Official 2009-2010 Hot Stove season thread

[BoSox21]

Agree with you here. But i'll be content with anything that is not Kotchman at 1B.

 

Well right now, it's still Lowell at 3rd and Youk at 1st

[Dipre]

Well right now' date=' it's still Lowell at 3rd and Youk at 1st[/quote']

 

I doubt Lowell doesn't get moved though.

[riverside sluggers]

If the Sox sign Beltre, I wonder how it would affect acquiring AGon

[Dipre]

If the Sox sign Beltre' date=' I wonder how it would affect acquiring AGon[/quote']

 

It wouldn't happen. Plain and simple.

[example1]

Im confident that if not now' date=' the Sox will get a big bat in July[/quote']

 

Every sign seems to point towards that being the team's thinking.

 

If the Sox sign Beltre' date=' I wonder how it would affect acquiring AGon[/quote']

 

It wouldn't happen. Plain and simple.

 

So every sign points toward a hitter, but you apparently think it will either not be Adrian Gonzalez or you think they're not that interested in Beltre. Is that right?

 

I think Youkilis or Gonzalez would be an excellent DH after Papi leaves, with the ability to spell one-another as much as necessary at 1B and Youk taking over for Beltre as needed. There shouldn't be a logjam there.

 

Beltre would be a nice addition, but he's a piece, not the answer. I think a team could certainly win a World Series with Beltre manning 3B and Cameron in LF or CF, the question is who the other pieces will be.

 

I agree that they are one big bat away from being a tremendous team. Teixeira was that projected bat initially, now they're searching for the next best thing and I'm pretty confident they will find him sooner than later.

[bsox0407]

So every sign points toward a hitter' date=' but you apparently think it will either not be Adrian Gonzalez or you think they're not that interested in Beltre. Is that right?[/quote']

 

I think what he means is that we would have a log jam between 1Bs 3Bss and DHs

 

I think Youkilis or Gonzalez would be an excellent DH after Papi leaves, with the ability to spell one-another as much as necessary at 1B and Youk taking over for Beltre as needed. There shouldn't be a logjam there.

 

This would not however be next year. IMO if the Sox sign Beltre than the Off season for the sox is closed up shop.

 

Beltre would be a nice addition, but he's a piece, not the answer. I think a team could certainly win a World Series with Beltre manning 3B and Cameron in LF or CF, the question is who the other pieces will be.

 

If the Sox were to Get Gonzo and being that Youk is a good defensive player Beltre would kind of fall by the way side.

 

I agree that they are one big bat away from being a tremendous team. Teixeira was that projected bat initially, now they're searching for the next best thing and I'm pretty confident they will find him sooner than later.

 

I agree with this completely.

 

Overall if the Sox Sign Beltre I believe that is highly unlikely that they would then get Gonzo.

[Dojji]

I still kinda wish they'd just go after Konerko or Berkman. Pay the lesser price, get loaded up for one season, and have the guy come off the books when Lowell, Ortiz and Lugo do, and watch what guys like Anderson, Rizzo, and some of the longshots do in the minors. 2011 is a potential "major reloading" year and we're going to have a lot of holes to fill in that offseason. It's not really a good time to be depleting your upper minors.

[BSN07]

Right now I expect some sort of rotation of Youk/V-Mart/Lowell/Papi between the 1B,3B,DH, (with Martinez obviously catching as well) spots to begin the season(substitute Ramirez if the Lowell trade goes through). By the TDL they should know if one or more of the rotation needs to be replaced and could look for a bat via trade. If it's working then they probably won't look to add anyone big and see how it goes.

 

I don't see Beltre coming to Boston anymore. I was never sold on Agon coming to Boston before the season anyways. I think the Sox are done with any significant moves this off season. I expect them to go to battle with what they have and make some interesting moves next offseason with a good amount of money coming off the Books.

[Plumpamania]

Not acknowledging that Vazquez is an upgrade to the rotation is flat out stupid

 

Thinking Vazquez will have his 2009 in 2010 by going from the NL to the AL. From Turner Field to Yankee Stadium. That sir is flat out stupid. He'll be an equal to Joba's numbers from last year (except for the IP amount) or worse.

[Dipre]

I still kinda wish they'd just go after Konerko or Berkman. Pay the lesser price' date=' get loaded up for one season, and have the guy come off the books when Lowell, Ortiz and Lugo do, and watch what guys like Anderson, Rizzo, and some of the longshots do in the minors. 2011 is a potential "major reloading" year and we're going to have a lot of holes to fill in that offseason. [b']It's not really a good time to be depleting your upper minors.[/b]

 

It's never a good time to deplete your upper minors, but if you can get a young, productive offensive player/pitcher then you go for it instead of Konerko or Berkman.

[Dojji]

Sure, but don't pursue those negotiations to the exclusion of Plan B. Make sure you get SOMETHING.

[Dipre]

Sure' date=' but don't pursue those negotiations to the exclusion of Plan B. Make sure you get SOMETHING.[/quote']

 

Agreed.

[jacksonianmarch]

Thinking Vazquez will have his 2009 in 2010 by going from the NL to the AL. From Turner Field to Yankee Stadium. That sir is flat out stupid. He'll be an equal to Joba's numbers from last year (except for the IP amount) or worse.

 

Did I ever say that I am expecting Vazquez to have an ERA under 3? No, but he gives innings and strikes out a ton of batters.

[SoxSport]

The Red Sox are in a good position right now.They will probably sign another RHd hitting outfielder. If the price is right, they might sign Beltre. If not, they can wait until ST and see how Lowell is playing. Lowell could be traded, or he could play 3B--or even DH and play 1B some. I have no doubt he can play 1B, having played 3B. A common switch. Or they might sign Branyon, if the price is right. Or they might trade for AdGon at some point.

 

What might complicate things is if the Yankees signed Holliday. Then, they might be compelled to push for an AdGon trade. They have the pieces to make it happen. You make an offer that can't be refused. Hoyer knows he has to trade AdGon eventually, anyways.

[The_Destroyah]

Did I ever say that I am expecting Vazquez to have an ERA under 3? No' date=' but he gives innings and strikes out a ton of batters.[/quote']

 

honestly I think the Vasquez pick up was a pretty good move for the Yanks, he solidify's the rotation and while he is no Cy Young candidate he throws strikes and can eat a lot of innings for you, not an amazing move but I think it was a good grab especially out of the 4 spot.

[The_Destroyah]

The Red Sox are in a good position right now.They will probably sign another RHd hitting outfielder. If the price is right, they might sign Beltre. If not, they can wait until ST and see how Lowell is playing. Lowell could be traded, or he could play 3B--or even DH and play 1B some. I have no doubt he can play 1B, having played 3B. A common switch. Or they might sign Branyon, if the price is right. Or they might trade for AdGon at some point.

 

What might complicate things is if the Yankees signed Holliday. Then, they might be compelled to push for an AdGon trade. They have the pieces to make it happen. You make an offer that can't be refused. Hoyer knows he has to trade AdGon eventually, anyways.

 

I don't think AdGon moves in the off season, he might move around the Trade Deadline though depending on how desperate some contenders are for sluggers.

[jacksonianmarch]

I'd go one step further and say that the only way AdGon is dealt is if the sox hurt their current team more than they help it by adding AdGon, right now.

[Dipre]

I'd go one step further and say that the only way AdGon is dealt is if the sox hurt their current team more than they help it by adding AdGon' date=' right now.[/quote']

 

Please expound on this idea.

 

In what way?

[jacksonianmarch]

Well, I think there isnt an incentive for SD to deal AdGon unless they got some serious right now talent. Now, those restrictions will lighten when he gets closer to FA. But right now, they have 2 yrs of cost controlled dollars invested in this guy and he is a great fit for the community. He's a pretty big draw for a team that doesnt really have any other drawing points. So, there really is a disincentive to dealing him, unless the sox overwhelm SD with something they can grasp. I honestly think that the asking price would be something like Ellsbury + Buchholz or Bard or some combination of top level young pitcher and top level young position player. Right now, that would create a hole that may not be worth making. Now, as the year goes on and SD slips out of contention, a minor league prospect grab might be more amenable to Hoyer and it could get done

[Dipre]

Well' date=' I think there isnt an incentive for SD to deal AdGon unless they got some serious right now talent. Now, those restrictions will lighten when he gets closer to FA. But right now, they have 2 yrs of cost controlled dollars invested in this guy and he is a great fit for the community. He's a pretty big draw for a team that doesnt really have any other drawing points. So, there really is a disincentive to dealing him, unless the sox overwhelm SD with something they can grasp. I honestly think that the asking price would be something like Ellsbury + Buchholz or Bard or some combination of top level young pitcher and top level young position player. Right now, that would create a hole that may not be worth making. Now, as the year goes on and SD slips out of contention, a minor league prospect grab might be more amenable to Hoyer and it could get done[/quote']

 

You keep saying the same thing.

 

Hoyer publicly asked for pieces that are not necessarily "Win now".

 

Who do i believe?

[jacksonianmarch]

Find me a source to where he "publicly asked" for anyone

[Dipre]

Find me a source to where he "publicly asked" for anyone

 

You've asked this question four times.

 

Four times i've presented you with different links where Hoyer is quoted as looking for "Bucholz and one of Westmoreland and Kelly plus a couple additional pieces".

 

If you want it, go back and find it yourself.

 

Click on the links when they're presented to you.

[jacksonianmarch]

He has never once specifically said that. Never once.

[Dipre]

He has never once specifically said that. Never once.

 

Lol ok.

 

I've posted the link like 400 times.

 

You don't click it, that's you problem.

 

Believe what you will.

[Plumpamania]

Did I ever say that I am expecting Vazquez to have an ERA under 3? No' date=' but he gives innings and strikes out a ton of batters.[/quote']

 

Year Age Tm Lg W L W-L% ERA G GS GF CG SHO SV IP H R ER HR BB IBB SO HBP BK WP BF ERA+ WHIP H/9 HR/9 BB/9 SO/9 SO/BB Awards 
1998 21 MON NL 5 15 .250 6.06 33 32 1 0 0 0 172.1 196 121 116 31 68 2 139 11 0 2 764 69 1.532 10.2 1.6 3.6 7.3 2.04  
1999 22 MON NL 9 8 .529 5.00 26 26 0 3 1 0 154.2 154 98 86 20 52 4 113 4 0 2 667 89 1.332 9.0 1.2 3.0 6.6 2.17  
2000 23 MON NL 11 9 .550 4.05 33 33 0 2 1 0 217.2 247 104 98 24 61 10 196 5 0 3 945 119 1.415 10.2 1.0 2.5 8.1 3.21  
2001 24 MON NL 16 11 .593 3.42 32 32 0 5 3 0 223.2 197 92 85 24 44 4 208 3 1 3 898 130 1.077 7.9 1.0 1.8 8.4 4.73  
2002 25 MON NL 10 13 .435 3.91 34 34 0 2 0 0 230.1 243 111 100 28 49 6 179 4 0 3 971 108 1.268 9.5 1.1 1.9 7.0 3.65  
2003 26 MON NL 13 12 .520 3.24 34 34 0 4 1 0 230.2 198 93 83 28 57 5 241 4 1 11 938 139 1.105 7.7 1.1 2.2 9.4 4.23  
2004 27 NYY AL 14 10 .583 4.91 32 32 0 0 0 0 198.0 195 114 108 33 60 3 150 11 2 12 849 92 1.288 8.9 1.5 2.7 6.8 2.50 AS 
2005 28 ARI NL 11 15 .423 4.42 33 33 0 3 1 0 215.2 223 112 106 35 46 4 192 5 0 7 904 100 1.247 9.3 1.5 1.9 8.0 4.17  
2006 29 CHW AL 11 12 .478 4.84 33 32 0 1 0 0 202.2 206 116 109 23 56 2 184 15 0 7 872 98 1.293 9.1 1.0 2.5 8.2 3.29  
2007 30 CHW AL 15 8 .652 3.74 32 32 0 2 0 0 216.2 197 95 90 29 50 2 213 7 0 5 882 126 1.140 8.2 1.2 2.1 8.8 4.26  
2008 31 CHW AL 12 16 .429 4.67 33 33 0 1 0 0 208.1 214 113 108 25 61 2 200 6 0 2 890 98 1.320 9.2 1.1 2.6 8.6 3.28  
2009 32 ATL NL 15 10 .600 2.87 32 32 0 3 0 0 219.1 181 75 70 20 44 2 238 4 0 6 874 143 1.026 7.4 0.8 1.8 9.8 5.41 CYA-4 

 

He'll K a few batters even in the AL. But giving IP and giving up a 5.00 ERA (or a 4.91 like his last stint in his prime with the Yankees) is that a good thing?

[Plumpamania]

http://www.nesn.com/2009/12/padres-gm-jed-hoyer-talks-bostons-chances-of-landing-adrian-gonzalez.html

 

Dated December 12.

[Dipre]

http://www.nesn.com/2009/12/padres-gm-jed-hoyer-talks-bostons-chances-of-landing-adrian-gonzalez.html

 

Dated December 12.

 

I've posted like four links besides that one.

 

Dude always comes back with the same exact statement.

 

Pretty humorous really.

[neilpatrickharris]

I'm going to have to agree with Jacksonianmarch, I'm almost certain Hoyer has never explicitly stated who he wants for Gonzalez. I don't think you'll find any GM who would say that. Also that link is extremely vague and is basically your standard NESN interview.

[Dipre]

I'm going to have to agree with Jacksonianmarch' date=' I'm almost certain Hoyer has never explicitly stated who he wants for Gonzalez. I don't think you'll find any GM who would say that. Also that link is extremely vague and is basically your standard NESN interview.[/quote']

 

The Boston Red Sox would apparently love to take Adrian Gonzalez(notes) off the hands of the San Diego Padres and the two sides supposedly engaged in conversation about just such a deal, but now things are "going nowhere," according to the Boston Globe.

 

The problem is that Padres GM Jed Hoyer, who used to work for Boston, supposedly wants Clay Buchholz(notes) and right-handed pitching prospect Casey Kelly or outfielder Ryan Westmoreland for the 27-year-old first baseman Gonzalez. Former Red Sox scouting director Jason McLeod also works for Hoyer so these guys really know the Boston system inside and out.

 

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/rumors/post/Red-Sox-Padres-conversations-about-Adrian-Gonzal?urn=mlb,208455

 

I'll believe all the other news sources and Jacko ,this information has been relayed by a large numbers of news outlets. They can't all be making this up.

[Dojji]

The problem comes when these sources start cyclically quoting themselves and it becomes difficult to tell where the first one came from. For all we know someone's misinterpreting speculation as a sourced quote and it sort of went viral.