What's next for Daniel Bard?

[FredLynn]

Bard brought all this upon himself.

 

Had the FO been quicker on the trigger to get him out of the starting rotation he might have been more salvageable. The longer you practice bad habits and the more confidence you lose the harder it is for you to get back into proper form.

Yes, most of this is Bard's fault. But I think that some of the blame has to be shared by the FO.

[SCM33]

Hate to say but it's likely FO screwed Bard's career with this experiment. Sure' date=' by the time seemed the "correct" move given the circumstances (They didn't bring a SP, which pissed me off). As I've said here and there even before they "converted him into a SP", Bard's problem is in his head IMO, and that gentlemen is maybe harder to fix. We'll see how this ends up.[/quote']

 

Had the FO been quicker on the trigger to get him out of the starting rotation he might have been more salvageable. The longer you practice bad habits and the more confidence you lose the harder it is for you to get back into proper form.

Yes, most of this is Bard's fault. But I think that some of the blame has to be shared by the FO.

 

 

Bard wanted this. In fact, when they attempted to use him as a reliever earlier in the year, he made sure to point out that he is still a starter, and wanted to remain a starter.

 

They had to let Bard fail to such epic proportions to get the idea of him as a starter out of his head.

 

Many of us said it before the season started. Hes not a starter, hes not a closer....he was a MR all along.

[seabeachfred]

Bard wanted this. In fact, when they attempted to use him as a reliever earlier in the year, he made sure to point out that he is still a starter, and wanted to remain a starter.

 

They had to let Bard fail to such epic proportions to get the idea of him as a starter out of his head.

 

Many of us said it before the season started. Hes not a starter, hes not a closer....he was a MR all along.

 

Very true SCM but the revisionists on this board will say that none of us said that---which is pure bulls@it!!!!!! Lots of us said that Bard not a starter and he would fail in that spot and it was paramount for the Red Sox to go out and spend money on a starter--which Prune Face Henry steadfastly refused to do. Bard was a good set-up 8th inning man and that is where they should have kept him. If any change was to be made in his role they might have tried to see if he could close a few games in ST. A case where an inmate ran the asylum, sure, the team let him fail so miserably that he did in fact get the idea of starter out of his head but at what a price? He is close to being a basket case right and I think that for him it is going to be a long way back.

[SoxSport]

Yeah, the FO screwed it up, but I think Bard will eventually come back OK. Athletes have great resiliency. I believe his move to starter was almost totally motivated by cost cutting, and it blew up in their faces.

 

The Red Sox management seems to have fallen apart the last few years, and Henry really hasn't cleaned house as much as he should have. That's my impression, anyways. They got spoiled, maybe, with too much money to spend. Kind of like those hedgefunders and swaps guys. Right, Henry?

[SoxSport]

Revisionist history. Sox weren't going to give up the prospects Beane wanted for Gio.

 

And what prospects were those? They had enough to get ONE pitcher. Not both.

[kapsis21]

Bard still sucking at AAA, with walks and hit batters.

Bard still struggling

[RedSoxNC84]

I really hope Bard turns it around, it would be such a disgrace for his talent to become wasted because the Sox tooled with him too much trying to make him a successful starter.

[kapsis21]

not sure if he bitched and moaned about earning a big payday and wanted to be a starter or FO giving him the edge to do it, but it would seriously will be a waste if he cant figure it out.

[mvp 78]

And what prospects were those? They had enough to get ONE pitcher. Not both.

 

This makes no sense as Reddick wasn't the Red Sox highest rated prospect. They could have done Renaudo/Brentz/Boegarts and might have gotten Gio. It's not like they emptied the farm for Bailey. I just think the Sox didn't value Gio as high as the Nats did and wouldn't have given up a haul for Gio.

[BornToRun]

not sure if he bitched and moaned about earning a big payday and wanted to be a starter or FO giving him the edge to do it' date=' but it would seriously will be a waste if he cant figure it out.[/quote']

 

Its gonna take some time. He isn't going to magically revert to the old Dan so quickly. It might be a while but lets just be thankful that we have a good enough bullpen to survive it.

[kapsis21]

Its gonna take some time. He isn't going to magically revert to the old Dan so quickly. It might be a while but lets just be thankful that we have a good enough bullpen to survive it.

 

Amen to that. I love your and sff's patience. Taking my tiny rant back but he definitely needs to figure out soon

[jung]

He needs to find his arm slot again and his whole motion sort of results in an arm slot. Pitching at a major league level is amazingly different from doing just about anything else with a baseball.

 

It ain't easy. At least he looks like he is optimistic. Thank God he is not wearing the Lester Halloween mask of eternal frown.

[BornToRun]

Amen to that. I love your and sff's patience. Taking my tiny rant back but he definitely needs to figure out soon

 

I've found that patience is a virtue when one is a Red Sox fan. Without it, I'd probably be occupying a cell once called home by the unibomber.

[FredLynn]

Bard still sucking at AAA, with walks and hit batters.

Bard still struggling

 

IF Bard makes it back, it likely won't be this year. He is so screwed up by the changes in his delivery and the mental softness he has to have much hope of helping the club this year. It will take him all offseason to figure it out, if he ever figures it out again. Even odds he is washed up permanently in terms of reaching where he once was.

[jung]

I am not sure that Bard would not have fallen apart on his own to be honest. I have always had my doubts about him. I just don't think he has it.

 

I have said before that I think the Sox deviated off the path they had started him down because they concluded he would not be a reliable closer. At that point I think it became a "what do we do next with Bard kind of thing".

 

I don't think the Sox ever thought much of the risk involved in seeing if Bard could be a starter because they really did not have a plan for him at that point and getting a starter out of the deal would have been just fine by them.

 

The amount of time Bard has spent as an effective major league anything is miniscule. At some point I think we just will need to deal with that. I suspect the Sox already have and will try to see what they can get out of Bard because he is a Sox property. I doubt they are losing sleep over it though.

[seabeachfred]

IF Bard makes it back' date=' it likely won't be this year. He is so screwed up by the changes in his delivery and the mental softness he has to have much hope of helping the club this year. It will take him all offseason to figure it out, if he ever figures it out again. Even odds he is washed up permanently in terms of reaching where he once was.[/quote']

 

As Leo Durocher once said..."STICK A FORK IN HIM HE'S DONE"!!!!!!!!! The hopers and prayers are all keeping their fingers crossed that he will come back but uncross them my friends. Cherington and Bard by their actions condemned the latter to a shortened career. True, this is only MY opinion but just look as how screwed up he is in his mechancs and in his head. Again using a Durocherism.....For Bard and a few of his sidekicks still onthe Red Sox, "BACK UP THE TRUCK"!!!!!!!!!

[jacksonianmarch]

There are a few of us who talked about the fact that the sox were playing with dynamite here. Most thought it couldnt hurt, a few (take a bow Dojji), thought he'd be an ACE, LIGHTS OUT!! But I said that he came into professional baseball with impressive physical talents but a 10 cent head. They had to strip him down and make it easy on him to succeed. And succeed he did. They should have taken his struggles as a closer into account when they slotted him into the rotation. He's a great setup man, elite, rubber armed relief ace. But they f***ed with him, and now they need to teach an older dog new tricks. Kids can turn around their mental woes. Men have more trouble. And unf***ing a guy with his kind of prior success will be hard to do

[SoxFanForsyth]

Who is this Daniel Bard character?

[a700hitter]

Who is this Daniel Bard character?

I think he is a character in a TV Western. The words of the theme to the show goes something like "Daniel Bard was a man. he was a real man..." Something like that. I think he was played by the now deceased, Fes Parker.

[iortiz]

The question is... Did they really think that Bard could be a solid starter, or simply didn't want to spend and he was the only option by the time.... We'll never know.

 

In the meantime we lost an elite setup arm, just like that. Thanks FO.

[FredLynn]

I think he is a character in a TV Western. The words of the theme to the show goes something like "Daniel Bard was a man. he was a real man..." Something like that. I think he was played by the now deceased' date=' Fes Parker.[/quote']

 

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff139/riflemanray/chuck_connors_at_home.jpg

 

DANIEL BARD

[SoxSport]

Why are the Red Sox pitchers so soft? You look down the starters, and none of them seems capable of getting beyond the 7th inning. And most are inconsistent. And then there's Bard, who seems to have a mental block about what his role is.

 

In the old days, pitchers took the ball and went out and pitched. If they threw good in relief a couple of times back from injury, they started a game. No pussying around in AAA and no pitch count machines. I can't recall injuries being such a big factor in those days.

 

Today, Doubront looked like a worn out pitcher. They say he's thrown too many innings already. The conditioning just isn't there with these guys. Their durability sucks. Maybe the pitch count machine has affected their arm strength.

[FredLynn]

Why are the Red Sox pitchers so soft? You look down the starters, and none of them seems capable of getting beyond the 7th inning. And most are inconsistent. And then there's Bard, who seems to have a mental block about what his role is.

 

In the old days, pitchers took the ball and went out and pitched. If they threw good in relief a couple of times back from injury, they started a game. No pussying around in AAA and no pitch count machines. I can't recall injuries being such a big factor in those days.

 

Today, Doubront looked like a worn out pitcher. They say he's thrown too many innings already. The conditioning just isn't there with these guys. Their durability sucks. Maybe the pitch count machine has affected their arm strength.

 

In fairness to Doubront, he is a rookie and its conceivable that he will become better next year or the year after. A good pitching coach would help. And today, despite leaving after five innings or so, he gave up only one run. Right now he is probably tired, stressed, and is performing at a mediocre level. He could use a stint on the DL soon.

[SCM33]

The question is... Did they really think that Bard could be a solid starter' date=' or simply didn't want to spend and he was the only option by the time.... We'll never know.[/quote']

 

Both.

[redsoxbeatz]

I guess I don't understand enough mechanically or physically, mentally, w/e, why it is Bard is going to take so long if ever to becoming his normal self again? So he had like two or three pitches he threw really well and then had to find X pitch third or fourth to become an effective starter. yadda yadda yadda...Is it we speculate his confidence is blown or his arm is f***ed up from stretching it too much too fast too hard or what?

[example1]

I have no clue redsoxbeatz. I believe that the Sox had a philosophy for awhile of only letting relievers pitch out of the stretch. I got the sense that they trained it up and down the system. They don't appear to require that anymore (see Aceves and Melancon). If nothing else, the stretch allowed pitchers to: a) simplify their motion at all times and not have to adjust when there are runners on.

 

With Bard, who apparently did a lot of simplification of his delivery and working on the particulars, perhaps shifting his delivery to include pitching out of the windup had him lose whatever 'check points' he had developed to know that he was executing his delivery appropriately. He's talked about arm-slot and things, which might be related.

 

I still have faith that the Sox aren't going to give up on Bard but we shouldn't expect anything out of him for 2012, which is a shame given how good he was in 2011, 2010, etc.,

[a700hitter]

Why are the Red Sox pitchers so soft? You look down the starters, and none of them seems capable of getting beyond the 7th inning. And most are inconsistent. And then there's Bard, who seems to have a mental block about what his role is.

 

In the old days, pitchers took the ball and went out and pitched. If they threw good in relief a couple of times back from injury, they started a game. No pussying around in AAA and no pitch count machines. I can't recall injuries being such a big factor in those days.

 

Today, Doubront looked like a worn out pitcher. They say he's thrown too many innings already. The conditioning just isn't there with these guys. Their durability sucks. Maybe the pitch count machine has affected their arm strength.

They promote their shoulder program as something great for pitchers, but yet our pitchers hardly ever pitch deep into games. The proof of their program is right there. It's a farce.

[Bellhorn04]

Bard had another disaster outing tonight. A couple of hits, a couple of HBP, a couple of wild pitches. You couldn't make this s*** up.

[a700hitter]

Bard had another disaster outing tonight. A couple of hits' date=' a couple of HBP, a couple of wild pitches. You couldn't make this s*** up.[/quote']... And he didn't get anyone out.

[Station 13]

Insane they have not shut him down yet. Let his shoulder rest till after the break.