2013 Spring Training

[BSN07]

So, now because of a couple bad outings, De La Rosa is a no talent bum that was overrated? That's not very fair at all.

 

Can I remind some of you that Papelbon allowed 7 ER over 8 H in his first 1.2 IP this year?

 

Cole Hamels got obliterated by the Dominican team, 12 H, 8 ER in 2.2 IP.

 

Steven Strasburg, Clayton Kershaw, and Matt Cain all have ERA's over 5 in ST.

 

I understand pessimism is in some of the posters nature, but downplaying our prospects just to downplay our prospects is just silly.

Ridiculous huh? The knee jerk reactions around here are hilarious. "Greatest Pitcher evuh", next start "what a f***in bum..."

It could be. Thing is, when these fireballers show up in camp and start hitting triple digits, the casual fan goes gaga and these kids might not know what to do with the newfound notoriety. He's still gotta keep his location in check. He reminds me a lot of Jose Ramirez on the Yankee side. The only difference is that Rubby never had good command in the minors, while Ramirez is coming off his first minor league season where he located well

 

Rubby needs time in the minors. It seemed fairly obvious even during his good starts.

 

Bradley can come up at the end of April or May and most likely not cost a year of control, look at Trout and Harper's call up dates. I think TB waits an extra month just in case with Myers so there is 0% chance they lose a year.

 

I think if Ortiz is out the first month they will cycle Napoli, Overbay, Gomes, Nava in 1B/LF/DH until Ortiz gets back. If Ortiz is out past April then I can see Bradley coming up for LF duties and Gomes platooning at DH.

[a700hitter]

So, now because of a couple bad outings, De La Rosa is a no talent bum that was overrated? That's not very fair at all.

 

Can I remind some of you that Papelbon allowed 7 ER over 8 H in his first 1.2 IP this year?

 

Cole Hamels got obliterated by the Dominican team, 12 H, 8 ER in 2.2 IP.

 

Steven Strasburg, Clayton Kershaw, and Matt Cain all have ERA's over 5 in ST.

 

I understand pessimism is in some of the posters nature, but downplaying our prospects just to downplay our prospects is just silly.

 

There is a difference between how hard guys go when they are trying to impress as opposed to when they know they have made the team.

[a700hitter]

Ridiculous huh? The knee jerk reactions around here are hilarious. "Greatest Pitcher evuh", next start "what a f***in bum..."

I never thoght he was the greatest evuh,and I don't think he is a bum now. He is exactly what I thought he would be-- a kid struggling to make the team and prove himself.

 

I was hoping he would come to camp and emerge as a big time stud and earn a rotation spot, but it doesn't look that way right now. One more outing like the last two and they will probably send him out on his minor league assignment.

[SoxFanForsyth]

There is a difference between how hard guys go when they are trying to impress as opposed to when they know they have made the team.

 

And De La Rosa was brilliant until Farrell started talking about him starting in Portland, or at best, Pawtucket. Then he started sucking. Probably started trying to do too much, overthrowing, etc.

[SoxFanForsyth]

I never thoght he was the greatest evuh,and I don't think he is a bum now. He is exactly what I thought he would be-- a kid struggling to make the team and prove himself.

 

I was hoping he would come to camp and emerge as a big time stud and earn a rotation spot, but it doesn't look that way right now. One more outing like the last two and they will probably send him out on his minor league assignment.

 

As bad as De La Rosa has been his last two outings, that's how good Webster has been. And maybe that's for the best, because Webster won't be on the same innings limits that De La Rosa is on, so they can really cut Webster loose. If we watched De La Rosa dominate every outing, it would be very tempting for the FO to try to squeeze him into a spot on this team.

 

Right now, the way Webster has thrown, and his lack of a leash on innings, at least relatively speaking, I'm very excited to see how he does today and the rest of spring. I really hope that he is the first guy called up for a spot start, so long as Morales is on the shelf. His line this far has been 8 IP, 2 ER, 1 BB, 11 K's, sitting 94-97, touching 99.

 

Very exciting. Certainly a guy, like DLR, that I look forward to watching throw everytime he goes out there

[VA Sox Fan]

Red Sox making some cuts today

 

 

Posted by Peter Abraham, Globe Staff March 12, 2013 09:01 AM

 

 

FORT MYERS, Fla. — The Red Sox are thinning out the ranks of their position players today.

 

Outfielders Alex Hassan, Jeremy Hazelbaker and Juan Carlos Linares packed up their lockers and headed for the minor league clubhouse. So did first baseman/outfielder Mark Hamilton. Righthander Steven Wright also was optioned.

 

Also:

 

• Alfredo Aceves will pitch in a minor league game on Wednesday and then start against Tampa Bay on Saturday.

 

• John Lackey will pitch in a minor league game on Saturday rather than face the Rays. As starters work deeper into games in spring training, some try to avoid divisional opponents.

 

• The Sox will start Clayton Mortensen in Sarasota against the Orioles on Friday in the split-squad doubleheader. Alex Wilson, Chris Hernandez and Oscar Villareal will follow. Felix Doubront will start the night game at home against the Twins.

[mvp 78]

And De La Rosa was brilliant until Farrell started talking about him starting in Portland, or at best, Pawtucket. Then he started sucking. Probably started trying to do too much, overthrowing, etc.

 

"After Farrell made those comments, De La Rosa plunged. Not saying it's what caused his plunge, I'm just saying that it's an interesting order of events."

 

No, that is completely what you're saying...

[SoxFanForsyth]

"After Farrell made those comments, De La Rosa plunged. Not saying it's what caused his plunge, I'm just saying that it's an interesting order of events."

 

No, that is completely what you're saying...

 

No I'm not. Correlation does not equal causation.

[SoxFanForsyth]

Nick Cafardo ‏@nickcafardo

The Red Sox aren't worried about a long term term situation with David Ortiz' sore heels based on medicals according to a team source

 

Well, this is very encouraging news. I posted this in the Ortiz MRI thread, but I'll post it here too because its worth repeating -

 

We'll be facing quite a few LHP in our first few games.

 

Yankees series, we get Pettitte and CC

Jays series, we'll get Buehrle and Romero

Orioles series, we'll get Chen and Gonzalez

Rays series, we'll get Price and Moore

 

That essentially gets us to April 16th. That also gives Ortiz a full month after his 5-7 days of rest to get his at bats in to get ready. I would think, barring any more setbacks, that he should be back by mid-April. If that's the case, we should be just fine without him for those first 13 games, as 8 of them will be vs LHP. With the likes of Gomes, Napoli, Pedroia, Victorino, Middlebrooks, and Ross, this team should crush LHP.

[Bellhorn04]

No I'm not. Correlation does not equal causation.

 

You said 'De La Rosa was brilliant until Farrell started talking about him starting in Portland, or at best, Pawtucket. Then he started sucking. Probably started trying to do too much, overthrowing, etc.'

 

You suggested probable causation, no?

[mvp 78]

No I'm not. Correlation does not equal causation.

 

But you keep bringing it up as if it were a factor. It's one thing to mention it offhandedly, it's another to bring it up multiple times.

[BSN07]

I never thoght he was the greatest evuh,and I don't think he is a bum now. He is exactly what I thought he would be-- a kid struggling to make the team and prove himself.

 

I was hoping he would come to camp and emerge as a big time stud and earn a rotation spot, but it doesn't look that way right now. One more outing like the last two and they will probably send him out on his minor league assignment.

 

And I'm pretty sure I didn't mention you in my post. Funny how you assumed I was talking about you when discussing knee jerk reactions though.

 

And again, you are completely out of touch if you think someone who pitched 13 IP was going to earn a rotation spot. That is incredibly daft from someone who supposedly has a clue.

[SoxFanForsyth]

But you keep bringing it up as if it were a factor. It's one thing to mention it offhandedly, it's another to bring it up multiple times.

 

I mentioned it twice. And the first time, I specifically said "Not that this is the reason..."

 

I mean, putting words into someones mouth is one thing. Putting them into someones mouth who blatantly said "This is not what I'm saying" is a whole different level.

[mvp 78]

I mentioned it twice. And the first time, I specifically said "Not that this is the reason..."

 

I mean, putting words into someones mouth is one thing. Putting them into someones mouth who blatantly said "This is not what I'm saying" is a whole different level.

 

And yet YOU keep using Farrell demoting him as an excuse for his performance.

 

Look, I know you projected him as the 4th starter this year, but maybe he's just not ready and needs more time? It's not a big deal if he's not ready.

[SoxFanForsyth]

And yet YOU keep using Farrell demoting him as an excuse for his performance.

 

Look, I know you projected him as the 4th starter this year, but maybe he's just not ready and needs more time? It's not a big deal if he's not ready.

 

Not at all. He's clearly not ready. He is throwing 2 inning stints all ST. It's been known well, well before his bad outings that he is not an option for the rotation starting out. I'm not blaming him at all, just noticing a coincidence. Saying he could have heard that and tried to start overthrowing is a very reasonable explanation for his loss of control.

[mvp 78]

I'm not going to belabor the point as both you and I are on the same page as to what his ceiling is. Just hope he figures it out this year and can have a realistic chance of being in the rotation in April 2014 along with Webster.

[jung]

Closer could actually be an interesting thing for the Sox to try with Rubby. He might be the kind of guy that will muster the focus needed to really be effective if the innings count is low and the the immediacy level is high as in .....closing. That might really be worth trying with him at some point. They might have a fireballing closer in the rough sitting there right under their noses.

 

Not something I would rush into but at least IMO definitely worth considering at some point.

[rjortiz]

Good lineup for the Red Sox today.

[SoxFanForsyth]

I certainly agree that Rubby would be an effective closer. I just think it's an absolute last resort. They'll exhaust every avenue to get him to start.

 

In other news, Allen Webster just continues to absolutely dominate. 11 IP, 14 K's, 1 BB, 2 ER. Just ridiculous stuff. Scouts raving about his change.

 

Exciting kid to follow.

[Bellhorn04]

I certainly agree that Rubby would be an effective closer. I just think it's an absolute last resort. They'll exhaust every avenue to get him to start.

 

In other news, Allen Webster just continues to absolutely dominate. 11 IP, 14 K's, 1 BB, 2 ER. Just ridiculous stuff. Scouts raving about his change.

 

Exciting kid to follow.

 

Yeah, this is great stuff by Webster. And a little unexpected.

[Bellhorn04]

Another solid outing by Buchholz. So far so good for him and Lester.

[rjortiz]

More excited about Buchholz, because he did it against Blue Jays regulars. Webster faced a bunch of backups and scrubs, but an encouraging outing anyway.

[SoxFanForsyth]

*Warning: The following post is both optimistic and contains references to spring training stats. Read at your own risk*

 

The entire SP has looked really good this year. Buch has yet to allow a run (8.2 IP), Lester has a 1.29 ERA in 14 IP, Dempster has a 2.08 ERA 8.2 IP, Doubront has a 3.86 ERA, and Lackey, though he has an ERA of like 8 (6.2 IP) has shown good command, especially to his glove side of the plate, which he wasn't able to do in 2011.

 

I'm certainly encouraged by the outings the SP have had this year. How that translates into the season, who knows. I know you can't take very much from any ST start, but at the same time, at least the starters are having effective starts that they can build on and be encouraged by rather than getting pummeled.

[seabeachfred]

The Dodgers thought very highly of Rubby, didn't want to include him in numerous deals at the deadline and believed he was a future big league starter.

 

http://articles.latimes.com/2011/may/24/sports/la-sp-0525-dodgers-fyi-20110525

 

Did the latimes.com also say that some teams walked away from deals with the Dodgers because they believed their price for some of their "prospects" were out of sorts? The Dodgers are infamous for over-hyping their prospects, most of whom turn out to be s***. James Loney was a No 1, Jose DeJesus (did I get the first name right?) was a No. 2 or 3. Neither did much of anything worth while for a draft choice that high. Except for Kershaw and Kemp, their team is not home grown and their development program is as bad as the Angels, save for their Mike Trout.

 

You lived in LA for awhile. You couldn't have missed all he ******** written by the flunkies who covered the team, most of which was mindless propaganda about crappy ballplayers. Fortunate for you that you don't have to read that kind of trash every day.

[seabeachfred]

Redsox are pretty good at it as well. Look at Casey Kelly and Jose Iglesias. My Cubbies did well with Anthony Rizzo thought

 

Theo Epstein knew about Anthony Rizzo when he was with the Red Sox and while somewhat of an overrated egonmaniac, he knew enough about talent to get him from the Padres when that team stupidly put him up for sale. Rizzo is going to be an outstanding hitter with power while the Red Sox even more stupidly traded the guy for Gonzales who they then traded away to recover some payroll flexibility. Now we are looking for a good young first baseman for the future and may have to trade for one or move either Boegarts or Middlebrooks there, both choices horseshit in my opinion because it takes those two out of their best position. Speaks volumes just how screwed up our front office is and how inept some of our moves have been. If we weren't going to make a major commitment to Gonzales we never should have traded Anthony Rizzo.

[seabeachfred]

So, now because of a couple bad outings, De La Rosa is a no talent bum that was overrated? That's not very fair at all.

 

Can I remind some of you that Papelbon allowed 7 ER over 8 H in his first 1.2 IP this year?

 

Cole Hamels got obliterated by the Dominican team, 12 H, 8 ER in 2.2 IP.

 

Steven Strasburg, Clayton Kershaw, and Matt Cain all have ERA's over 5 in ST.

 

I understand pessimism is in some of the posters nature, but downplaying our prospects just to downplay our prospects is just silly.

 

No one to my knowledge called DeLaRosa a bum. You just overhyped him and I cautioned you that this guy has some talent but a lot of questionmarks about him, something that set you off. I remember saying that he didn not pitch well for the Dodgers when he was brought up a couple of years ago. His fast ball was straight, he was constantly behind the hitters and he got hit hard. With proper maturity and development he can become a decent relief pitcher.......possibly. However, IMHO he is not the type you build your staff around because he is not the sharpest tool in the shed. He's had two bad outings in a row, nothing to get overly alarmed about. If this continues for the rest of ST and into the season it could mean that the Dodgers might have suckered us.

[seabeachfred]

I find it very, very, very interesting that Rubby was throwing well until Farrell came out and told the media "He's going to start in the minors. He's either going to start in Portland or Pawtucket".

 

After Farrell made those comments, De La Rosa plunged. Not saying it's what caused his plunge, I'm just saying that it's an interesting order of events.

 

After having success at the MLB level in 2011, having to take the entire year off in 2012, and hearing that you're going to be demoted potentially to AA in 2013 has got to be pretty frustrating for a guy who likely was anticipating an early-to-mid season call up for at least a few spot starts.

 

SFF, he DIDN'T have success in the bigs when he came up in 2011. He had a couple of good outings and more ineffective ones. The guy has a good arm but while not considered a project, for anyone to state that he is a top notch prospect is carrying a torch for this guy that might flicker away. He could go either way. That you need to remember.

[mvp 78]

I certainly agree that Rubby would be an effective closer. I just think it's an absolute last resort. They'll exhaust every avenue to get him to start.

 

In other news, Allen Webster just continues to absolutely dominate. 11 IP, 14 K's, 1 BB, 2 ER. Just ridiculous stuff. Scouts raving about his change.

 

Exciting kid to follow.

 

Just remember, it's only ST (unless the guy is performing poorly, apparently).

[seabeachfred]

Closer could actually be an interesting thing for the Sox to try with Rubby. He might be the kind of guy that will muster the focus needed to really be effective if the innings count is low and the the immediacy level is high as in .....closing. That might really be worth trying with him at some point. They might have a fireballing closer in the rough sitting there right under their noses.

 

Not something I would rush into but at least IMO definitely worth considering at some point.

 

That's a possibility Jung. He has a live arm and if he can combine that with some smarts and good coaching, why try him as a closer down at Pawtucket or Portland? I just feel in my bones that starting is not for him. Even the dumb Dodgers saw that.

[jacksonianmarch]

*Warning: The following post is both optimistic and contains references to spring training stats. Read at your own risk*

 

The entire SP has looked really good this year. Buch has yet to allow a run (8.2 IP), Lester has a 1.29 ERA in 14 IP, Dempster has a 2.08 ERA 8.2 IP, Doubront has a 3.86 ERA, and Lackey, though he has an ERA of like 8 (6.2 IP) has shown good command, especially to his glove side of the plate, which he wasn't able to do in 2011.

 

I'm certainly encouraged by the outings the SP have had this year. How that translates into the season, who knows. I know you can't take very much from any ST start, but at the same time, at least the starters are having effective starts that they can build on and be encouraged by rather than getting pummeled.

 

Phil Hughes' line in 2012 with zero fastball velocity was as follows..

1.56ERA 12K:3BB 1.10WHIP in Spring Training of 2012. He went on to post an ERA of 7.88 in April.