Cespedes on the block

[jacksonianmarch]

6. Yoenis Cespedes, OF, Red Sox — Word is spreading that the Red Sox could make Cespedes available. He will earn $10.2 million in the final year of his deal. Cespedes said late in the season that he wasn’t sure whether he’d engage in long-term talks with the Red Sox. Couple that with his desire not to play right field or work on his defense, and that could make him a trade candidate as the Red Sox try to pare their outfield depth and possibly make room for Mookie Betts or add a lefthanded hitter.

 

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2014/10/18/hitting-coaches-blamed-for-lack-offense/5I4fqkhNWnM739C7hxNl2O/story.html

 

So, looks like Cespedes is on the block. The guy isn't being a "team player". Regardless, the guy would be better suited to play out his season in Fenway to maximize his value. He's a 30HR hitter in Fenway.

[Elktonnick]

If Victorino is healthy, I think the Sox would be better served with a starting outfield of Castillo, Betts and Victorino. Cepedes just could be the odd man out.

[jacksonianmarch]

In a league devoid of power, a guy like Cespedes can be valuable. The fact that he's intent on hitting the market, his worth is a little down. You're gonna get double the return if you deal him before the season. Once the receiving team cannot get draft comp, the worth drops

[Palodios]

In a league devoid of power, a guy like Cespedes can be valuable. The fact that he's intent on hitting the market, his worth is a little down. You're gonna get double the return if you deal him before the season. Once the receiving team cannot get draft comp, the worth drops

 

Cespedes has a clause in his contract that will prevent teams from giving him a QO no matter what.

 

The Red Sox will need to get a high end prospect or Cueto/Hamels/Price (potentially with 3 teams involved) in order to trade Cespedes. The Red Sox traded their ace for the guy, he's not going away for a minor prospect or #4 starter.

[Palodios]

In other news, the Red Sox just signed the Oakland Athletic's hitting coach. I would imagine that Cespedes is a very big reason for that.

[vjcsmoke]

Still dreaming of a Cespedes, Castillo, Stanton OF but it's unlikely to happen.

If Stanton is Untouchable, Does anyone think that Nelson Cruz could be had? He's a RHB veteran Dominican slugger who recently exploded for 40 HRs for Baltimore.

 

http://mlb.mlb.com/team/player.jsp?player_id=443558#gameType='R'&sectionType=career&statType=1&season=2014&level='ALL'

Edited October 20, 2014 by vjcsmoke

[Palodios]

Still dreaming of a Cespedes, Castillo, Stanton OF but it's unlikely to happen.

If Stanton is Untouchable, Does anyone think that Nelson Cruz could be had? He's a RHB veteran Dominican slugger who recently exploded for 40 HRs for Baltimore.

 

http://mlb.mlb.com/team/player.jsp?player_id=443558#gameType='R'§ionType=career&statType=1&season=2014&level='ALL'

 

Nelson Cruz is definitely available. I doubt the Red Sox want to add another outfielder though, especially a buy-high like Cruz.

[Spudboy]

So he refuses to work on his defense? Imagine that!

 

I wonder why the Sox wanted him to wok on his defense?

[Palodios]

What's with all the foreign baseball players who are so incredibly uncoachable? You would think that these guys coming from places like Cuba and the DR would appreciate coming from poverty to riches. Instead they act like princesses.

 

I blame Scott Boras.

 

And yes, I understand Boras is not Cespedes's agent.

[sk7326]

In other news, the Red Sox just signed the Oakland Athletic's hitting coach. I would imagine that Cespedes is a very big reason for that.

 

And the only guy to get a hit on this night

[sk7326]

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2014/10/18/hitting-coaches-blamed-for-lack-offense/5I4fqkhNWnM739C7hxNl2O/story.html

 

So, looks like Cespedes is on the block. The guy isn't being a "team player". Regardless, the guy would be better suited to play out his season in Fenway to maximize his value. He's a 30HR hitter in Fenway.

 

A guy with light tower power on a reasonable contract but with poor on base skills ... it is worth seeing what they can get for him. The outfield is crowded - Betts is the only true untouchable.

[seabeachfred]

What's with all the foreign baseball players who are so incredibly uncoachable? You would think that these guys coming from places like Cuba and the DR would appreciate coming from poverty to riches. Instead they act like princesses.

 

I blame Scott Boras.

 

And yes, I understand Boras is not Cespedes's agent.

 

It is not PC to say things like that but I'm not anywhere near PC and you are right. Cuban and DR players love baseball and have a lot of talent, but you have to be very careful when signing players from those places, and throughout LA for that matter. You may wind up with a Roberto Clemente or a David Ortiz, but you could wind up with some other types lacking discipline, bad fundamentals and poor attitudes. Then, again, if more African Americans played baseball or white American players were a little more hungry and determined we might not have as many players from those areas. Fact is, they are needed now since a lot of US athletes are going into other sports like soccer and even hockey, along with football and basketball.

[redsoxrules]

If they can land Stanton then it's not big deal. Let him go.

[Northern Star]

I'd like to know what due diligence was done on Cespedes if we're already looking at shoving him out the door.

[Palodios]

It is not PC to say things like that but I'm not anywhere near PC and you are right. Cuban and DR players love baseball and have a lot of talent, but you have to be very careful when signing players from those places, and throughout LA for that matter. You may wind up with a Roberto Clemente or a David Ortiz, but you could wind up with some other types lacking discipline, bad fundamentals and poor attitudes. Then, again, if more African Americans played baseball or white American players were a little more hungry and determined we might not have as many players from those areas. Fact is, they are needed now since a lot of US athletes are going into other sports like soccer and even hockey, along with football and basketball.

 

 

I am not saying anything against particular races or the personalities of the majority of specific geographic areas. I just see so many anecdotes of these players coming from nothing, and acting that way.

[Spitball]

I am not saying anything against particular races or the personalities of the majority of specific geographic areas. I just see so many anecdotes of these players coming from nothing, and acting that way.

 

Right...One of my favorite players, Carl Yastrzemski, was considered a hard player to manage early in his career. He was credited with the firing of at least one Red Sox manager. White Sox manager Eddie Stanky said he was an all-star from the neck down.

 

Dick Stuart was a selfish player. George Scott could be volatile. Roger Clemens had questionable character. Carl Everett was a hard player to manage. Josh Beckett was a problem.

 

Louis Tiant was wonderful. Mike Lowell was a great team player. David Ortiz will always be a Red Sox favorite.

 

Athletes are often pampered, revered, and full of their own importance. I am not sure it is about race or origin.

[seabeachfred]

I am not saying anything against particular races or the personalities of the majority of specific geographic areas. I just see so many anecdotes of these players coming from nothing, and acting that way.

 

As I said Pal, you were right. I just gave my opinion why this might be so---and put the blame on American athletes that could be playing baseball and go in a different direction. That wasn't the case back in the 40's and 50's and into the 60's.

[sk7326]

I'd like to know what due diligence was done on Cespedes if we're already looking at shoving him out the door.

 

I think they looked at it as a (relatively) free look at Cespedes. He has a spinnable contract, and serious talent. If you look at how little they gave up, the move makes sense. (2 months of control of Lester and Gomes, neither which they needed) Now, I was critical of the deal at the time because I was not sure they optimized Lester's value. However, when you saw how little the Rays got back for David Price, I think it was much more of a buyer's market than it seemed.

[FredLynn]

Cespedes has a clause in his contract that will prevent teams from giving him a QO no matter what.

 

The Red Sox will need to get a high end prospect or Cueto/Hamels/Price (potentially with 3 teams involved) in order to trade Cespedes. The Red Sox traded their ace for the guy, he's not going away for a minor prospect or #4 starter.

 

Cespedes has one year left on his contract. He is also overrated. Last I checked his OPS was well under .800 and his OBP was under .300. He is also a below average fielder. Therefore, we are unlikely to receive a valuable player in return for him.

[SCM33]

If Victorino is healthy, I think the Sox would be better served with a starting outfield of Castillo, Betts and Victorino. Cepedes just could be the odd man out.

 

If Victorino is healthy (it would be a miracle) then he should be a platoon/4th OF. 2013 was a fluke when you look at where his career was trending.

 

More likely is .260/.330/.400/.730 with 5-10 HR and 30-40 RBI.

[Spitball]

Cespedes has one year left on his contract. He is also overrated. Last I checked his OPS was well under .800 and his OBP was under .300. He is also a below average fielder. Therefore, we are unlikely to receive a valuable player in return for him.

 

I totally agree...except there is a shortage of power in baseball. There are teams desperate for a power hitter to plug into their lineup. The A's apparently undervalued Cespedes's value. They dropped from an elite team before the trade to just a pretty good team the rest of the way. I think Cespedes has value...though it might not be deserved.

[SCM33]

We need to lock Cespedes up, not trade him.

 

For the first time in a couple years the Sox have a legitimate right handed power bat in the lineup.....a guy who legitimately puts a fear in the opposing team. Redsox cannot draft a power bat to save their life. They have literally never been able to do it. In the few instances they have, they traded him away before they could develop him. When was the last time the Sox drafted and developed a home grown power bat? Nomar? Mo Vaughn? In Cespedes, we actually have one......him in this lineup doesn't look too shabby:

 

CF Betts

2B Pedroia

DH Ortiz

LF Cespedes

1B Napoli

RF Castillo

SS Bogaerts

3B ??

C Vasquez

 

JBJ, Nava, Holt, and Craig can all have spots on the bench.

[sk7326]

We need to lock Cespedes up, not trade him.

 

For the first time in a couple years the Sox have a legitimate right handed power bat in the lineup.....a guy who legitimately puts a fear in the opposing team. Redsox cannot draft a power bat to save their life. They have literally never been able to do it. In the few instances they have, they traded him away before they could develop him. When was the last time the Sox drafted and developed a home grown power bat? Nomar? Mo Vaughn? In Cespedes, we actually have one......him in this lineup doesn't look too shabby:

 

CF Betts

2B Pedroia

DH Ortiz

LF Cespedes

1B Napoli

RF Castillo

SS Bogaerts

3B ??

C Vasquez

 

JBJ, Nava, Holt, and Craig can all have spots on the bench.

 

Cespedes was a good guy to trade for because the "trade/sign" question can be answered in either direction. His current deal is friendly, his defense is solid (more from measurement than perception) power is increasingly scarce in today's baseball and he at least has SHOWN (in his rookie year) that he might be able to deliver enough on-base to unlock all of the good stuff. But the last two seasons of ghastly on-base (with outs being the only true measure of time in baseball) raises concern as to whether he is more empty calories or not. He has to get better - but there is evidence that it is possible.

[Spudboy]

Cespedes was a good guy to trade for because the "trade/sign" question can be answered in either direction. His current deal is friendly, his defense is solid (more from measurement than perception) power is increasingly scarce in today's baseball and he at least has SHOWN (in his rookie year) that he might be able to deliver enough on-base to unlock all of the good stuff. But the last two seasons of ghastly on-base (with outs being the only true measure of time in baseball) raises concern as to whether he is more empty calories or not. He has to get better - but there is evidence that it is possible.

 

So you think that at 29-30 he will learn better plate discipline? How to judge a fly ball? How to cut a ball off? How to hit the cut-off man?

 

I have said that I like his power and little else. If he wants top $ to resign ( and he has said that he wants to go to F.A. ), I say move on.

 

To bad about losing that power bat, though.

[sk7326]

So you think that at 29-30 he will learn better plate discipline? How to judge a fly ball? How to cut a ball off? How to hit the cut-off man?

 

I have said that I like his power and little else. If he wants top $ to resign ( and he has said that he wants to go to F.A. ), I say move on.

 

To bad about losing that power bat, though.

 

In 2012 he had a .356 OBP. He has not done it the last two years, but there is evidence that guy is there. He has been a decent to good LF in the past (it's valued in Oakland certainly). I am not sold on him, but it's not a high price either.

[seabeachfred]

In 2012 he had a .356 OBP. He has not done it the last two years, but there is evidence that guy is there. He has been a decent to good LF in the past (it's valued in Oakland certainly). I am not sold on him, but it's not a high price either.

 

SK---if the Red Sox opt for pitching via the trade mart and have chance to pick up a solid pitcher with one or two years left on their respective contract, it might cost us a Cespedes to get that pitcher. If might cost us someone like him anyway if he is part of a big trade for Cole Hamels. Unless Henry is prepared to spend a shitload of money on two top notch free agent pitchers it will cost us personnel and good players at that in order to get what we believe we need. Nothing is going to come cheap, either in trades or free agency.

[sk7326]

SK---if the Red Sox opt for pitching via the trade mart and have chance to pick up a solid pitcher with one or two years left on their respective contract, it might cost us a Cespedes to get that pitcher. If might cost us someone like him anyway if he is part of a big trade for Cole Hamels. Unless Henry is prepared to spend a shitload of money on two top notch free agent pitchers it will cost us personnel and good players at that in order to get what we believe we need. Nothing is going to come cheap, either in trades or free agency.

 

Oh I agree - I think he is a very tradeable contract and one of the big reasons they landed him.

[jacksonianmarch]

Rotoworld says that all the Red Sox coaches hate Cespedes and that he will be dealt come ST. Interesting that you'd trade your ace for this guy and not get an idea that he'd be a dick before dealing for him. This info torpedoes his value as does hit low OBP style and poor D.

[Palodios]

Rotoworld says that all the Red Sox coaches hate Cespedes and that he will be dealt come ST. Interesting that you'd trade your ace for this guy and not get an idea that he'd be a dick before dealing for him. This info torpedoes his value as does hit low OBP style and poor D.

 

This sounds exactly like what the Red Sox PR machine would say before trading a player. Why would they hire Oakland's hitting coach if he already has a beef with one of your middle-of-the-order bats?

[Spudboy]

This sounds exactly like what the Red Sox PR machine would say before trading a player. Why would they hire Oakland's hitting coach if he already has a beef with one of your middle-of-the-order bats?

 

Why would the Sox say anything at all that would diminish a player's value while shopping him? That makes no sense.

 

I suspected this guy would not be around very long. I wonder what the Sox can salvage from this whole mess?

 

Interesting to see so many people mentioning his "poor D".