Has Gerrit Cole been cheating?

[Fan_since_Boggs]

Wow, this has the potential to be big news. If I'm the manager of the opposing team and facing Cole, I would demand that the umpire check his hands every inning.

 

https://nypost.com/2021/06/06/josh-donaldson-calls-out-gerrit-cole-amid-mlb-cheating-mess/

 

A former MVP is pointing his finger at Gerrit Cole’s supposedly sticky hands.

 

As MLB threatens to crack down on the illegal use of sticky substances by pitchers whose spin rates are up as offensive numbers plummet, Twins slugger Josh Donaldson called out the Yankees ace.

 

“Is it coincidence that Gerrit Cole’s spin rate numbers went down (Thursday) after four minor-leaguers got suspended for 10 games?” Donaldson, the 2015 AL MVP with the Blue Jays, said.

 

MLB last week suspended four minor-leaguers who were caught using foreign substances to doctor baseballs, in what was considered a warning shot that similar punishments could filter up to the majors. Two days after the minor-league suspensions, Cole was knocked around for five runs on five hits in five innings by the Rays — tied for the most runs he’s given up in 12 starts this season. In that start, the spin rate decreased on Cole’s four primary pitches: By 125 RPMs on the four-seam fastball, 78 RPMs on the knock curve, 77 RPMs on the change up and 48 RPMs on the slider, according to Baseball Savant, as highlighted in The Athletic’s report.

[Bellhorn04]

This isn't the first time Cole's number has popped up with the sticky stuff. Just before the season started there was a story about a suspicious-sounding e-mail he sent. Plus Bauer made some accusations about him.

[Bellhorn04]

Donaldson has apparently been tracking spin rate stats for a while.

[Fan_since_Boggs]

It is kind of interesting that the Yankees didn't set up their rotation so that their ace starter would face both the Rays and Red Sox this week. It is almost like the Yankees are trying to limit Cole's national attention exposure right now? If the Yankees scheduled Cole for Sunday night baseball, ESPN would definitely cover this story. Edited June 6, 2021 by Fan_since_Boggs

[dgalehouse]

I think the practice of pitchers putting something on their hands to help their grip on the ball is very widespread. How much it helps with spin rate , I really don't know. It looks like MLB is going to police it more thoroughly. They are obviously hoping for more offense.

[Fan_since_Boggs]

It looks like MLB is going to police it more thoroughly. They are obviously hoping for more offense.

 

I hope they do. The strikeouts and lack of offense are making the game much more boring.

[Bellhorn04]

I'm impressed that Donaldson has been doing homework on this.

[jacksonianmarch]

He should be. I actually think most pitchers "cheat" like this. There has been no punishment, so they've let it slide. Pitchers say it keeps the batters safe and to a degree they are right. But the stuff they're using now gives them a grip far beyond what they need to keep the ball from running up and in.

[notin]

He should be. I actually think most pitchers "cheat" like this. There has been no punishment, so they've let it slide. Pitchers say it keeps the batters safe and to a degree they are right. But the stuff they're using now gives them a grip far beyond what they need to keep the ball from running up and in.

 

They’re supposed to treat the ball with that super secret mud to keep it from slipping...

[jacksonianmarch]

They’re supposed to treat the ball with that super secret mud to keep it from slipping...

 

This is the funny thing here. They're cracking down on the substances because the offense cratered this year due to deadening of the ball. They could just have gone back to the old ball and left things alone.

[Fan_since_Boggs]

It is pretty obvious what Gerrit Cole is doing here--he doesn't want to lie, knowing the truth will come out, and yet he doesn't want to tell the truth either and thus admit he is a cheater.

 

Gerrit Cole dodges ‘sticky’ allegations in painfully awkward moment

https://nypost.com/2021/06/08/gerrit-cole-on-sticky-substance-questions-amid-mlb-cheating/

The Yankees’ ace held by far the least comfortable news conference of his pinstriped term on Tuesday afternoon, as he received a number of questions concerning accusations that his success emanates significantly from doctoring the baseball. Cole tap-danced around several queries and refused to directly answer a question whether he has used Spider Tack, a paste that has become popular among pitchers. “I don’t quite know how to answer that, to be honest,” Cole said during a Zoom news conference.

[dgalehouse]

It's important to get a good grip on the ball. Many pitchers use something. Hitters also use stuff to get a grip on the bat. Bowlers , football players , pool players , etc do likewise. Nobody talked much about spin rate until fairly recently. Most people do want to see more offense in the game. MLB is going to try to increase the offense one way or another. Look for something to happen soon.

[Bellhorn04]

I hope the same thing that allegedly happened to Cole in his last start, per Donaldson, didn't also happen to Martin Perez last night.

[notin]

This is the funny thing here. They're cracking down on the substances because the offense cratered this year due to deadening of the ball. They could just have gone back to the old ball and left things alone.

 

Yes, Manfred is clearly coming across as a clueless moron, which is a few levels below regular moron.

 

So he wants games to take less time, but not have that affect offenses, and certainly not by enforcing pitch clock rules.

 

I think his next rules will be a ban on slower runners taking too long to hustle around the bases. This means you, Salvador Perez!!!

[notin]

I hope the same thing that allegedly happened to Cole in his last start, per Donaldson, didn't also happen to Martin Perez last night.

 

Let’s use a slightly larger sample size...

[mvp 78]

I say juice the baseball and juice the pitchers.

[notin]

I say juice the baseball and juice the pitchers.

 

 

I say ban all fastballs under 95mph. They take too damn long to get to home plate, and it does add up when you have a lot of them...

[Bellhorn04]

I say ban all fastballs under 95mph. They take too damn long to get to home plate, and it does add up when you have a lot of them...

 

Or have a second mound closer to the plate for guys who only throw 90.

[Bellhorn04]

Let’s use a slightly larger sample size...

 

Oh sure, throw water on a perfectly good conspiracy theory...

[notin]

Oh sure, throw water on a perfectly good conspiracy theory...

 

I'm just saying, maybe we need at least three innings before we come to any conclusions. Four would be idea, but at least three... .

[mvp 78]

Bring back the 15" mound and the ball from 2020.

[mvp 78]

Also, reinstate the banned elbow pad that Barry Bonds used to use.

[Bellhorn04]

I'm just saying, maybe we need at least three innings before we come to any conclusions. Four would be idea, but at least three... .

 

I blame Cora for that.

[notin]

I blame Cora for that.

 

Well, he has already been fired for cheating once. So I guess you think he was just covering his tracks..

[bkzwhitestrican]

The MLB is always three steps behind on these issues. How long have they known about pitchers using various substances to improve their grip? It's been a universally known secret that just about every pitcher uses something to this effect. Rather then set rules for what is and what isn't acceptable, they just let it slide. But now that pitchers are dominating and it's making MLB look bad, they're putting the onus on players even though MLB has been allowing them to use these substances with no repercussions for decades. It's basically the same thing that happened with steroids, just look the other way until the issue comes to a head, and then blame the players.

[notin]

Or have a second mound closer to the plate for guys who only throw 90.

 

And a third mound even closer for Rich Hill and Kyle Hendricks and anyone still throwing the knuckle ball...

[dgalehouse]

Nothing is going to help the offense very much unless the hitters get smarter. Ted Williams used to talk about how stupid pitchers were. Today , it is the hitters who are stupid. You can watch a guy chase the same slider in the dirt three times in the same at bat. Then the next guy does likewise. Try swinging at strikes , not balls in the dirt. With two strikes, shorten your swing and try to put the ball in play. Hit to all fields. Learn how to bunt. These are not revelations. They are basics.

[Bellhorn04]

Nothing is going to help the offense very much unless the hitters get smarter. Ted Williams used to talk about how stupid pitchers were. Today , it is the hitters who are stupid. You can watch a guy chase the same slider in the dirt three times in the same at bat. Then the next guy does likewise. Try swinging at strikes , not balls in the dirt. With two strikes, shorten your swing and try to put the ball in play. Hit to all fields. Learn how to bunt. These are not revelations. They are basics.

 

I wouldn't hold my breath on that.

 

From my armchair, I have some sympathy for the hitters. Pitchers throw harder on average than they ever did, and they can make the ball break more than they ever did.

[notin]

I wouldn't hold my breath on that.

 

From my armchair, I have some sympathy for the hitters. Pitchers throw harder on average than they ever did, and they can make the ball break more than they ever did.

 

Exactly. Per Fangraphs, the average fastball is 94.3mph this year, which converts to 138 feet/second. So to travel 55 feet (an estimate from release point to plate) takes less than 0.4 seconds. Not a lot of time to decide to swing. Especially since you have to decide long before it gets to the plate, so maybe 0.2 seconds?

 

And that’s for an average fastball...

[dgalehouse]

Pitchers and hitters have forever been looking for ways to gain an advantage. The bigger question is : Are managers , coaches and organizations encouraging this ? Maybe even providing the material and instructions? That could be where the investigation leads.