Blake Swihart

[moonslav59]

Oh Dombrowski definitely likes something abou Swihart. He’s been trying to force Blake into the lineup for a few years now...

 

I disagree.

 

When Swihart played LF for us, it was only because a deal for Beltran fell apart at the last minute.

 

I think he has only kept him around as insurance and because he seems to have some upside potential only briefly seen several years ago.

 

He may have also been trying to drive his trade value up, but for this long? That argument is light.

 

I think Swihart gets traded or DFA'd at the last minute, in hopes nobody claims him. (My guess is he would be claimed. Look at some of the catchers still being recycled!)

 

[notin]

If the Sox wait until late in spring training to DFA Swihart and he does get claimed, it’s actually likely the claiming team will DFA him and try to sneak him through waivers. If so, the Sox can claim him back

[notin]

I disagree.

 

When Swihart played LF for us, it was only because a deal for Beltran fell apart at the last minute.

 

 

But the Sox still had Bryce Brentz, Rusney Castillo, and even former MLB outfielders Brennan Boesch and Justin Maxwell that could have been called up instead. All of them were struggling with sub -.700 OPS’s in AAA, but the others all had outfield experience at the time...

[moonslav59]

But the Sox still had Bryce Brentz, Rusney Castillo, and even former MLB outfielders Brennan Boesch and Justin Maxwell that could have been called up instead. All of them were struggling with sub -.700 OPS’s in AAA, but the others all had outfield experience at the time...

 

Castillo was not part of the choices. The tax hit disqualifies him.

 

Brentz has shown he's not ML talent.

 

Swihart's ability to be the 3rd string catcher is the only thing that has kept him barely alive. Vaz and Leon have both been hurt, as catchers often are, so keeping a hopeful and athletic guy as our 25th man is not all that strange.

 

If Swihart had options left, we wouldn't even be talking about him.

 

Lin, Brentz and others had and still have options.

[Bellhorn04]

IMHO Leon has a body type that is subject to breaking down. While any player can get injured its less likely to happen to a younger player who is in decent physical shape. The demands of catching could wear Leon down...maybe this year...maybe next. But a guy in his physical condition is an injury waiting to happen...IMO. I would trade him while his trade value as a good defensive catcher is perhaps at a high point and keep Vas and Swi.

 

Doesn't that seem odd to say about the one catcher the Soxhave who hasn't missed any significant time with injury? Leon was the team leader is games caught last year and in the past 3 years...

 

It would seem more accurate to say that the more Leon plays the more tired his bat gets.

[notin]

Castillo was not part of the choices. The tax hit disqualifies him.

 

Brentz has shown he's not ML talent.

 

Swihart's ability to be the 3rd string catcher is the only thing that has kept him barely alive. Vaz and Leon have both been hurt, as catchers often are, so keeping a hopeful and athletic guy as our 25th man is not all that strange.

 

If Swihart had options left, we wouldn't even be talking about him.

 

Lin, Brentz and others had and still have options.

 

Well if you’re talking about 2016 when Dombrowski started to evince his live for Swihart

 

1) The tax hit for Castillo was not a problem in 2016.

 

2) While I agree Brentz is not MLB talent, Dombrowski keeps bringing this guy back. Last off-season, it seems as though many did disagree with me when Brentz was slated to be the fourth outfielder and I said this was not a good idea.

 

3) Swihart was the starting LF for every game from May20 to June 4 when he injured himself colliding with a wall. This wasn’t him being the versatile 25th man....

[Larry Cook]

We could get swihart more playing time by trading Vazquez, hernandez dalbec and chavis to Texas for Lequerc.

 

Positives: Solves our closer hole and opens up playing time for swihart.

 

Negatives: our starting pitchers will be depressed!

[cp176]

Castillo was not part of the choices. The tax hit disqualifies him.

 

Brentz has shown he's not ML talent.

 

Swihart's ability to be the 3rd string catcher is the only thing that has kept him barely alive. Vaz and Leon have both been hurt, as catchers often are, so keeping a hopeful and athletic guy as our 25th man is not all that strange.

 

If Swihart had options left, we wouldn't even be talking about him.

 

Lin, Brentz and others had and still have options.

 

Using an expression like the third string catcher seems to indicate a lack of ability and a great distance between the two guys that are ahead of him. Vazqueth and Leon are both decent catchers. Neither is anything special at all. if they were DD would not be listening to offers - if anyone is actually interested in either one - for them both. They would be very good backup catchers but most teams can duplicate their skills for less money. As a team, we are good enough to make them tolerable.

[harmony]

If the Sox wait until late in spring training to DFA Swihart and he does get claimed, it’s actually likely the claiming team will DFA him and try to sneak him through waivers. If so, the Sox can claim him back

In that scenario Blake Swihart would still be out of options. Swihart could be optioned to the minors only if he goes unclaimed on waivers.

[notin]

In that scenario Blake Swihart would still be out of options. Swihart could be optioned to the minors only if he goes unclaimed on waivers.

 

Yes.

 

He could be one of those Sandy Rosario types everyone wants in the organization but no one wants on the 40 man roster, meaning a long stream of DFAs and claims...

[moonslav59]

Well if you’re talking about 2016 when Dombrowski started to evince his live for Swihart

 

1) The tax hit for Castillo was not a problem in 2016.

 

2) While I agree Brentz is not MLB talent, Dombrowski keeps bringing this guy back. Last off-season, it seems as though many did disagree with me when Brentz was slated to be the fourth outfielder and I said this was not a good idea.

 

3) Swihart was the starting LF for every game from May20 to June 4 when he injured himself colliding with a wall. This wasn’t him being the versatile 25th man....

 

Yes, it was a Taz issue in 2016. Once added to the roster, his contract could not be removed for the remainder of his deal. It's not like choices are made in isolation. DD had his mind on 2017 and beyond in 2016.

 

Brentz is a capable AAA insurance, as is Swihart, but Swi is out of options, so he sticks around. I don't think there's anything more to it than that.

 

If Swihart had options, Lin would be #25.

[moonslav59]

Using an expression like the third string catcher seems to indicate a lack of ability and a great distance between the two guys that are ahead of him. Vazqueth and Leon are both decent catchers. Neither is anything special at all. if they were DD would not be listening to offers - if anyone is actually interested in either one - for them both. They would be very good backup catchers but most teams can duplicate their skills for less money. As a team, we are good enough to make them tolerable.

 

I do see a vast difference between Vaz/Leon and Swi on defense and pitcher handling.

 

Swi has more upside on O than Leon and maybe Vaz.

 

I know we disagree, which is fine, but I see an overall wider gap than you and others do.

 

Again, I won't be crushed if they trade Vaz or Leon, but I think our staff will suffer, at least for the time it takes them to build comfort with Swi, otherwise, we'll be over-working Leon or Vaz.

[cp176]

I do see a vast difference between Vaz/Leon and Swi on defense and pitcher handling.

 

Swi has more upside on O than Leon and maybe Vaz.

 

I know we disagree, which is fine, but I see an overall wider gap than you and others do.

 

Again, I won't be crushed if they trade Vaz or Leon, but I think our staff will suffer, at least for the time it takes them to build comfort with Swi, otherwise, we'll be over-working Leon or Vaz.

 

We do disagree to a certain extent. Based on what you have written it sounds as though Swihart in your opinion has no value. I don't agree. I do agree that we have a serviceable catching duo in Vaz and Sandy. We can get by.

If someone else was brought in, there might be a minor adjustment period but that is all I think it would be. I do not think that our current #1 and #2 catchers are as directly responsible for the success of our pitching staff as you do. We both know that it isn't a bad thing to disagree form time to time. This is a good discussion in which two people can communicate in a non-nasty way even if they don't agree.

[bosoxmal]

None of the above. Swihart and Holt make one helluva bench all by themselves!

[S5Dewey]

None of the above. Swihart and Holt make one helluva bench all by themselves!

 

I wish I'd said that! There's enough flexibility there between the two of them to fill any spot except pitcher. Add a #4/#5 outfielder and we could be set to go.

[FredLynn]

Just out of curiosity, what happens if we trade one of our catchers and then one gets hurt. Who do we have in the minor leagues that could fill in, if anyone? I don't really keep track of the minors as much as some of you do.

[notin]

Just out of curiosity, what happens if we trade one of our catchers and then one gets hurt. Who do we have in the minor leagues that could fill in, if anyone? I don't really keep track of the minors as much as some of you do.

 

 

Juan Centeno, Oscar Hernandez and Austin Rei...

[moonslav59]

We do disagree to a certain extent. Based on what you have written it sounds as though Swihart in your opinion has no value. I don't agree. I do agree that we have a serviceable catching duo in Vaz and Sandy. We can get by.

If someone else was brought in, there might be a minor adjustment period but that is all I think it would be. I do not think that our current #1 and #2 catchers are as directly responsible for the success of our pitching staff as you do. We both know that it isn't a bad thing to disagree form time to time. This is a good discussion in which two people can communicate in a non-nasty way even if they don't agree.

 

I do think Swihart has value, and I'm fine with him as our 25th man. It's nice having a guy that can catch when we may want to PH for our catchers once or twice a game. He can play other positions and seems athletic, which mean he may improve.

 

The only reason I'm saying trade him is because DD said they are not going with 3 catchers.

 

I think we can get a decent minor leaguer for him or trade him with someone else for a slight upgrade.

 

I have not written him off as a catcher, but our window may close after 2019, and I don't want to mess with the good thing we have going with our staff. Keeping him around for 2020 might be the best reason for keeping him. We may be able to afford a learning curve with him then.

 

[moonslav59]

Juan Centeno, Oscar Hernandez and Austin Rei...

 

I guess the real question is what is the differential between Swihart and Centeno? Is the drop off worth having Lin on the 25 over Swihart?

[notin]

I guess the real question is what is the differential between Swihart and Centeno? Is the drop off worth having Lin on the 25 over Swihart?

 

 

Unless there is an injury, there isn’t room for either of them...

[moonslav59]

Unless there is an injury, there isn’t room for either of them...

 

True, but with Pedey & Nunez hobbled, we likely will see someone on the DL on opening day.

 

Since Swihart is out of options, my guess is he goes, barring injury, but I'd be fine with doing what we did last year, if someone is on the DL.

[harmony]

I guess the real question is what is the differential between Swihart and Centeno? Is the drop off worth having Lin on the 25 over Swihart?

Here are Steamer600 projections for Red Sox catchers:

 

https://www.fangraphs.com/projections.aspx?pos=c&stats=bat&type=steamer600&team=3&lg=all&players=0&sort=27,d

 

Blake Swihart fares better in a ZiPS comparison despite a negative WAR projection:

 

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/2019-zips-projections-boston-red-sox/

Edited February 18, 2019 by harmony

[dgalehouse]

Assuming you go with twelve pitchers , you can only have a four man bench . Having two first basemen is a luxury , but a luxury that puts the squeeze on your roster .

[moonslav59]

Assuming you go with twelve pitchers , you can only have a four man bench . Having two first basemen is a luxury , but a luxury that puts the squeeze on your roster .

 

Yes. Both can play LF in a pinch, but that doesn't add any flexibility.

 

Nunez and Holt as the other 2 fill every need, and if Pedey starts on the DL, there's room for Swi or Lin.

[notin]

Yes. Both can play LF in a pinch, but that doesn't add any flexibility.

 

Nunez and Holt as the other 2 fill every need, and if Pedey starts on the DL, there's room for Swi or Lin.

 

1) You really don’t want to see either Moreland or Pearce in the outfield if you value defense.

 

2) For as flexible as this bench is, the Sox really do lack anyone to backup SS or the OF with any degree of defensive skill...

[moonslav59]

1) You really don’t want to see either Moreland or Pearce in the outfield if you value defense.

 

2) For as flexible as this bench is, the Sox really do lack anyone to backup SS or the OF with any degree of defensive skill...

 

We have stop gap guys, and if Bogey goes on the DL, we have Lin.

 

Holt is okay in the OF.

 

JD wants to play OF, but I'd prefer he never play there, if possible.

[moonslav59]

The thing is, if we trade or DFA a catcher, we won't add an OF'er anyway.

[Nick]

Swihart is under team control for 4 years. Sandy only two years. Swihart is set to earn $910K and Sandy $2.475M in 2019.

 

How did we get to this point? Who in our organization thought Swihart can catch in the majors? Has he been given amply opportunity to showcase his talent? Why not? I know he got hurt playing left field. Did he simply under-performed as a defensive catcher? Why was his lack of defensive skills not diagnosed earlier and addressed? ?Does he just suck as a defensive catcher?

 

Answer me this.

 

Is Vazquez closer in 'makeup' as a catcher to Sandy than Swihart? Which combo gives you the biggest upside looking ahead? Sandy/Vazquez vs Sandy/Swihart vs Vazques/Swihart?

 

Vazquez has a guranteed contract. Other two doesn't.

[moonslav59]

Swihart is under team control for 4 years. Sandy only two years. Swihart is set to earn $910K and Sandy $2.475M in 2019.

 

How did we get to this point? Who in our organization thought Swihart can catch in the majors? Has he been given amply opportunity to showcase his talent? Why not? I know he got hurt playing left field. Did he simply under-performed as a defensive catcher? Why was his lack of defensive skills not diagnosed earlier and addressed? ?Does he just suck as a defensive catcher?

 

Answer me this.

 

Is Vazquez closer in 'makeup' as a catcher to Sandy than Swihart? Which combo gives you the biggest upside looking ahead? Sandy/Vazquez vs Sandy/Swihart vs Vazques/Swihart?

 

Vazquez has a guranteed contract. Other two doesn't.

 

I don't think they trust Swihart to catch more than a few games here or there.

 

His 4 years of control may be the only thing keeping him around, as the window closes soon, and we may want to shed some catcher salary. We will also be more inclined to let Swihart get another chance to catch, if we aren't in serious playoff competition in 2020 or 2021.

[Kimmi]

Swihart is under team control for 4 years. Sandy only two years. Swihart is set to earn $910K and Sandy $2.475M in 2019.

 

How did we get to this point? Who in our organization thought Swihart can catch in the majors? Has he been given amply opportunity to showcase his talent? Why not? I know he got hurt playing left field. Did he simply under-performed as a defensive catcher? Why was his lack of defensive skills not diagnosed earlier and addressed? ?Does he just suck as a defensive catcher?

 

Answer me this.

 

Is Vazquez closer in 'makeup' as a catcher to Sandy than Swihart? Which combo gives you the biggest upside looking ahead? Sandy/Vazquez vs Sandy/Swihart vs Vazques/Swihart?

 

Vazquez has a guranteed contract. Other two doesn't.

 

IMO, the Sox really screwed the pooch with Swihart's development. He at one time had such a high ceiling.

 

Personally, I am not opposed to keeping him on the team, along with Vaz and Leon. I realize that our current roster doesn't really allow for that unless there's an injury. The other problem seems to be that Cora is reluctant to give him much playing time.