that intrigues the s*** out of me is dealing some prospects (Bogaerts, Cecchini, Ranaudo, Webster, & Brentz) for Cishek and Stanton. But, that's going all in this year and crushing your "build for the future" motto, which I have heavily spoken against.

 

Patience, SFF, patience.

[Orange Juiced]

Completely hypothetical, nothing has been said about this, I just want to get a feel for how everyone feels about trades.

 

Would you trade Bogaerts, Webster, and Workman for Chris Sale?

 

No way.

[SoxFanForsyth]

Tim Collins is a guy the Red Sox should, at the very least, inquire about with the Royals.

[italstallianion]

Then again Stanton is the a year younger than Brentz, the same age as Sale (and Ranaudo), which is a year older than Webster, 3 over Bogaerts, 2 over Cecchini.

 

So I think the "sacrificing the future" would be in terms of number of players rather than age.

 

For the amount of prospects you're giving up I'd ask for either Fernandez/Turner as well but the Marlins wouldn't part with them either. And realistically their only other player of value to me would be Lo-mo, which was already redundant before the trade, let alone after.

[italstallianion]

Tim Collins is a guy the Red Sox should, at the very least, inquire about with the Royals.

 

 

I feel like one could do better as a lefty reliever than Collins. Holland/Crow would be amazing though. I prefer Oliver Perez as a replacement for Andrew Miller.

 

Billy Butler would be a future piece I'd give up prospects for. I like Alex Gordon as well. Too bad Mike Moustakas still can't hit.

[jung]

Regardless of my comments elsewhere about XB this year...this guy is a special ballplayer IMO and I just don't want to see him shipped off at this point.