06/11 Red Hot Rangers @ The Boston Chokers

[mvp 78]

Right now, there's ample evidence that they aren't a very good team whether JBJ is on the bench or in CF.

[Slasher9]

The Sox pitchers walked 8 hitters and 5 of them scored, but the problem was CF defense?

 

no. the problem was a weakened CF defense, a weakened RF defense, and a weakened LF defense. the BB's also dont help so i will be more than happy to question why Hernandez/Poyner were left in so long by WTF Cora....

[Slasher9]

Stop throwing JBJ into every argument. It's so dumb.

 

If it was Mookie's turn for a "rest" then i would by throwing him into the argument. can we just play 10 games in a row with Beni-JBj-Mook?

just 10. lets see what happens.

[Slasher9]

Right now, there's ample evidence that they aren't a very good team whether JBJ is on the bench or in CF.

 

true. but i obviously believe JBj's defense (+ keeping mook and beni were they belong in the corners) outweighs getting nunez or sam travis' bat into the lineup. sorry if you cannot agree with that.

[a700hitter]

This is the 2nd game in a row that Holt made a really dumb play (inside the park HR, running through stop sign in 9th inning). He's very replaceable.

Holt brings a lot to the team and he did pull a couple of big rocks in the last 2 games, but he is playing hard. Mookie completely half assed it in the OF last night. On Andrus hit, I could see that he left the box thinking double. Betts loafed after the ball and didn’t even rush when he saw Andrus going for 2 after rounding 1st. His throw to second had nothing on it. As for the inside the park HR, Betts never made a move to come over to get the ball. He stood like a statue. Pence could have run around the bases twice. Even if Nett couldn’t get to the ball in time, at least make an effort. If he ran over screaming, Holt might have realized what was going on. Instead, he stood there and Holt was checking to see if he had all his parts and the ball was just sitting there and the only ones showing urgency were the fans in the stands who were screaming. Betts is just a little guy who wants to be paid like the other big flagship aircraft carriers (Trout and Harper). He doesn’t have the tools and ability of either of them. If he wants the big bucks, he can’t half ass it like he has been doing. Holt is not the problem on this team. He hustles. He’s versatile. He can do a lot of things with the bat. And he is cheap. The big money guy Betts has let this team down. Bogey, another big money guy, has looked unengaged too. He has been much better than Betts, but at times he has looked like he was not engaged.

[mvp 78]

no. the problem was a weakened CF defense, a weakened RF defense, and a weakened LF defense. the BB's also dont help so i will be more than happy to question why Hernandez/Poyner were left in so long by WTF Cora....

 

The problem was with how s***** the pitchers pitched last night. It was either walks or meatballs. I'm guessing you didn't actually watch the game.

[mvp 78]

Holt brings a lot to the team and he did pull a couple of big rocks in the last 2 games, but he is playing hard. Mookie completely half assed it in the OF last night. On Andrus hit, I could see that he left the box thinking double. Betts loafed after the ball and didn’t even rush when he saw Andrus going for 2 after rounding 1st. His throw to second had nothing on it. As for the inside the park HR, Betts never made a move to come over to get the ball. He stood like a statue. Pence could have run around the bases twice. Even if Nett couldn’t get to the ball in time, at least make an effort. If he ran over screaming, Holt might have realized what was going on. Instead, he stood there and Holt was checking to see if he had all his parts and the ball was just sitting there and the only ones showing urgency were the fans in the stands who were screaming. Betts is just a little guy who wants to be paid like the other big flagship aircraft carriers (Trout and Harper). He doesn’t have the tools and ability of either of them. If he wants the big bucks, he can’t half ass it like he has been doing. Holt is not the problem on this team. He hustles. He’s versatile. He can do a lot of things with the bat. And he is cheap. The big money guy Betts has let this team down. Bogey, another big money guy, has looked unengaged too. He has been much better than Betts, but at times he has looked like he was not engaged.

 

They definitely didn't show what Betts was doing during the inside the park HR. Unfortunate.

[Maxbialystock]

If it was Mookie's turn for a "rest" then i would by throwing him into the argument. can we just play 10 games in a row with Beni-JBj-Mook?

just 10. lets see what happens.

 

I'm amazed anyone would argue that outfield defense is the key to winning when pitching and hitting are far more important and currently in disarray.

[Slasher9]

Holt brings a lot to the team and he did pull a couple of big rocks in the last 2 games, but he is playing hard. Mookie completely half assed it in the OF last night. On Andrus hit, I could see that he left the box thinking double. Betts loafed after the ball and didn’t even rush when he saw Andrus going for 2 after rounding 1st. His throw to second had nothing on it. As for the inside the park HR, Betts never made a move to come over to get the ball. He stood like a statue. Pence could have run around the bases twice. Even if Nett couldn’t get to the ball in time, at least make an effort. If he ran over screaming, Holt might have realized what was going on. Instead, he stood there and Holt was checking to see if he had all his parts and the ball was just sitting there and the only ones showing urgency were the fans in the stands who were screaming. Betts is just a little guy who wants to be paid like the other big flagship aircraft carriers (Trout and Harper). He doesn’t have the tools and ability of either of them. If he wants the big bucks, he can’t half ass it like he has been doing. Holt is not the problem on this team. He hustles. He’s versatile. He can do a lot of things with the bat. And he is cheap. The big money guy Betts has let this team down. Bogey, another big money guy, has looked unengaged too. He has been much better than Betts, but at times he has looked like he was not engaged.

 

good stuff. i was wondering where the CFer was during all that. must have been a pretty frustrating game to be at....

[mvp 78]

good stuff. i was wondering where the CFer was during all that. must have been a pretty frustrating game to be at....

 

I would have wondered if there was some sort of airborne toxic event that was causing hallucinations.

[Slasher9]

I'm amazed anyone would argue that outfield defense is the key to winning when pitching and hitting are far more important and currently in disarray.

 

i'm looking for consistency Maxbialystock. like i believe many of us are looking for.

maybe our manager can start with having a consistent lineup and consistent defense for a 10 game stretch and see if that consistency can translate over to hitting, pitching, defense. try not to be so amazed....

[Slasher9]

I would have wondered if there was some sort of airborne toxic event that was causing hallucinations.

 

the amount of BB alone would be annoying. although watching a couple managers get tossed is always kind of fun.

i am disheartened by the fact that we can not win a game after our beloved Papi gets shoosted. i am thinking zero heart on this current ballclub....

[notin]

They definitely didn't show what Betts was doing during the inside the park HR. Unfortunate.

 

He was absolutely standing still while Holt charged, but that’s not surprising on a ball hit down the RF line. By the time the ball rolled past Holt to the wall, Pence was already around 2b. Even if Mookie went full tilt and ran the 150 feet or so to get the ball and throw it in, he wasn’t going to get the ball back in time for any play on Pence...

[a700hitter]

They definitely didn't show what Betts was doing during the inside the park HR. Unfortunate.

I saw it. He did nothing. On the radio, I think Merloni mentioned how Betts didn’t move on that ball. I can’t be sure if I heard it on the radio or on the TV post game, but Betts acted like he was waiting for a bus.

 

What would have been the ruling if the fan had reached over and grabbed the ball? I think it would be up to the umpire’s discretion to let the HR stand. I think I would have grabbed the ball and let security escort me out. At least , I would have made an effort on the ball.

[Slasher9]

At least , I would have made an effort on the ball.

 

somewhere in a secret location for witness protection....Steve Bartman is smiling.

[a700hitter]

He was absolutely standing still while Holt charged, but that’s not surprising on a ball hit down the RF line. By the time the ball rolled past Holt to the wall, Pence was already around 2b. Even if Mookie went full tilt and ran the 150 feet or so to get the ball and throw it in, he wasn’t going to get the ball back in time for any play on Pence...

Sorry, but you have to make an effort. If for nothing else than to alert Holt to where the ball is. Let’s not make excuses for lack of hustle. The ballpark was in disbelief that no one made an attempt on the ball or to alert Holt. The whole team just stood there. It would not have been a long run from 2nd base to get Holt’s attention if Marco started to run out there.

[notin]

I saw it. He did nothing. On the radio, I think Merloni mentioned how Betts didn’t move on that ball. I can’t be sure if I heard it on the radio or on the TV post game, but Betts acted like he was waiting for a bus.

 

What would have been the ruling if the fan had reached over and grabbed the ball? I think it would be up to the umpire’s discretion to let the HR stand. I think I would have grabbed the ball and let security escort me out. At least , I would have made an effort on the ball.

 

Even in Little League, you try to teach kids they should be moving on every play, either to the ball or to a position to back someone up. They don’t, of course, because they’re kids. But you do try to instill it in them...

[Maxbialystock]

Guys, it was a freak play--diabolically so. First of all, it was lazy opposite field pop fly in Pesky's corner where the outcome is almost always a great grab or a dinger. it did not help that Holt rarely plays RF. I frankly thought the ball had gone in the stands and somehow caromed back onto the field. But the most freakish thing is that the ball rolled into the almost perfect spot--closer to Holt than anyone else, but Holt couldn't see it-- to enable the hitter to get all the way around the bases regardless of what Holt or Betts or anyone else did. The baserunner on 2b was going to score no matter what, and the hitter was guaranteed 3 bases even if Holt reacted perfectly. The next guy up singled. So the Rangers were sure of 9 runs.

 

Might I add that both Holt and Betts are normally, usually in the charlie hustle mode when they are in the field and that Mookie is a gold glover?

 

The problem last night wasn't that dinger or a less than optimum outfield defense. It was the Sox pitching and hitting, have looked good only intermittently since the Sox were 4 games over .500 on May 27.

[Slasher9]

But you do try to instill it in them...

 

If by "instill" you mean "yell at", "threaten", "bench" then yes - i do this with my 13U's....

[moonslav59]

i really think sitting JBj cost this game. there was a play or 2 to RF that mookie probably makes (see: holt taking a nap on the wall)...and a couple plays in CF that i think JBj has a good chance to make (a catch, holding andrus to a single or gunning him, throwing the guy out at home).

WTF Cora

 

I mentioned this earlier.

 

When you have 3-4 key guys out (JD, Moreland/Pearce & Eovaldi, you don't sit players for resting. You ask others to pick up the slack in hopes you can get them rest when players are healthy. We've been resting our hottest hitters almost every game, and sometimes two at a time.

 

It's not just the loss of JBJ and Betts' defense that contributed to this loss, it was resting our hottest hitter since May 20th in JBJ.

 

 

 

[mvp 78]

I mentioned this earlier.

 

When you have 3-4 key guys out (JD, Moreland/Pearce & Eovaldi, you don't sit players for resting. You ask others to pick up the slack in hopes you can get them rest when players are healthy. We've been resting our hottest hitters almost every game, and sometimes two at a time.

 

It's not just the loss of JBJ and Betts' defense that contributed to this loss, it was resting our hottest hitter since May 20th in JBJ.

 

 

 

 

Pearce isn't a main guy. Eovaldi isn't a batter. JD was in the starting lineup last night. Your complaint boils down to: if Moreland is out, nobody can have an off day. What a s*** ass argument.

[vegasbob]

Are we at the point where any time a team makes a move that doesn’t work out immediately or someone disagrees with, they blame the sabermetric crowd? As if no team ever made a questionable or unsuccessful move before sabermetrics came along?

 

Selling Babe Ruth comes to mind. He predated Bill James

[vegasbob]

I mentioned this earlier.

 

When you have 3-4 key guys out (JD, Moreland/Pearce & Eovaldi, you don't sit players for resting. You ask others to pick up the slack in hopes you can get them rest when players are healthy. We've been resting our hottest hitters almost every game, and sometimes two at a time.

 

It's not just the loss of JBJ and Betts' defense that contributed to this loss, it was resting our hottest hitter since May 20th in JBJ.

 

 

 

 

Moon, you just may have hit on a major revelation. When JBJr is your "hottest" hitter since May 20 , you have discovered the key to why your 119 win team of 8 months ago is at .500 and sinking.

[mvp 78]

Xander and JD are almost as "hot" over the same time period and I don't see you yammering on about them over and over.

[mvp 78]

It's not that JBJ haters are in abundance, it's that JBJ stans are just straight crazy. All sense of reality is gone.

[vegasbob]

no. the problem was a weakened CF defense, a weakened RF defense, and a weakened LF defense. the BB's also dont help so i will be more than happy to question why Hernandez/Poyner were left in so long by WTF Cora....

 

I do think this is becoming a question. How did Poyner wind up going an ineffective 3 innings? The game was still winnable after Poyner gave up a run in his first. AC seems to continue managing his rest cycle and his poor bullpen arms for tomorrow's game. Reminds me of the golf course sign, along the 18th fairway. Free Beer Tomorrow

[vegasbob]

MVP, here's an alternate to JBJr bashing. I am personally so tired of hearing the GG MVP (no offense to you) name of Mookie Betts that I have blocked him on this site and all social media. Can't wait for the cryimng towels when this fine young fellow goes to greener pastures after 2020.

[moonslav59]

Pearce isn't a main guy. Eovaldi isn't a batter. JD was in the starting lineup last night. Your complaint boils down to: if Moreland is out, nobody can have an off day. What a s*** ass argument.

 

My point goes beyond last night, when JD was out hurt.

 

Yes, Eovaldi is not a hitter, but when a key pitcher is out, you hope your hitters pick up the slack and are not on the bench resting game after game.

 

I counted Moreland and Pearce as one "key guy out" since they platoon.

 

Cora has been resting our best players left and right at a time where he should be asking them to suick it up and pick up the slack with hope the resting can come later.

[dgalehouse]

I mentioned this earlier.

 

When you have 3-4 key guys out (JD, Moreland/Pearce & Eovaldi, you don't sit players for resting. You ask others to pick up the slack in hopes you can get them rest when players are healthy. We've been resting our hottest hitters almost every game, and sometimes two at a time.

 

It's not just the loss of JBJ and Betts' defense that contributed to this loss, it was resting our hottest hitter since May 20th in JBJ.

 

 

 

. You are certainly JBJ's top hype man . Boras should give you a cut of his commission.

[moonslav59]

Xander and JD are almost as "hot" over the same time period and I don't see you yammering on about them over and over.

 

I did and will when they "rested" them.

 

I'll stop mentioning JBJ's hot streak when posters stop saying he's "plummeting" or should be traded or benched now.

 

It's one thing to bash the guy when his OPS is .445. He deserved it. It's another thing to bash him when he's one of our 3 hottest hitters for over 3 weeks.

 

We need to stop resting guys for a while, unless they are showing signs of fatigue. I'm fine with the extra rest idea, so players can be fresh when we need them, but we need them RIGHT NOW!