2016 Red Sox Hot Stove Discussion Thread

[User Name]

Hanley as a standalone move to play 3B would have probably worked out way better.

[dupree]

With the rumblings out of Oakland that Reddick may be available, I'd like to see a 3 team trade with the Mariners & A's to send JBJ to Seattle and Reddick coming back to Beantown.

 

CarGo would be the ultimate piece but I don't see that happening.

 

I know that JBJ is the better defender but I just don't think he will hit for average in the majors. So now is the time to move him with his stock high.

 

But if he does stay in Boston I won't bitch because he may win the gold glove next year in either CF or RF wherever they play him

[Spudboy]

It's what we do too. From the time we signed Castillo to the time we extended Porcello we spent over 400 million on 5 players.

 

You saved me the effort! Thanks!

[Kimmi]

I still don't understand how picking up a $13 mil option for a starter who was worth 3.2 WAR last season is such a bad move, yet giving up 4 prospects, 2 of whom are very good, PLUS paying $12 mil in salary for a reliever who was worth 1.5 WAR is a good move.

 

I think some of you are judging these moves by your like or dislike of a player rather than on the actual worth of the player.

[User Name]

With the rumblings out of Oakland that Reddick may be available, I'd like to see a 3 team trade with the Mariners & A's to send JBJ to Seattle and Reddick coming back to Beantown.

 

CarGo would be the ultimate piece but I don't see that happening.

 

I know that JBJ is the better defender but I just don't think he will hit for average in the majors. So now is the time to move him with his stock high.

 

But if he does stay in Boston I won't bitch because he may win the gold glove next year in either CF or RF wherever they play him

 

Why are you even talking about OF's? We have more than enough OF depth. It's the pitching.

[a700hitter]

Here is my wish list for the remainder of the offseason.

 

1. Pick up one FA starter: Price/ Greinke/ Cuieto in that order of preference

2. Trade Sandoval for James Shields swapping bad contracts and allowing Hanley to play 3B

3. Pick up Chris Davis to play 1B

[Bellhorn04]

Here is my wish list for the remainder of the offseason.

 

1. Pick up one FA starter: Price/ Greinke/ Cuieto in that order of preference

2. Trade Sandoval for James Shields swapping bad contracts and allowing Hanley to play 3B

3. Pick up Chris Davis to play 1B

 

One thing I'm quite sure of is they're not going to sign Davis. He'll be much too expensive, an albatross-in-waiting.

[a700hitter]

One thing I'm quite sure of is they're not going to sign Davis. He'll be much too expensive, an albatross-in-waiting.

I don't think there is much, if any, chance of the Red Sox signing Davis, but I don't think he will be an albatross. He has hit 159 HRs over the last 4 seasons. He is a big impact power hitter who would replace Ortiz's power when he hangs it up after the next year or so.

[jacksonianmarch]

Davis has the potential to be an albatross. He turns 30 entering 2016. He has been good to extraordinary for 3 of the last 4 seasons, but he did put up a .196/.300/.404 line in 450ABs in 2014. If 2014 was as solid as the years surrounding it, I would be less concerned about his potential to totally fall off a cliff

[Palodios]

One of the new theories circling the web is that the Padres are trying to sell Tyson Ross, but are trying to attach Matt Kemp along with him. Is two years of Ross worth 80 million of Kemp? Ehhhhh.

[Kimmi]

One of the new theories circling the web is that the Padres are trying to sell Tyson Ross, but are trying to attach Matt Kemp along with him. Is two years of Ross worth 80 million of Kemp? Ehhhhh.

 

No thanks. I wouldn't mind Ross, but not if we have to take Kemp with his remaining contract. Kemp would not have a position to play anyway, unless we moved one of our current outfielders.

[example1]

One of the new theories circling the web is that the Padres are trying to sell Tyson Ross, but are trying to attach Matt Kemp along with him. Is two years of Ross worth 80 million of Kemp? Ehhhhh.

 

I'm not really too excited to see the Sox deal with the Padres again for a bit. I expected Ross to be included when I saw the package of 4 players the Sox sent over. I'd hate to see a Swihart, Devers, Benintendi for Ross and all of Kemp's salary deal.

[example1]

So the Kimbrel deal has its own page and its moving to discussion about what to do next... so I'm going to try to approach that here.

 

I think getting Price is a pipe-dream. I don't think he loves Boston... he's not even neutral to it like another player from, say, LA or KC might be. He's actively been playing against them in a heated rivalry (with him at the center) for years. And the idea that they might blow him out of the water with an offer seems foolish. Blowing him out of the water would be absurd, since he's likely to command almost $200m to begin with. Just too much risk there. I think he'd be great, but I wouldn't build my offseason strategy around somehow being able to bring him in. At this point if he goes to a non-AL East team I will be happy.

 

I like Greinke, but similarily I think he will have a number of good offers and, frankly, I don't know why he would choose Boston over others. If I had the choice between living in Boston and living rich in LA I think I know which I'd choose. Perhaps they could blow him out of the water a bit more easiliy, but still, wouldn't bet on it.

 

Then there's Cueto. I think there's a chance the Sox could construct a creative deal with him, maybe high money short years with an opt-out clause or something. He's a good pitcher when he's on and if he stays healthy he could be fine. Just more risk, but perhaps the biggest spenders will have gone home with their prize at that point.

 

Zimmermann I don't know well enough, other than having watched a few of his starts and tracked him over the past few years. He feels a bit like a good #2 to me. Should they maybe sign him with aspirations of still seeking that true "ace" somewhere else in future years? He might be the lowest cost of the bunch.

 

All in all, I feel like Price is the only true "ace" of the bunch in that he has virtually no question marks about his performance. The rest have some risks and I'd rather the Sox don't spend money as if they're getting a true ace if they aren't. I would be happy with Price, Greinke or Cueto but I wouldn't feel like it necessarily vaults them into being an elite team... there's more work to be done there.

 

The biggest difference maker for the Sox won't be these acquisitions. They might be key structural pieces who promote good things, but they're really banking on their youngsters to contribute at a high level and that has to happen. So Bogaerts needs to improve from last year, Betts needs to increase his consistency. Swihart needs to develop into a legitimate bat and signal caller over the next few years. Basically all of their young guys need to continue evolving into solid MLB players and then these signings will make a difference. They have a great collection of young talent between MLB rookie types and mid-to-upper level minor league talent. Get those guys going and this could be a really good thing. In the meantime, don't blow it.

[a700hitter]

So the Kimbrel deal has its own page and its moving to discussion about what to do next... so I'm going to try to approach that here.

 

I think getting Price is a pipe-dream. I don't think he loves Boston... he's not even neutral to it like another player from, say, LA or KC might be. He's actively been playing against them in a heated rivalry (with him at the center) for years. And the idea that they might blow him out of the water with an offer seems foolish. Blowing him out of the water would be absurd, since he's likely to command almost $200m to begin with. Just too much risk there. I think he'd be great, but I wouldn't build my offseason strategy around somehow being able to bring him in. At this point if he goes to a non-AL East team I will be happy.

 

I like Greinke, but similarily I think he will have a number of good offers and, frankly, I don't know why he would choose Boston over others. If I had the choice between living in Boston and living rich in LA I think I know which I'd choose. Perhaps they could blow him out of the water a bit more easiliy, but still, wouldn't bet on it.

 

Then there's Cueto. I think there's a chance the Sox could construct a creative deal with him, maybe high money short years with an opt-out clause or something. He's a good pitcher when he's on and if he stays healthy he could be fine. Just more risk, but perhaps the biggest spenders will have gone home with their prize at that point.

 

Zimmermann I don't know well enough, other than having watched a few of his starts and tracked him over the past few years. He feels a bit like a good #2 to me. Should they maybe sign him with aspirations of still seeking that true "ace" somewhere else in future years? He might be the lowest cost of the bunch.

 

All in all, I feel like Price is the only true "ace" of the bunch in that he has virtually no question marks about his performance. The rest have some risks and I'd rather the Sox don't spend money as if they're getting a true ace if they aren't. I would be happy with Price, Greinke or Cueto but I wouldn't feel like it necessarily vaults them into being an elite team... there's more work to be done there.

 

The biggest difference maker for the Sox won't be these acquisitions. They might be key structural pieces who promote good things, but they're really banking on their youngsters to contribute at a high level and that has to happen. So Bogaerts needs to improve from last year, Betts needs to increase his consistency. Swihart needs to develop into a legitimate bat and signal caller over the next few years. Basically all of their young guys need to continue evolving into solid MLB players and then these signings will make a difference. They have a great collection of young talent between MLB rookie types and mid-to-upper level minor league talent. Get those guys going and this could be a really good thing. In the meantime, don't blow it.

What would be your plan for Red Sox pitching?

[example1]

What would be your plan for Red Sox pitching?

 

I can't say I have a great one. It would have started with trading a big package for a true ace. But apparently, here in mid November, it's the case that no such deals are available and some of the pieces were already shipped for a closer. So my next play would be to strengthen the bullpen even more, if possible. Maybe sign O'Day so they can work toward becoming a 6 inning staff.

 

I would also think about using Joe Kelly out of the bullpen. That guy's got an electric arm and would like to see if he could be a great setup guy. Let him compete with Tazawa. I'd keep Owens starting, as I think he can border between keeping them competitive most games and having some excellent starts. Then it's a matter of crossing fingers on guys like Buchholz, Porcello, Miley and Rodriguez. Maybe give Brian Johnson a shot at the rotation--he's actually been really good in the minors for a number of years.

 

Perhaps there's a missed SP FA out there, like Gallardo or Kazmir who could be had for a reasonable amount. If the return isn't fantastic then don't pay as if it is.

 

Longterm I would continue to stockpile the pieces and wait for that great young SP arm to be available via trade.

 

Overall, I just don't know DD's negotiating tactics well enough. One thing I really appreciate about him is how candid he is about everything (seemingly). He answers questions without the BS that the old group (who I liked quite a bit) always did. When asked about how a decision is made, he just says how they made the decision. From Theo to Ben the Sox have said "well, we don't talk about the inner workings of our discussions but there was mutual interest" or whatever.

 

In this instance though he's essentially said "we want a true ace" AND "we are planning to get it via FA". That's the kid of candor that the previous group would never have done--and I understand why. So if Price signs quickly, and Greinke decides he wants to go back to LA, and Zimmermann is swooped up, if I'm Cueto's agent I'm licking my chops thinking that I've got them backed into a corner. They've acknowledged they don't want to part with more prospects because the best remaining ones are pieces they'd prefer to keep. They've also acknowledged that the mission wouldn't be accomplished if there weren't an ace caliber SP on the roster come opening day. Sounds like they backed themselves into a corner. Not an inescapable one... but a corner nonetheless. But, again, I don't know how DD operates well enough to know if this is just a tactic or if he's truly just showing his cards. I could see how just showing his cards would be both endearing and would help build trust with other GMs and agents. Maybe he's just someone who's really clear and transparent. I don't know.

[User Name]

So the Kimbrel deal has its own page and its moving to discussion about what to do next... so I'm going to try to approach that here.

 

I think getting Price is a pipe-dream. I don't think he loves Boston... he's not even neutral to it like another player from, say, LA or KC might be. He's actively been playing against them in a heated rivalry (with him at the center) for years. And the idea that they might blow him out of the water with an offer seems foolish. Blowing him out of the water would be absurd, since he's likely to command almost $200m to begin with. Just too much risk there. I think he'd be great, but I wouldn't build my offseason strategy around somehow being able to bring him in. At this point if he goes to a non-AL East team I will be happy.

 

I like Greinke, but similarily I think he will have a number of good offers and, frankly, I don't know why he would choose Boston over others. If I had the choice between living in Boston and living rich in LA I think I know which I'd choose. Perhaps they could blow him out of the water a bit more easiliy, but still, wouldn't bet on it.

 

Then there's Cueto. I think there's a chance the Sox could construct a creative deal with him, maybe high money short years with an opt-out clause or something. He's a good pitcher when he's on and if he stays healthy he could be fine. Just more risk, but perhaps the biggest spenders will have gone home with their prize at that point.

 

Zimmermann I don't know well enough, other than having watched a few of his starts and tracked him over the past few years. He feels a bit like a good #2 to me. Should they maybe sign him with aspirations of still seeking that true "ace" somewhere else in future years? He might be the lowest cost of the bunch.

 

All in all, I feel like Price is the only true "ace" of the bunch in that he has virtually no question marks about his performance. The rest have some risks and I'd rather the Sox don't spend money as if they're getting a true ace if they aren't. I would be happy with Price, Greinke or Cueto but I wouldn't feel like it necessarily vaults them into being an elite team... there's more work to be done there.

 

The biggest difference maker for the Sox won't be these acquisitions. They might be key structural pieces who promote good things, but they're really banking on their youngsters to contribute at a high level and that has to happen. So Bogaerts needs to improve from last year, Betts needs to increase his consistency. Swihart needs to develop into a legitimate bat and signal caller over the next few years. Basically all of their young guys need to continue evolving into solid MLB players and then these signings will make a difference. They have a great collection of young talent between MLB rookie types and mid-to-upper level minor league talent. Get those guys going and this could be a really good thing. In the meantime, don't blow it.

 

It's not a pipe dream. This is the Boston Red Sox you're talking about, not the Pittsburgh Pirates. They can sign whoever they want if they so desire. Also, Price has history with Dombrowski. The inherent risk of giving a 200+ million contract to a pitcher is an extremely fair point, but given the product the Sox have churned out the last two seasons, it's a risk they will probably be willing to take to address the pitching. You also need to take into account the added value of not having to forfeit a draft pick for an ace-caliber pitcher. It doesn't matter one iota whether Price doesn't like Boston, or whether we were rivals. Money talks. Just ask Johnny "I will never be a Yankee" Damon.

[Bellhorn04]

It's not a pipe dream. This is the Boston Red Sox you're talking about, not the Pittsburgh Pirates. They can sign whoever they want if they so desire. Also, Price has history with Dombrowski. The inherent risk of giving a 200+ million contract to a pitcher is an extremely fair point, but given the product the Sox have churned out the last two seasons, it's a risk they will probably be willing to take to address the pitching. You also need to take into account the added value of not having to forfeit a draft pick for an ace-caliber pitcher. It doesn't matter one iota whether Price doesn't like Boston, or whether we were rivals. Money talks. Just ask Johnny "I will never be a Yankee" Damon.

 

A lot depends on the individual. Last year Lester was down to 3 teams - Cubs, Sox and Giants. He eliminated the Giants, much to their surprise, even though they were reportedly offering more than the Sox and were prepared to keep swinging with the Cubs.

 

Lester handled the situation like a rational human being. He knew he wanted to play for either the Cubs or the Sox for the next 6 years and he knew he was going to be paid an absurd amount of money in either case.

 

Price could easily end up in the same situation.

[User Name]

Had the Giants offered 20 milion more than the Cubs, it's very likely he would be a Giant right now.Zack Greinke was candid about the subject after he signed with the Dodgers. He hates the Hollywood atmosphere, but the money's too good to pass up. Price has given absolutely no indication that it isn't all about the money for him.

[User Name]

On another note, the Reds are listening on Frazier, and seem to want "MLB-ready OFers" for him. I'd do (if possible) a bad contract swap with the Padres for Shields, then angle for Frazier. This one I would add to the "pipe dream" category.

[a700hitter]

A lot depends on the individual. Last year Lester was down to 3 teams - Cubs, Sox and Giants. He eliminated the Giants, much to their surprise, even though they were reportedly offering more than the Sox and were prepared to keep swinging with the Cubs.

 

Lester handled the situation like a rational human being. He knew he wanted to play for either the Cubs or the Sox for the next 6 years and he knew he was going to be paid an absurd amount of money in either case.

 

Price could easily end up in the same situation.

His history with DD will play to our advantage. Edited December 17, 2015 by a700hitter

[SoxFanForsyth]

I think getting Price is a pipe-dream. I don't think he loves Boston... he's not even neutral to it like another player from, say, LA or KC might be. He's actively been playing against them in a heated rivalry (with him at the center) for years. And the idea that they might blow him out of the water with an offer seems foolish. Blowing him out of the water would be absurd, since he's likely to command almost $200m to begin with. Just too much risk there. I think he'd be great, but I wouldn't build my offseason strategy around somehow being able to bring him in. At this point if he goes to a non-AL East team I will be happy.

 

 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[GomesBeard]

These guys are professionals. Issues he has had in the past with the Sox will disappear when the money becomes huge. And the guys on the Sox he had an issue with - really mostly Big Papi - will embrace him if he helps them win.

[Dojji]

"These guys are professionals": and yet whenever I bring up Zach Greinke you beat me over the head with a social anxiety problem that hasn't reared its head in half a decade.

[User Name]

Greinke handled LA. He can handle Boston. But Price is better, younger, and won't cost a draft pick. That said, Greinke is an excellent secondary option.

[mvp 78]

Greinke handled LA. He can handle Boston. But Price is better, younger, and won't cost a draft pick. That said, Greinke is an excellent secondary option.

 

But LA is hardly a sports town and they leave the game by the 7th inning!!!!!!!!!!

 

What happens when Sully yells "hey Greinke, you fahkin suck ya doooshbahg?" Career over!!!!

 

Boston sports fans are true sports fans, not like those bandwagon jumping SoCal dipshits. We wouldn't ever become frontrunners like that. The Dodgrs have nothing that compares like the tradition of singing Sweet Caroline, eating Fenway Franks and chilling with Wally... True fans.

[a700hitter]

"These guys are professionals": and yet whenever I bring up Zach Greinke you beat me over the head with a social anxiety problem that hasn't reared its head in half a decade.

I am not a mental health professional, but based on my lay experience, anxiety disorders and depression can often be overcome and successfully managed. It is often not a chronic situation as is schizophrenia. Greinke has not had a recurrent episode in many years and he has pitched in All Star games and playoffs that carry lots of pressure. Boston shouldn't be a problem even if there are some dickwads in the stands shouting disgusting stuff. I just don't understand those so-called fans. Yell at the umps and occasionally the manager who has been sleeping on the bench, but not the players. I like Greinke better than Price, but he probably should never listen to Red Sox talk radio stations. No player should listen to that crap.

[SoxFanForsyth]

Good grief. Can we shove it with the armchair psychologists and the anxiety disorder that last reared its head on an unmedicated Zack Grienke some 10 years ago? My goodness, the takes on Grienke being affected by social anxiety and the Boston scary media is beyond obtuse.

 

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/2015/11/17/time-end-the-tired-narrative-that-zack-greinke-wouldn-able-handle-boston/dZsu3NRt3uEoN4udcUI0TK/story.html?s_campaign=bcom:gigya:twitter

 

Read.

[Bellhorn04]

Good grief. Can we shove it with the armchair psychologists and the anxiety disorder that last reared its head on an unmedicated Zack Grienke some 10 years ago? My goodness, the takes on Grienke being affected by social anxiety and the Boston scary media is beyond obtuse.

 

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/2015/11/17/time-end-the-tired-narrative-that-zack-greinke-wouldn-able-handle-boston/dZsu3NRt3uEoN4udcUI0TK/story.html?s_campaign=bcom:gigya:twitter

 

Read.

 

All that really matters is what Greinke thinks.

[reYoukilis]

LA is no Boston but its still high pressure and he had an under 2 ERA for most of the year. I dont think his mental problems have anything to do with his baseball play. As a matter of fact baseball may be a sanctuary of sorts for his anxiety. Id like to see him as a Red Sok.

[a700hitter]

All that really matters is what Greinke thinks.

Agreed. I have little doubt that he can pitch well in Boston. The only question is whether he would want to put up with the crap.