2014 Offseason Thread

[gojohn99]

I like Sandoval, but I don't like the Hanley signing. Ramirez is injury prone and on the decline, so we offer him 90 million??

[MANNYHOF24]

IMO, Hanley was signed to play outfield. There is no way they will want him playing short stop.

[MANNYHOF24]

I like Sandoval, but I don't like the Hanley signing. Ramirez is injury prone and on the decline, so we offer him 90 million??

 

What stats prove this?

[BSN07]

I'm starting to wonder if Ben is thinking bigger right now. He's built perhaps the best offense in the majors, and has a ton of guys sitting around in the minors. Some unknown combination of Cecchini, Xander, Holt, Nava, Cespedes, Marrero, Betts are expendable.

 

That's a group that isn't intended to land Hamels. That's a Chris Sale type load. Whoever Ben is targeting, I believe him to a 20-something ace.

 

It could be one big deal or 2 semi big ones. I think if they don't sign Lester it will be the 2 semi big ones. A deal for one year of Price and then someone like Hamels. If Lester signs then it could be a controlled 20 something Ace like Sale. Either way a rotation headed by Price and Hamels of Lester and Sale would be insane.

[gojohn99]

2011 Ramirez 92 games played

2012 157 games

2013 86 games played

2014 128 games played

 

 

So in the past 4 years, he has ONE full season

[BSN07]

IMO, Hanley was signed to play outfield. There is no way they will want him playing short stop.

 

Me too. His bat is still legit and they will want to extend his prime as much as possible as he is leaving it. If he hit's .290 20HR 90RBI(all within reason) get's OB at his career clip and plays avg D in LF, the deal will be a steal in this offensive strapped league.

[sk7326]

Me too. His bat is still legit and they will want to extend his prime as much as possible as he is leaving it. If he hit's .290 20HR 90RBI(all within reason) get's OB at his career clip and plays avg D in LF, the deal will be a steal in this offensive strapped league.

 

Indeed - signed to play LF and spot DH. He could play 3B if Sandoval doesn't work out. Also remember, Sandoval's deal (if it is only 5 years) means that the Red Sox will be paying $18M a year for his 29-33 years ... he has less age risk than most FAs. There are teams who would take that contract on.

[sk7326]

2011 Ramirez 92 games played

2012 157 games

2013 86 games played

2014 128 games played

 

 

So in the past 4 years, he has ONE full season

 

There is some risk there - but the solution might be moving him off of the physically problematic job.

[Palodios]

There have been musings of Pablo and Hanley being the Dh/1b of the future. Considering the team has so little 1b prospect depth, it kind of makes sense.

[User Name]

The notion of betting the farm on a kid with 52 games of major league experience is ridiculous to me. He had a hot streak and that was all. He is a 2B that last year's team plugged in anywhere because he was the only shining light after the trade deadline.

 

XB, Holt, & WMB all cooled off. And so will Betts. If he had Ellsbury speed and Jackie Bradley defensive range I would say yeah keep the kid because his bat does play as an on base guy at the top of the order. But he don't have elite speed or elite OF defense, (given its not his natural position) I hope they roll him to bring in pitching and use him in the trade instead of our pitching prospects. I'd rather trade Betts than Owens anyday.

 

That makes zero sense. They just acquired two premium bats on the market. If anything, they're protecting themselves in case he struggles given his excellent long-term outlook. By your logic they should have traded Pedroia and Ellsbury first chance they got, and that's silly for lack of a better word. You can't dump young guys because of the chance they will struggle while ignoring their long-term outlook. That's a good way to turn your team into the 2014 edition of the Phillies. Just stop.

[BSN07]

2011 Ramirez 92 games played

2012 157 games

2013 86 games played

2014 128 games played

 

 

So in the past 4 years, he has ONE full season

 

While playing SS. You also failed to mention he played in 140+ games his whole career until the period you pointed out. The move to the OF should help him stay on the field. I get that it is a risk tho. But sometimes you got to take risks. To me honestly this seems less risky than the Crawford signing. Hanley seems more of a discount. If he had put up another career avg year he would have been looking at Cano type money being that he is younger and has similar career stats(with Cano having the edge durability wise). At minimum 7/150M.

[redsoxrules]

According to Panda's agent there's no deal in place yet.

[User Name]

While playing SS. You also failed to mention he played in 140+ games his whole career until the period you pointed out. The move to the OF should help him stay on the field. I get that it is a risk tho. But sometimes you got to take risks. To me honestly this seems less risky than the Crawford signing. Hanley seems more of a discount. If he had put up another career avg year he would have been looking at Cano type money being that he is younger and has similar career stats(with Cano having the edge durability wise). At minimum 7/150M.

 

7/132 was the number being bandied about. 5/90 in this market is very, very sensible if he can stay on the field.

[BSN07]

According to Panda's agent there's no deal in place yet.

 

We know. These are all scenarios of "if" the deals actually go down.

[BSN07]

7/132 was the number being bandied about. 5/90 in this market is very, very sensible if he can stay on the field.

 

Also he will be able to put on weight(muscle) by not trying to stick at SS and his power could go up. All things to consider.

[BSN07]

Sandoval will make a final decision today, Vasquez tells Speier (Twitter link). FOX’s Ken Rosenthal tweets that the Padres have yet to be informed that they’re out of the running as well.

 

Well looks like it won't get drug out too much longer. We should know soon either way

 

Sorry for the triple post, my phone did't agree with how I wanted to post....

[seabeachfred]

1. AJP was just a one year stop gap to hold down the fort. He was a consistent low to mid .700 OPS bat and while he sucked, it's hard to call it a bad signing.

2. Drew was brought in to fill a hole while we were still trying to contend. Like AJP, it didn't work out, but it's hard to take issue with the thinking.

3. Mujica was brought in for a lowly 9 million dollars and demonstrated a skill set that reminded one of Koji. Relievers are up and down and Mujica was a decent sign in an environment where folks like brandon league get huge dollars.

4. Lester was coming off of a 110 ERA+ and while it looks bad in hindsight, I don't think you can fault the FO for not ponying up 100+ million for him prior to 2014.

5. Rookies struggle, he wasn't going to get better in AAA or riding the pine.

 

Please, try harder.

 

I gave you five lousy things Cherington did and all you did was carry his water with a bunch of mealy mouth excuses. Those moves were crappy to the core and it cost us dearly. They were mistakes, or blunders as I would have put it. Each move turned out to be a disaster. Stop defending the indefensible because it sounds very silly.

[seabeachfred]

I'm less than surprised that you're stepping in to side with that dunce.

 

Warning Missy.....DO NOT GET PERSONAL WITH ME UNLESS YOU WANT A WAR. If anyone is a dunce it's you for defending moves that were just plain stupid, wrong and ineffective.

[SeanJohn93]

Sandoval agrees with sox

[BSN07]

I gave you five lousy things Cherington did and all you did was carry his water with a bunch of mealy mouth excuses. Those moves were crappy to the core and it cost us dearly. They were mistakes, or blunders as I would have put it. Each move turned out to be a disaster. Stop defending the indefensible because it sounds very silly.

 

I'm dying of laughter over here , the irony in this post is priceless

[BSN07]

Sandoval agrees with sox

 

source? espn has had it in breaking news all day

[User Name]

It's being reported in mlb.com.

[seabeachfred]

This is great! Sox sign a beat up non SS whose bat kinda fell off this yr and they're signing an overweight 3b who doesn't hit well and both will be on the books at big money for the next 5 seasons? This is very good, and I'm a Yankee fan.

 

Jacko, some here are seeing these signing with their hearts with visions of doubles and triples dancing in their heads. What they're missing are errors, misplayed balls by the Hamram and late losses because the pitching is totally s*****. They'll be entertaining until it becomes crunch time and then we both know what will likely happen. Meanwhile Lester goes elsewhere and wemay sell Cespedes but at a discount because all baseball knows we now have to get rid of him while those teams have us over a barrel. We never seem to learn.

[sk7326]

I gave you five lousy things Cherington did and all you did was carry his water with a bunch of mealy mouth excuses. Those moves were crappy to the core and it cost us dearly. They were mistakes, or blunders as I would have put it. Each move turned out to be a disaster. Stop defending the indefensible because it sounds very silly.

 

This seems unfair. One of the funny things fans say is "you can only evaluate a move after waiting to see if it works". But really, that is garbage. The only accurate evaluation of these moves is AT THE TIME YOU MAKE THEM, because all you have are percentages.

 

You look at the Pierzynski signing at the time Cherington made it, what was he looking at:

- A solid starter who was going to command a multiyear deal

- A couple of near big league ready guys who were not quite there, but both looked like better prospects than the solid starter

- Almost all free agent catching was some variation of meh

 

What are the choices? Sign a bridge guy or take your shot with the not quite ripe kiddos. I'd have gone with #2, but it was not at all obvious. Cherington's move was one of the two sensible things to do - and it did not work out. Nobody could have expected the AJ signing to be as actively negative as it was.

[BSN07]

Team and players still haven't said anything tho, I'm kinda waiting for that before getting too into the whole idea of these signings means. Pretty entertaining tho

[iortiz]

Seems like both signings are done. Both are great players. Seems like XB and/or Cespedes will not be next year. Now, we need at least 2 solid SP like Lester and Hamels/Shields and call it great offseason.

[Palodios]

Fred, the other key thing to remember here is that Ben struck fast. None of the top pitchers have been signed or traded. He's filled key holes BEFORE the Yankees, so we have a better idea of what resource he has left, what he can spend, and who he can trade.

 

He's definitely not done yet.

[a700hitter]

I'm wondering if Middlebrroks is rethinking his position on not compromising his health by playing Winter Ball? How healthy do you have to be to pump gas? My earlier prediction that he will not be invited to Spring Training with the big club is looking pretty good.

[seabeachfred]

This seems unfair. One of the funny things fans say is "you can only evaluate a move after waiting to see if it works". But really, that is garbage. The only accurate evaluation of these moves is AT THE TIME YOU MAKE THEM, because all you have are percentages.

 

You look at the Pierzynski signing at the time Cherington made it, what was he looking at:

- A solid starter who was going to command a multiyear deal

- A couple of near big league ready guys who were not quite there, but both looked like better prospects than the solid starter

- Almost all free agent catching was some variation of meh

 

What are the choices? Sign a bridge guy or take your shot with the not quite ripe kiddos. I'd have gone with #2, but it was not at all obvious. Cherington's move was one of the two sensible things to do - and it did not work out. Nobody could have expected the AJ signing to be as actively negative as it was.

 

Sorry but that is totally false. There were a few of us here, me included, that said AJ was a bad fit for the team because he was a near cancer in the clubhouse, had no discipline at the plate and was a me me me type player. Look back and see for yourself. As f or Drew, everyone on this board knows full well that I not only predicted that Cherington would crash and sign the guy but that his signing would be disastrous---which is most certainly turned out to be. Those are facts.

[a700hitter]

Fred, the other key thing to remember here is that Ben struck fast. None of the top pitchers have been signed or traded. He's filled key holes BEFORE the Yankees, so we have a better idea of what resource he has left, what he can spend, and who he can trade.

 

He's definitely not done yet.

After the Sandoval signing is announced, I would expect a trade to happen fairly quickly. Whether he trades the glut of OFers or XB, the price will go up if teams know that we have a glut of players that we can't use.