Red Sox 2012/2013 Offseason Thread

[ibot2much]

Two interesting points in the GLOBE this morning. When Cher et al did the visit with Hamilton, none of the owners were with him. This did make some think that it was a courtesy call and not a real interest.\\

 

DiceK is still in Boston..so perhaps he is thinking that MLB has a place for him as oppesed to a team in Japan?

[dupree]

Even though I think he'd improve our current roster, I'd pass. Nothing he can do, short of a 6+ WAR season, would get the fans back on his side. One bad start and everyone would be calling for his head

 

I hate the fact that they paid soo much for Dice-K & for two years he was good

now for the last 3 years he has been rehabing from injuries & they have put soo much time and effort to get him back to the old Dice-K that id hate to see him go to another club of a japanese team and excel

 

If he would accept a Tim Linceum roll as Tim did in this years post season and come in middle relief & be a bridge to the regular relievers than ive be all for that

I know it sounds like a crazy idea but seeing how it worked for the Giants and if the rotation doesnt get fortified then we will need a bridge so our regualr relievers are notoverworked

[Lucienbel]

While it would be horrendous to see Dice end up somewhere else and start pitching very good again, I don't know how realistic that actually is. He has a ton of work that still needs to be done....just his lack of consistent time on the mound over the last couple of years means a lot needs to get done. At that, he's aging, and has always shown control problems, a lot more frequently lately. I'm also a pass on Dice, not to discredit the good years that he did have.

[dupree]

Rather take a chance on Dice-K than sign for Dempster or trade for R.A. Dickey

But as was said earlier if he had 1 bad game the media would be all over it

 

Maybe the best course of action would be to have a guy that Jurrgens or one of the young propects to be that middle relief bridge to build confidence until moving into the rotation next year

 

So unless Dice-K would accept a 1 year 3million deal i say no

 

I just hope some rotation pieces start to fall our way and soon

[SoxFanForsyth]

Player A: 2011 WAR 5.9, 2012 WAR 3.3

Player B: 2011 WAR 5.6, 2012 WAR 2.0

 

Player A = Victorino

Player B = Napoli

 

It's funny that people accept the Napoli signing much more favorably than the Victorino signing.

[SoxSport]

Two interesting points in the GLOBE this morning. When Cher et al did the visit with Hamilton, none of the owners were with him. This did make some think that it was a courtesy call and not a real interest.\\

 

 

Don't think it means much. They are interested, or else they wouldn't have seen him.

They have to be interested. He's an impact player, and they have money.

 

His first choice is to stay in Texas. Everybody knows that. If Texas gets Upton and Greinke, interest in Hamilton will jump.

[SoxSport]

Player A: 2011 WAR 5.9, 2012 WAR 3.3

Player B: 2011 WAR 5.6, 2012 WAR 2.0

 

Player A = Victorino

Player B = Napoli

 

It's funny that people accept the Napoli signing much more favorably than the Victorino signing.

 

The Vic signing was a clear signal the Red Sox are preparing for Ellsbury's departure--sooner or later. He's a CFder.

[dupree]

The Vic signing was a clear signal the Red Sox are preparing for Ellsbury's departure--sooner or later. He's a CFder.

 

Thats what i think too... this was an insurance signing so if jackie bradley is not ready to assume the job in 2014. I know they say ellsbury is off the block but still it seems like some teams are calling and the right trade for a pitcher will need him outta here

[rjortiz]

Player A: 2011 WAR 5.9, 2012 WAR 3.3

Player B: 2011 WAR 5.6, 2012 WAR 2.0

 

Player A = Victorino

Player B = Napoli

 

It's funny that people accept the Napoli signing much more favorably than the Victorino signing.

 

I think Victorino could hit 20 triples in Fenway.

[SoxFanForsyth]

2011-2012:

 

Victorino WAR: 9.2

J Upton WAR: 8.9

Hamilton WAR: 8.4

 

I'm just saying. The talk about how bad the Victorino signing was is completely and utterly out of hand. He's been more valuable the past 2 seasons combined than a lot of guys who people would pay a lot for, in terms of prospects or dollars.

[dupree]

2011-2012:

 

Victorino WAR: 9.2

J Upton WAR: 8.9

Hamilton WAR: 8.4

 

I'm just saying. The talk about how bad the Victorino signing was is completely and utterly out of hand. He's been more valuable the past 2 seasons combined than a lot of guys who people would pay a lot for, in terms of prospects or dollars.

 

Wow that is interesting

Never would of thought of that... I have to say im surprised

but those WAR #s are Vic playing CF correct... i didnt pay any attention when he went to LA where he played at

[SoxFanForsyth]

Another side note of Victorino:

 

He has played 1,133 innings in RF and has a career UZR/150 of 19.5 in RF.

 

His career UZR/150 in CF (6,572 innings) is 3.1.

 

All of this to say that his war will only increase when he is moved to RF, as WAR is largely dependent on UZR.

 

As a bit of a comp, or more just to show how much it affects war, see Brett Gardner.

 

In 2011, Gardner hit .259/.345/.369, wRC+ of 86, wOBA of .310, UZR of 25.8, WAR 5.2.

 

You put a 19.5 UZR on Victorino and he's actually a 4.5-5.0 WAR player on a regular basis.

[BSN07]

The Diamondbacks have agreed to sign right-hander Brandon McCarthy, John Gambadoro reports (on Twitter).

[SeanJohn93]

what does uzr stand for

[a700hitter]

Another side note of Victorino:

 

He has played 1,133 innings in RF and has a career UZR/150 of 19.5 in RF.

 

His career UZR/150 in CF (6,572 innings) is 3.1.

 

All of this to say that his war will only increase when he is moved to RF, as WAR is largely dependent on UZR.

 

As a bit of a comp, or more just to show how much it affects war, see Brett Gardner.

 

In 2011, Gardner hit .259/.345/.369, wRC+ of 86, wOBA of .310, UZR of 25.8, WAR 5.2.

 

You put a 19.5 UZR on Victorino and he's actually a 4.5-5.0 WAR player on a regular basis.

So, he is about as good as Brett Gardner for $39 million?

[wyo-sox]

I have not liked the idea of big dollars for Hamilton..... but the more I think about it I like it. If we were to sign him for four years, and get a true ace (even if we wait till next year).......

 

That gives us one of if not the best infielders in Pedroia, one of if not the best outfielders in Hamilton, and an ace in ???????

 

I think that combination as a foundation really lets role players shine, is great for young players to come up around, and makes us pretty competative quickly.

[BSN07]

what does uzr stand for

 

UZR (ultimate zone rating): The number of runs above or below average a fielder is in both range runs, outfield arm runs, double play runs and error runs combined.

 

UZR/150 (ultimate zone rate per 150 games): The number of runs above or below average a fielder is, per 150 defensive games.

[BSN07]

I have not liked the idea of big dollars for Hamilton..... but the more I think about it I like it. If we were to sign him for four years, and get a true ace (even if we wait till next year).......

 

That gives us one of if not the best infielders in Pedroia, one of if not the best outfielders in Hamilton, and an ace in ???????

 

I think that combination as a foundation really lets role players shine, is great for young players to come up around, and makes us pretty competative quickly.

 

If I was the Sox I'd offer 4/100M. What I don't like is what i read earlier today that Texas will get the chance to top any offer. I'd let them sign Grienke then make my best offer and say I need an answer ASAP or it's off the table.

[wyo-sox]

If I was the Sox I'd offer 4/100M. What I don't like is what i read earlier today that Texas will get the chance to top any offer. I'd let them sign Grienke then make my best offer and say I need an answer ASAP or it's off the table.

 

With you 110%. I think Hamilton on the roster make Napoli and Victirino a ton more valuable

[Lucienbel]

The Diamondbacks have agreed to sign right-hander Brandon McCarthy, John Gambadoro reports (on Twitter).

 

Just read this a minute ago. This is too bad really. But holy crap the Diamondbacks have a lot of good and really young arms.

[a700hitter]

If I was the Sox I'd offer 4/100M. What I don't like is what i read earlier today that Texas will get the chance to top any offer. I'd let them sign Grienke then make my best offer and say I need an answer ASAP or it's off the table.

That's how the Yankees have been bagging FAs and trades for years. They make their best offer and the tell the player or GM that the offer expires when they walk out the door. That's what our guys need to do.

[a700hitter]

The MFYs may get lucky and get out of ARod's contract if he is finished. That would suck.

[dupree]

With you 110%. I think Hamilton on the roster make Napoli and Victirino a ton more valuable

 

Hamilton Napoli & Ortiz in the middle of the order

Possibly the best 3 4 5 trio in baseball

[a700hitter]

Phillies Notes: Willingham, Ross, Suzuki, Ellsbury

 

Posted by Mark Polishuk on Friday Dec 7th at 5:28pm

 

Here's the latest on Philadelphia's offseason dealings, courtesy of CSNPhilly.com's Jim Salisbury... Before the Phillies acquired Ben Revere from the Twins, they attempted to also get Josh Willingham in either the same trade package or in a separate deal. The club is still in the market for a corner outfielder.* The Phillies "have seriously considered" signing Ichiro Suzuki and "have long liked" Cody Ross. Any further upgrades may have to come via the free agency market since the Phillies don't have much prospect depth aside from possibly at catcher.* Salisbury notes that Tommy Joseph, the most well-regarded of the team's young catchers, "probably isn't going anywhere." The Red Sox approached the Phillies about a trade of Jacoby Ellsbury for Cliff Lee, but the Phillies said that Lee wasn't available.* I can't blame the Phils for turning that offer down; even if they did want to move Lee, he would fetch far more on the trade market than just one year of Ellsbury, who hits free agency next winter.

[Bellhorn04]

The MFYs may get lucky and get out of ARod's contract if he is finished. That would suck.

 

You mean the insurance policy? I read that it would cover 75% of the contract if he was declared physically unable to perform. I don't know how that would affect the payroll for lux tax purposes. Anybody?

[Bellhorn04]

So who the hell are they going to get for the rotation. Seems like it's starting to narrow down to:

 

a) Trade

Sanchez

c) Dumpster dive

[dupree]

 

For a pitcher like Cliff Lee I wouldnt mind to see Ells move along with some prospects that would be a huge move... but u have to factor into Lee salary because I think if they got blown away with an offer but the red sox would have to take over his whole contract philly dont move him & then still pay any for him

 

Lester & Lee together at the top of the rotation would be scary for other clubs i like it

[Palodios]

Reports have said that the Phillies aren't interested in trading Lee, and they already filled their center field spot.

[Palodios]

The MFYs may get lucky and get out of ARod's contract if he is finished. That would suck.

 

I read that the other day as well, but it sounded like it was a hypothetical, and not based on any facts or knowledge of the insurance policy. I thought that insurance companies simply don't insure players after 3-4 years of a contract because they'd almost always get burned.

[SoxFanForsyth]

My guess is that the sox make a major acquisition via a trade.

 

I think it's going to make massive waves because its going to be for someone who nobody ever thought would be available.

 

Whether its for Gerrit Cole, perhaps Trevor Bauer, a 3 way deal for David Price, blow away the Dodgers for Clayton Kershaw, I'm not sure, but I'll tell you what, they're going to land a monster pitcher.