The Clemens Watch

[a700hitter]

I'm actually agreeing with a Yankee fan? Well yes, you are right. Then again Dan Douquette was a lousy person from the get-go, a real low lifer who showed no respect to anyone but demanded a boatload of love from everyone else.

First of all, never agree with a Yankee fan. Are we getting a little soft on these boards? They showed us no mercy before 2004, so we should always keep a foot on their throats. As for Duke, he made a bad business move, but let's face it Rajah was the Pillsbury Dough Boy before he left the Red Sox. How could he foresee that the Rocket would have a body makeover that would return him to his ealier glory? His record in his last 3 years was barely .500. Also, let's not forget that the ownership Duke was dealing with was incompetent and unimaginative. They had no idea how to capitalize on their assets. We heard from them the small team market mentality that they could not compete financially for high-priced free agents. That used to infuriate me, because Red Sox ownership had unparalleled marketing opportunities in the whole New England region. Also, let's not forget that several of the players that exercised the demons were here because of Duke-- such as Pedro (a very nice replacement for the Rocket), Trot, Manny, Wakefield, and Lowe. I am not sure if Duke signed Damon, and another Duke signee Nomah, unfortunately did not make it to the promised land with us. Finally, Duke was okay in my book when I saw him in St. Louis at game 4 of the World Series on his own dime, not as a guest of the Red Sox. He is above all else a devoted fan of Red Sox Nation, and that supersedes any of his transgressions.

[Sox Fan on Cape]

First of all, never agree with a Yankee fan. Are we getting a little soft on these boards? They showed us no mercy before 2004, so we should always keep a foot on their throats. As for Duke, he made a bad business move, but let's face it Rajah was the Pillsbury Dough Boy before he left the Red Sox. How could he foresee that the Rocket would have a body makeover that would return him to his ealier glory? His record in his last 3 years was barely .500. Also, let's not forget that the ownership Duke was dealing with was incompetent and unimaginative. They had no idea how to capitalize on their assets. We heard from them the small team market mentality that they could not compete financially for high-priced free agents. That used to infuriate me, because Red Sox ownership had unparalleled marketing opportunities in the whole New England region. Also, let's not forget that several of the players that exercised the demons were here because of Duke-- such as Pedro (a very nice replacement for the Rocket), Trot, Manny, Wakefield, and Lowe. I am not sure if Duke signed Damon, and another Duke signee Nomah, unfortunately did not make it to the promised land with us. Finally, Duke was okay in my book when I saw him in St. Louis at game 4 of the World Series on his own dime, not as a guest of the Red Sox. He is above all else a devoted fan of Red Sox Nation, and that supersedes any of his transgressions.

 

One slight point, don't forget Tek.

[a700hitter]

One slight point, don't forget Tek.

A terrible oversight. I knew I was leaving someone out. I should go flog myself. Was Damon a Duke signee?

[HeadOfSoxNation]

I think the thing we all have gotta understand, is that this rivalry just ISN'T AS BIG to the players as it is to us. I've gotta be honest, I'd be far more surprise and disgusted by a Die Hard BoSox fan deciding to jump ship and start rooting for the bombers than I'll ever be when a player on either of the two changes teams. It's just not a big deal to them. Sure, they feed off the rivalry because of what it means to the fans, but as a whole, it's just not as big of a deal to them. Might they get a little more pumped up for a Sox/Yanks game than a Sox/DRays or a Yanks/Jays game? For sure, but they don't eat, sleep, and breathe it like we do.

 

I think you have to look at baseball more from a business standpoint rather than a fan standpoint when it comes to determining whether or not you want Clemens back in Boston. He left Boston while other teams were willing to pay him more and treat him better than Boston was, there have been a couple of pit stops along the way, and now he's thinking of coming back to Beantown. I honestly don't see any kind of problem with that. It's just becaues these guys are ballplayers that we fault them for decisions that any one of us would make if put in the same situation. Put it in layman's terms...you're working for UPS, and they start treating you like s***, saying your past your prime, etc....and then DHL comes up with some huge deal to get you to come and deliver for them, paying you far more than UPS was giving you. Don't you do it? Of course you do. Then, after a couple of years later, FedEx sees what you've done in your career, needs a solid delivery man, and offers you an INTENSE package to come there, making even mooooore then what you were making at DHL. Don't you do it again? Sure thing. But what about the rivalry? What about the intense hatred in the shipping industry (haha)? But they're UPS's biggest competitor! It doesn't matter, they're giving you the better deal, you go for it.

 

I fault Clemens for the whole Piazza thing, and because if it, he's not one of my favorite people. But if last year, and well, the previous what, 20, are any indication, the dude can flat out pitch and I'd love him back in Sox and honestly, would think of it as having a former Beantown Hero back, not a former Bronx Bomber for the first time.

[Sox Fan on Cape]

Not sure about Damon. But I'm pretty sure he was.

[seabeachfred]

Rivernator, being a Yankee fan I guess you cannot see my point. To Red Sox fans willing to forgive and forget, as if that is necessary, Roger coming back to Boston would be coming back home to finish up a great career. He doesn't have to. He has certainly had a fabulous one as is. Being selfish for my Red Sox, however, I can see the effect Roger would have on our team. We would become instant favorites to get to another World Series and from there, well, Red Sox Nation celebrates again. Thanks for the post Yank.

[CrespoBlows]

The facts are that Douquette blew it badly what with his over the hill crap

 

the fact is clement told the world he was moving closer to his family in texas and to a contender

 

instead he took the 8/32M deal and went to a last place team in fukin canada??

you dont need to be a geography major to understand the irony here

 

this is the roger clemens i know.

the guy who will pitch his balls off 5months a year then have his trick hammy act up in game 1 of the world series....

we gave clemens the highest contract in baseball

5/25M and he won 39 games in those 5 years

do the math

 

if the duke signs clemens he dont get pedro the following year

 

ive seen them both pitch their entire careers

clemens couldnt carry peteys jock when they were both healthy

 

i havent seen a bigger fraud in my lifetime than roger clemens

if i need to win a game in april against tampa theres no one i want out there except clem

come october hes useless,completely useless

ask the astros

 

Clemens has a 12-6 record with a 3.66 ERA in October. His World Series record is 3-0 with a 2.37 ERA. If it weren't for his legs, he'd have thrown a better game.

 

If Duke signs Clemens, he still could have traded for Pedro. Whether the team was willing to take on his $7 million dollar contract is another question. Maybe if Duke wasn't such as a dumbass and didn't sign Steve Avery, we probably could have easily grabbed Pedro and Clemens.

[seabeachfred]

Since I wasn't following the Red Sox back in '96 I will accept your take on it since you call Douquette a dumb ass and I do know that for a fact judging from what I have heard from others. 12-6 post season is a damn good record and a 2.37 ERA in the World Series is excellent. That is why I would like to see Roger finish up in Boston. It could put us over the top.

[riverside sluggers]

David Wells has indicated he might consider retiring during the season if there's no improvement to his knees.

 

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/extras/extra_bases/2006/04/harris_in_the_h_1.html

[26 to 6]

A terrible oversight. I knew I was leaving someone out. I should go flog myself. Was Damon a Duke signee?

Yup, I believe so.

[Mr Crunchy]

duquette got tek and derek lowe for heathcliffe slocumb

he signed manny

he traded for petey

he got wake off the waiver wire

he inked damon im pretty sure

he drafted fossum and nomar who were all instruments used in trades to grab up the final parts of the 04 campaign

 

he was an arrogant prick but he knew the game

 

#s lie and if you dont believe me why dont we list roger clemens most memorable october gems and for each 1 you give me i'll give you games where he walked off the mound before the 5th inning a loser.....this isnt to mention game 6 in 86 when he walked off the mound as a 23 year old phenom with a blister or the game in oakland when he came out with the eye black on and got tossed in the 2nd inning or the shellackings he took when he went head to head with petey or the game against oakland when his trick hammy acted up in game 5 and he had to leave the game down a few runs or last years game 1 against chicago when he left after 1 with either

(1) a sore shoulder

(2) the trick hammy

(3) the groin strain

********...HES A FUKIN COWARD AND A FRAUD

 

he shouldve been called mrs dave stewart,he was his personal bitch.

 

clemens was either 39-40 or 40-39 in his 5 year deal for 25,000,000.00

he told the entire world he wanted to pitch for a contender closer to his home in texas

nobody bit,not ny not houston not texas not anaheim

 

only the sox offered him close to the 8mill per toronto offered him

 

nobody bit but the last place team in fukin canada and thats where he went

NOT CLOSER TO TEXAS NOT TO A CONTENDER EITHER

a last place team in canada

 

he went for the money,fine...just say its about the money

 

revisionist history will tell you it was duquettes fault

********

y'all remember the article in the paper every week in the herald??

''THE WORLD ACCORDING TO ROGER""

it was sort of like bushisms,

they'd quote him saying the dumbest s*** possible and put it in the paper every week

 

clemens is the guy you want out there up 7-0 in the 2nd inning with a 3-0 lead in the series

if its close??

keep him home,he'll choke he'll quit,he'll get thrown out if it matters down the stretch

 

ive seen it for the last 20 years

you guys have too if you paid attention

[Mr Crunchy]

thank you guys for letting me vent this out

i hate clemens and i get s*** pains thinking about him fuking up another october for us

[a700hitter]

duquette got tek and derek lowe for heathcliffe slocumb

he signed manny

he traded for petey

he got wake off the waiver wire

he inked damon im pretty sure

he drafted fossum and nomar who were all instruments used in trades to grab up the final parts of the 04 campaign

 

he was an arrogant prick but he knew the game

 

#s lie and if you dont believe me why dont we list roger clemens most memorable october gems and for each 1 you give me i'll give you games where he walked off the mound before the 5th inning a loser.....this isnt to mention game 6 in 86 when he walked off the mound as a 23 year old phenom with a blister or the game in oakland when he came out with the eye black on and got tossed in the 2nd inning or the shellackings he took when he went head to head with petey or the game against oakland when his trick hammy acted up in game 5 and he had to leave the game down a few runs or last years game 1 against chicago when he left after 1 with either

(1) a sore shoulder

(2) the trick hammy

(3) the groin strain

********...HES A FUKIN COWARD AND A FRAUD

 

he shouldve been called mrs dave stewart,he was his personal bitch.

 

clemens was either 39-40 or 40-39 in his 5 year deal for 25,000,000.00

he told the entire world he wanted to pitch for a contender closer to his home in texas

nobody bit,not ny not houston not texas not anaheim

 

only the sox offered him close to the 8mill per toronto offered him

 

nobody bit but the last place team in fukin canada and thats where he went

NOT CLOSER TO TEXAS NOT TO A CONTENDER EITHER

a last place team in canada

 

he went for the money,fine...just say its about the money

 

revisionist history will tell you it was duquettes fault

********

y'all remember the article in the paper every week in the herald??

''THE WORLD ACCORDING TO ROGER""

it was sort of like bushisms,

they'd quote him saying the dumbest s*** possible and put it in the paper every week

 

clemens is the guy you want out there up 7-0 in the 2nd inning with a 3-0 lead in the series

if its close??

keep him home,he'll choke he'll quit,he'll get thrown out if it matters down the stretch

 

ive seen it for the last 20 years

you guys have too if you paid attention

I've been watvhing him from day one, and you are absolutely right. The only time he came up big was game 7 of the 2001 WS. He pitched very well under the pressure. I did n't expect that he would... but we know how that turned out for his team.

[bagwell368]

Duqe was good and bad. He signed Damon a move he was criticized for the first two years of Damons career with the Sox.

 

He fired excellent minor league people because they took credit for their own work.

He let the draft and minors go down the drain

His high handed behavior scared off a few people for sure.

 

As for Clemens, he is by FAR the greatest pitcher of all time in terms of career value. Disagree?? Consider the micro sized strike zone, pencil thin bat handles, rules against piching inside, DH, 'roid beasts, guys trying to hit 40 HR for a big contract, not .335. he has spent his entire career facing. If he could be brought back to 1962 Houston, his ERA would have been .7 or so lower career wise. Starting in 1895, his career ERA would be about .63. Perhaps a handful of guys like Gibson (big mound, beanball/brushback king, huge strike zones) might be better in the post season. But with Clemens, you get into the post season more often then Gibson, don't you, since he's pitched about what 1200 more innings.

 

W

[schillingouttheks]

Mark Teixeira would be our first baseman if Duquette wasn't such an ass. Mark Teixeira. That name ring a bell?

[seabeachfred]

Crunch, I enjoyed reading your vent. Nice going. Hey listen, it is good to get a different view of things. I still think Douquette was bad for the Red Sox overall and he chased a few good players away, but your hatred of Clemens needed to be brought to the surface. I can see that you think he is a 14-carat phony and a choker in big games and give evidence to back it up, but I still think he would be great for the Red Sox. We do need a fifth starter and I think Roger joining Curt and Josh would really give us a "Big Three" to run the tables on the rest of the AL.

[yeszir]

Mark Teixeira would be our first baseman if Duquette wasn't such an ass. Mark Teixeira. That name ring a bell?

I always thought that if I were a Rangers fan and if I posted on a Rangers message board my user name would be EI EI OH! I'm so clever.

[KeepTheFaith1229]

I always thought that if I were a Rangers fan and if I posted on a Rangers message board my user name would be EI EI OH! I'm so clever.

 

...?

 

I don't get it.

[MrKittens]

sign the petition !!!

 

comebackroger.com

[redoctober]

If the Sox had Schilling-Beckett-Clemens as their trio heading into the postseason theres no doubt the Red Sox will win it all. Plus, you'll have Papelbon or Hansen closing out games. Maybe have Declarmen as a set up man. You can never have enough pitching.

[TheKilo]

From DirtDogs:

 

Boston Dirt Dogs has learned that the Red Sox may now be the frontrunner in the Roger Clemens sweepstakes. Clemens reportedly said Wednesday he'd like to put No. 21 on his back and finish his career where he started. The Yankees are supposedly his second choice even though owner George Steinbrenner hasn't yet made Roger an offer; however, Roger expects him to at some point. The Astros may have moved up to Roger's third choice while the Texas Rangers, who made a great presentation, are not generating any real excitement in the Clemens camp. According to MLB.com, Clemens said that physically, his body feels pretty good, and that his arm is "not too far away" after working out with son Koby, an Astros prospect playing at Class A Lexington, for five days recently.

[yeszir]

Am I the only sane one who DOESN'T want Clemens back on this team?

[CrespoBlows]

You may hate Clemens, but don't you agree he would be a huge addition to our rotation?

[yeszir]

You may hate Clemens, but don't you agree he would be a huge addition to our rotation?

I think it's a HUGE risk paying a 40+ year old guy 20+ million dollars for half of a season. It's not worth it, I don't care who you are.

[CrespoBlows]

I think it's a HUGE risk paying a 40+ year old guy 20+ million dollars for half of a season. It's not worth it, I don't care who you are.

 

I doubt Clemens will get 20 million dollars a year, but you got to take risks to turn your team into a contender. While we probably don't need Clemens to send us to the World Series, adding him will make us much, much more formidable.

 

He's not much of an injury risk, seeing as though he's thrown 210 IP the last three years, and he had the whole offseason to get back into shape.

 

I could see why monetary reasons would scare off most clubs, but the Boston Red Sox? I doubt money is one of the problems they worry about. Though, it is possible that the Yankees could throw $25 million at him to come to New York. If he wants higher than $15 million, I'd back off, but anything less than that, you got to pull the trigger.

[redsoxrules]

Am I the only sane one who DOESN'T want Clemens back on this team?

 

nope i dont want him either , to risky and he will never have enough gas down the strech to be good especially in the playoff if we get there

[26 to 6]

If the Sox had Schilling-Beckett-Clemens as their trio heading into the postseason theres no doubt the Red Sox will win it all. Plus, you'll have Papelbon or Hansen closing out games. Maybe have Declarmen as a set up man. You can never have enough pitching.

No doubt theyll win it all? Maybe they make the World Series and end up playing the Mets. Say Pedro beats Shiclling 2-1. Glavine battles Beckett and wins a 5-3 game. Then say Clemens beats Trachsel (or maybe Bannister will step into the 3-spot if he keeps throwing like he has. Then maybe Wakefield holds them to 1 run through 7 innings and the Mets piund Foulke in the 8th, take the lead and win the game. Then do the same thing the next day. Looks like a Met win to me. All of what I said is very possible. So please, dont guarantee anything in baseball. You'll be eating it later.

 

sign the petition !!!

 

comebackroger.com

Are we serious? Sox fans are hilarious

 

Definately have great spirit. First the Keep Manny website, now this. Good luck.

[bagwell368]

who said $20 mil for 1/2 a season?

 

i like 350,000 a start, 150,000 for every quality start, double those numbers in the playoffs, and only require his presence on game day. if they go to maximum game in every series and win the WS in 7, he could easily blow past 20 million. If he falls apart and its over he might only cost 2-3 million. His vanity should induce him to sign such a contract. If he wins a ring with the sox, and he does well or very well who then says he's not the best ever, some guy in a cave that thinks 511 wins (over 100 from 50' from batter) playing soft toss is in any way better?

 

W

[CrespoBlows]

who said $20 mil for 1/2 a season?

 

i like 350,000 a start, 150,000 for every quality start, double those numbers in the playoffs, and only require his presence on game day. if they go to maximum game in every series and win the WS in 7, he could easily blow past 20 million. If he falls apart and its over he might only cost 2-3 million. His vanity should induce him to sign such a contract. If he wins a ring with the sox, and he does well or very well who then says he's not the best ever, some guy in a cave that thinks 511 wins (over 100 from 50' from batter) playing soft toss is in any way better?

 

W

 

Clemens won't sign unless that money is guaranteed.

[The Monster is my Mom]

Am I the only sane one who DOESN'T want Clemens back on this team?

 

I don't want him back either, and I am pretty sure I am sane. Read earlier in this thread, that was my argument.

 

Sign the petition:

 

rotinhellroger.com