Swihart To Undergo Ankle Surgery

[southpaw777]

Swihart has plenty of value right now. Not enough to be a centerpiece for an Ace, but still good value. By saying he needs to increase his value is not saying he deosnt have any value or that his value is low... He just doesnt have enough now to be that centerpiece. Maybe after a great half season in AAA behind the dish as well as a solid bat that value could be closer to being that centerpiece...

Depending on how his development goes and how Vaz and Leon do will depend on if hes here by the seasons end. Its another wait and see type thing for now.

[moonslav59]

Even at the peak of his value, assuming as some do here that his value has fallen, Swihart was never going to be the centerpiece of a package for an ace.

 

I don't think his value has fallen much at all, if any. GMs do not change their ratings that quickly based on a week of play in a season.

 

I think Swihart still has very high value- not "centerpiece" high, but enough to make a solid addition to (JBJ, Moncada or Devers, who would be the centerpiece in a deal for an ace. Add Pomeranz or as a last resort ERod or Kopech and the package would rival any offer other teams would make for Sale or Quintana (plus Robertson and/or Frazier?).

 

Swihart rates to be a top third hitting catcher right away with upside potential to be top 5 pretty soon.

 

He has a good arm and excellent pop times. That may help offset some of his other defensive deficiencies, but lets not forget that many catchers take years and years to develop into fine defensive catchers. VTek was not recognized as a top defender until he was past 32 years old. He led the league in WP +PB at ages 27 and 28 (1999 & 2000). He also only had one season over .730 by age 28.

 

I think GMs see upside value in Swihart, and with the state of catching in MLB at a very low point, many GMs would love to add Swihart's value to their current catcher corps.

[oldtimer]

Even at the peak of his value, assuming as some do here that his value has fallen, Swihart was never going to be the centerpiece of a package for an ace.

 

I don't think his value has fallen much at all, if any. GMs do not change their ratings that quickly based on a week of play in a season.

 

I think Swihart still has very high value- not "centerpiece" high, but enough to make a solid addition to (JBJ, Moncada or Devers, who would be the centerpiece in a deal for an ace. Add Pomeranz or as a last resort ERod or Kopech and the package would rival any offer other teams would make for Sale or Quintana (plus Robertson and/or Frazier?).

 

Swihart rates to be a top third hitting catcher right away with upside potential to be top 5 pretty soon.

 

He has a good arm and excellent pop times. That may help offset some of his other defensive deficiencies, but lets not forget that many catchers take years and years to develop into fine defensive catchers. VTek was not recognized as a top defender until he was past 32 years old. He led the league in WP +PB at ages 27 and 28 (1999 & 2000). He also only had one season over .730 by age 28.

 

I think GMs see upside value in Swihart, and with the state of catching in MLB at a very low point, many GMs would love to add Swihart's value to their current catcher corps.

 

 

I wouldn't trade for Sale or Frazier but would think Robertson would be a nice addition. Right now the Yankees and Mets are also interested in him so it might be a hard get.

[moonslav59]

I wouldn't trade for Sale or Frazier but would think Robertson would be a nice addition. Right now the Yankees and Mets are also interested in him so it might be a hard get.

 

How about Barnes, T Shaw, S Travis and 2 of Owens, Johnson & Hembree for Robertson and Frazier?

[harmony]

How about Barnes, T Shaw, S Travis and 2 of Owens, Johnson & Hembree for Robertson and Frazier?

I suspect the White Sox would prefer quality over quantity (and could get a higher-quality offer for Todd Frazier and David Robertson).

 

Think of the return commanded last offseason by Craig Kimbrel, who was coming off a 1.5 fWAR season with two years and $25 million (or three years and $37 million) remaining on his contract.

 

David Robertson is coming off a 1.0 fWAR season with two years and $25 million remaining on his contract.

 

Steamer projects Robertson with a 2017 WAR of 1.2, the same WAR posted this year by Kimbrel.

 

The market for top-tier relievers has not tanked in the past year and the inclusion of Todd Frazier pushes the price up further.

Edited November 26, 2016 by harmony

[moonslav59]

Your Mariners really made a splash trade!

[moonslav59]

I suspect the White Sox would prefer quality over quantity (and could get a higher-quality offer for Todd Frazier and David Robertson).

 

Think of the return commanded last offseason by Craig Kimbrel, who was coming off a 1.5 fWAR season with two years and $25 million (or three years and $37 million) remaining on his contract.

 

David Robertson is coming off a 1.0 fWAR season with two years and $25 million remaining on his contract.

 

Steamer projects Robertson with a 2017 WAR of 1.2, the same WAR posted this year by Kimbrel.

 

The market for top-tier relievers has not tanked in the past year and the inclusion of Todd Frazier pushes the price up further.

 

Well, if it's all about WAR, then the CWS would take Leon (2.5 WAR) and T Shaw (1.5 WAR) for Robertson (1.0 WAR) & Frazier (2.4 WAR). I'll throw in Hembree and Owens.

[Bellhorn04]

Well, if it's all about WAR, then the CWS would take Leon (2.5 WAR) and T Shaw (1.5 WAR) for Robertson (1.0 WAR) & Frazier (2.4 WAR). I'll throw in Hembree and Owens.

 

One area where pure WAR doesn't mean that much is with relievers.

[harmony]

Projected WAR might be more appropriate in calculating trade value.

[harmony]

My initial reaction to the Seattle-Arizona trade was negative because, like many fans, I highly value my team's current players.

 

But, like many fans, I have accepted the trade and hope for the best. The key for the Mariners may be the development of outfielder Mitch Haniger, whose profile reminds me of Jason Bay at a similar age.

Edited November 26, 2016 by harmony

[Bellhorn04]

Projected WAR might be more appropriate in calculating trade value.

 

Even projected WAR doesn't always mean much with relievers. For a reliever, a WAR over 2 is exceptional.

[moonslav59]

Projected WAR might be more appropriate in calculating trade value.

 

You seem to use whichever suits your argument.

[moonslav59]

My initial reaction to the Seattle-Arizona trade was negative because, like many fans, I highly value my team's current players.

 

But, like many fans, I have accepted the trade and hope for the best. The key for the Mariners may be the development of outfielder Mitch Hanigan, whose profile reminds me of Jason Bay at a similar age.

 

I'm no expert on other teams' prospects, but I was scratching head thinking of you when I read about trading Walker.

[raider_35_24]

Blake Swihart - OF - Red Sox

Marc Topkin of the Tampa Bay Times mentioned Blake Swihart as a possible trade target for the Rays.

The Rays were known to be interested in Jason Castro before he signed a three-year, $24.5 million deal with Minnesota earlier this month. With Castro off the market, the Rays are likely to explore trade options at catcher. One possibility is Swihart, who could be expendable now that Sandy Leon has emerged as Boston's everyday catcher. Swihart was playing left field when he hurt his ankle last season, though the Red Sox claim he'll enter spring training as a catcher.

Related: Rays

[Spudboy]

The only thing the Rays have that the Sox should want is starting pitching.

[moonslav59]

The only thing the Rays have that the Sox should want is starting pitching.

 

No love for Sox killer Longoria?

[Kimmi]

No love for Sox killer Longoria?

 

Longoria immediately came to my mind as well. The only question with obtaining him would be what to do with Moncada.

 

I would hate to trade him at this point.

[notin]

No love for Sox killer Longoria?

 

Even if the Sox focus on SP, the initial comment was about the Rays' potential interest in Swihart. As the Rays are unlikely to give up Longoria for Swihart, what would a more realistic offer from Tampa look like?

 

I'd take Drew Smyly (who was drafted by Dombrowski), but would Tampa go thst high? Or limit the offering to minor leaguers not named Blake Snell?

[notin]

Even if the Sox focus on SP, the initial comment was about the Rays' potential interest in Swihart. As the Rays are unlikely to give up Longoria for Swihart, what would a more realistic offer from Tampa look like?

 

I'd take Drew Smyly (who was drafted by Dombrowski), but would Tampa go thst high? Or limit the offering to minor leaguers not named Blake Snell?

 

Although if the Sox did get an MLB-ready pitching prospect (plus?) with an option left, basically someone who can push Henry Owens a little farther back on the depth chart when injuries start becoming a factor, that would certainly fill a need for Boston

[Dojji]

Longoria immediately came to my mind as well. The only question with obtaining him would be what to do with Moncada.

 

I would hate to trade him at this point.

if a real chance to grab Longoria is on the table Moncada is not even a factor. There are a ton of different ways to get Moncada into the lineup once he is ready which he clearly is not yet

Edited November 27, 2016 by Dojji

[moonslav59]

if a real chance to grab Longoria is on the table Moncada is not even a factor. There are a ton of different ways to get Moncada into the lineup once he is ready which he clearly is not yet

 

My guess is, if we got Longoria, Moncada would be part of the deal along with Swihart. To expand the deal to get a good starter, we'd be talking a blockbuster package.

[Spudboy]

No love for Sox killer Longoria?

 

I just assumed that he would not be available.

[moonslav59]

I just assumed that he would not be available.

 

Teams rarely trade away players right before their recently signed extension takes affect.

 

Many feel the Rays won't trade int he division either.

 

I think we'd have to blow the Rays away to get Longoria and a pitcher, especially if it's Archer.

 

That being said, Longoria will make $13M next year. That's a great deal, but it's still a lot for the Rays. It's 20% of their projected 2017 budget.

 

They need help at a lot of positions, so a massive quantity for quality type trade might make some sense for the Rays, especially when everyone they get would have 4-6+ years of team control. Players like Moncada or Devers, Ockimey, Shaw or Travis, Basabe, Dubon or Chatham and guys like Owens, Johnson, Barnes, Hembree, Scott. To get Archer added to the deal, we'd have to include Kopech and/or Groome plus others.

 

 

[southpaw777]

Teams rarely trade away players right before their recently signed extension takes affect.

 

Many feel the Rays won't trade int he division either.

 

I think we'd have to blow the Rays away to get Longoria and a pitcher, especially if it's Archer.

 

That being said, Longoria will make $13M next year. That's a great deal, but it's still a lot for the Rays. It's 20% of their projected 2017 budget.

 

They need help at a lot of positions, so a massive quantity for quality type trade might make some sense for the Rays, especially when everyone they get would have 4-6+ years of team control. Players like Moncada or Devers, Ockimey, Shaw or Travis, Basabe, Dubon or Chatham and guys like Owens, Johnson, Barnes, Hembree, Scott. To get Archer added to the deal, we'd have to include Kopech and/or Groome plus others.

 

 

 

The Rays dont get Groome or Kopech right now. They are our only two pitchers that really still have a good chance of being better than good MLB pitchers...

I think we could get him without letting those two go. We have plenty of prospects and I agree with trying the quantity route. There would obviously be one big centerpiece, but the rest can be a lot of prospect potential and control.