2013 Spring Training

[jung]

I don't know if I would recommend that a guy with the size, strength, quickness and speed to play football and the hand/eye coordination to play baseball go try to make in the NFL right now. I think I understand why the NFL PA has gone in the direction they have gone in. But it is a scary time. The NFL PA is motivated to move off the dime because such a high percentage of the additional money that has gone into payroll has just gone to making the richest players richer. That is a real problem for a union boss dealing with rank and file all having one vote. In fact I suspect the ML PA feels that hot breadth of the rank and file on its neck as well.

 

Agreeing to the flat hard cap may well move the NFL money deeper into the roster but since the contracts are not guaranteed unless the player if franchised, they are really creating disposable football players. We are going to use your ass up and then you are gone. Chances are it will move the NFL money deeper into the roster but guys are going to end up getting paid for a shorter period of time.

 

I don't think guys that really have the talent to play baseball are motivated to play football. I am more inclined to think that if a guy is on a dual path and chooses football, it is because he simply does not think he can make it through the multiple tiers of baseball and the tremendous number of guys trying to get to the ML. Whatever we might think of them, whatever I might think of them as people at some point in their careers the guys that make it to the ML are phenomenal baseball players, so much better than even the average superstar high school ballplayer that the two are separated by light years. The number of things that stop the average superstar high school ballplayer dead in his tracks are just too numerous to mention.

 

You can identify the guys you play against in high school that have a shot at making it to a major college football program. Frankly, if you can get there you have a shot at the NFL. A guy getting to minor league baseball has a greater chance of never getting to the big leagues. The process just culls out so many guys. So many of our US baseball players face real stiff competition from the Dominican kids, the Puerto Rican kids, the Mexican kids....they are coming from everywhere these days.

 

You stand a much better chance at knowing your competition for major college and then NFL spots.

[Station 13]

Bogaerts needs time in the minors. His plate discipline leaves something to be desired currently.

 

he's at least another year away. What brought Bogaerts up? The guy just turn 20 last October.

[Dojji]

he's at least another year away. What brought Bogaerts up? The guy just turn 20 last October.

 

What brought him up was the fact that he was just optioned to the minors today.

 

I'd give Bogaerts another 2 years. But then, I'd give Bradley one more. I'm all for caution when it comes to promoting prospects unless you're sure he's a starter right now because of the real damage jumping the gun can do.

[reYoukilis]

I want to pose a general question out there to the posters on here who believe that the Red Sox will not make the playoffs.

 

How does having an elite defense behind the pitching staff affect your stance on the team? Replacing Gomes and Drew with Bradley and Iggy could be a big boost to the defense, albeit a hit to the offense in places where most of us assumed there would be holes already.

I wonder if this was their plan all along and its just happening sooner than they thought. I dont think Gomes was ever meant to be a fulltimer considering the vast gap in numbers between LHP and RHP. Sure Nava would play the other side of the plate but it makes sense that they were thinking Bradley the whole time.

[Dojji]

I'm sure it was their long term plan, but yes, it's a pretty safe guess that the progress of Bradley in particular caught them by surprise, and Iglesias' big spring can't have been forseen.

 

That said it's still down to these players to sustain their progress once the real season starts. If they fall back to the level one might normally expect of people of their age and experience level, "he had a great spring" isn't going to sound like a very good excuse.

[Station 13]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/mlb/news/20130325/mlb-preview-staff-predictions/?sct=hp_t12_a2&eref=sihp

 

Nice photo of Victorino. Exactly how I feel about this signing.

[Station 13]

What brought him up was the fact that he was just optioned to the minors today.

 

I'd give Bogaerts another 2 years. But then, I'd give Bradley one more. I'm all for caution when it comes to promoting prospects unless you're sure he's a starter right now because of the real damage jumping the gun can do.

 

I don't think Bradley will break camp. But I don't think we'll wait a year to see him. I think he head to AAA for a few weeks and polish up on hitting breaking balls. At his age, he's still not seen the more advanced breaking pitches and yet to play above AA. From what I seen, he could use the time to learn hitting offspeed pitches.

[jung]

Funny 13, I had noticed the same thing but really did not think I had even seen JBJ getting that many breaking balls to look at to make a judgement. However he has ola ola'ed the few that I have seen him get.

 

Did not get to see today's game at all. So I don't know what he got to swing at today. As I have mentioned before I think the whole ST performance thing is so overblown its ridiculous. We have had so many guys have big springs and then disappear. Lavarnway a couple years ago hit over .400 in spring ball...Mike Cameron hit over .400 in ST his one year. Even D-mac hit over .400 one ST....D-mac for crying out loud! The only dif is that the Boston Media machine did not get all wound up behind them. Talk about an overblown media creation.

 

Every time I hear one of these media pukes tell me how ready JBJ is or simply ignore the fact that he has actually been pretty shaky in LF so far, I want to throw something at the radio or TV....based on what.... a hitting performance in Spring Baseball...you have got to be kidding me.

 

I know some of us want to consider the injury situation starting the season but that simply should not even be relevant. It should not even be part of the discussion unless you want to talk about Kalish. His is the only injury even remotely relevant to JBJ.

 

Oh the hell with it. I feel like I am pissing into the wind.

[SoxFanForsyth]

Smacked the hell out of a 2 strike breaking ball from a LHP yesterday for triple off the RF wall.

[jung]

Can't believe I missed the Monday game. Have tried to catch all of them. Who pitched for the Sox? Any news there?

[BSN07]

From what I can see Bradley can get over extended on inside pitches and has whaffed at some breaking pitches, but also hit a few hard. I'm guessing first adjustment SP make to him is to really pitch him inside until he proves he can keeps his hands in and get the barrel on the ball.

 

idk if he starts the season in Boston or they wait two weeks, all I know is we probably don't have to wait too long for his arrival.

 

I also agree the National media is going to be all over him if he comes and catches fire. He literally the perfect seg way to any discussion about Robinson anniversary and what not.

[SoxSport]

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/2013/03/25/red-sox-have-some-decision-make/XNETjOUkNyfduqNtnZo2tM/story.html

 

Cafardo talks about the classic conflict between the GM and the manager about the roster. Says the manager should have final say on who makes the team, but the trend is the FO determines who plays on the field. There are exceptions (Showalter and other experienced managers); it's a traditional conflict mentioned in the Moneyball book. Last year, Valentine clearly had little or no say on players (Lucchino's concession to the FO?); this year, I suspect it's a different situation.

 

He also mentions some of the decisions they have to make--aside from Bradley and Iggy--which are pretty much settled off their performances and the Ortiz/Drew injuries. First base backup will be tough--Overbay made a great diving stop yesterday at 1B-- a reminder of the value of his defense. Plus he might wind up in pinstripes if they let him go. He has always hurt the Red Sox. I think it's time the FO placed more value on the defense to support the pitching. Defense has fallen into their lap with the unexpected showings of Bradley and Iggy, and now they should take advantage of it.

[SoxSport]

Smacked the hell out of a 2 strike breaking ball from a LHP yesterday for triple off the RF wall.

 

The kid is unreal.

 

But beware: last year, Brandon Belt tore up ST, made the Giants, and then came down to earth in April. This year, he's torn up ST again. It's anybody's guess which direction he will take.

[SoxSport]

I also agree the National media is going to be all over him if he comes and catches fire. He literally the perfect seg way to any discussion about Robinson anniversary and what not.

 

The kid would have made it no matter what, but the African American angle is no doubt a factor in terms of timing. Plus the need to sell tickets.

[BSN07]

The kid would have made it no matter what, but the African American angle is no doubt a factor in terms of timing. Plus the need to sell tickets.

 

I don't think it has a major effect on when he arrives, just that the media is probably chomping at the bit for the possible story.

[SoxFanForsyth]

I really think, against RHP, the Sox should hit Bradley 2nd. He grinds out AB's, can hit the ball behind the runner, and hits well deep into the count, including w two strikes. Not to mention he takes heaps of walks makes excellent contact, which equates to few strike outs. He also hits left handed pitchers well, too, so he won't be an issue going L L at the top with him and Ells.

 

Ellsbury

Bradley

Pedroia

Napoli

Middlebrooks

Salty

Gomes

Victorino

Iglesias

 

That lineup will score quite a few runs. Not 2004 Red Sox runs, but quite a few regardless. Ells Bradley and Pedroia can really set the table for Nap and Middlebrooks, who should have the opportunity to drive in a good number of runs.

 

And as a side note, the defense this team is going to be rolling out on Opening Day is going to be outrageous.

[User Name]

Temper your expectations. What you've seen of Bradley in ST doesn't necessarily equate to what he'll do in the regular season.

 

The kid's the real deal, however, and i can't wait to see him play alongside Xander in the near future.

[SoxFanForsyth]

From what I can see Bradley can get over extended on inside pitches and has whaffed at some breaking pitches, but also hit a few hard. I'm guessing first adjustment SP make to him is to really pitch him inside until he proves he can keeps his hands in and get the barrel on the ball.

 

idk if he starts the season in Boston or they wait two weeks, all I know is we probably don't have to wait too long for his arrival.

 

I also agree the National media is going to be all over him if he comes and catches fire. He literally the perfect seg way to any discussion about Robinson anniversary and what not.

 

I think he's been working hard on keeping his hands inside the baseball on inside pitches.

 

Against Cliff Lee in his 2nd AB, Lee tried to pound him in on a fastball (first or second pitch, I believe), and he got inside of it and drove a line drive to dead center for a sac fly. Then Pedro Strop, yesterday, had 2 strikes on Bradley, buried a couple off speed pitches that Bradley was able to lay off, and then tried to get in on him. Bradley shortened his swing, stayed in side, and hit a hard ground ball up the middle for a 2 RBI single.

 

The thing about this kid that makes him so special is that he is able to adapt extremely quickly. He's still going to be vulnerable to the slider away from LHP, which is a filthy pitch to any LHH, but you're going to see him K on those. But overall, he's a very selective hitter who learns quickly and has elite plate discipline.

 

That's my read on him, anyway.

[BSN07]

I think he's been working hard on keeping his hands inside the baseball on inside pitches.

 

Against Cliff Lee in his 2nd AB, Lee tried to pound him in on a fastball (first or second pitch, I believe), and he got inside of it and drove a line drive to dead center for a sac fly. Then Pedro Strop, yesterday, had 2 strikes on Bradley, buried a couple off speed pitches that Bradley was able to lay off, and then tried to get in on him. Bradley shortened his swing, stayed in side, and hit a hard ground ball up the middle for a 2 RBI single.

 

The thing about this kid that makes him so special is that he is able to adapt extremely quickly. He's still going to be vulnerable to the slider away from LHP, which is a filthy pitch to any LHH, but you're going to see him K on those. But overall, he's a very selective hitter who learns quickly and has elite plate discipline.

 

That's my read on him, anyway.

 

He's making improvements, but from what I've seen that is his weaker part in hitting right now.

[jacksonianmarch]

Guys, it's ST. Remember that. He has definitely been impressive, but making long term projections based on how a kid plays in ST is pretty difficult to say the least. They should start the yr with him in LF. Ortiz is out, Gomes is a glorified DH and Nava isnt a long term answer. Nobody truly knows how long Ortiz will be out for. He had a good BP session, congrats. That hasnt been his issue. It's been running, something he hasnt been able to do. You might have a long term need in the OF should he be out awhile and you'll definitely have one when Ells walks in the offseason. Once Ortiz proves healthy, I send the kid down, no matter how well he is playing and delay his clock by one yr

[SoxFanForsyth]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not projecting him to be a .330 hitter this year. All I'm saying is that I've seen him make solid adjustments. And the fact that he's had success the past few games against some very good pitchers (Lee, Strop) who are at the end of ST and no longer working on certain pitches, but are getting into game situations where they're trying to get out, it's encouraging.

 

At the very least, he should provide elite defense in LF and help to keep us above water until Ortiz returns. Who knows when that will be, but Bradley will almost certainly return to Pawtucket when he gets back.

[Palodios]

Red Sox release Overbay. How did he do this spring? I figured his numbers against righties made him a better fit than Carp.

[Dojji]

.668 OPS. Not gonna get it done at CIF.

 

That said none of the other conventional options are exactly blowing us away either. Nava's probably the best of the bunch and he's at .745, albeit with a .415 OBP (yeah he's hit for that little power)

 

Nava has lit .310 with a .333 slugging. Only one of his 13 hits was not a single. Until I saw that I wasn't convinced it was actually possible. That said, his batting discipline has continued strong and that's worth a lot in the right role.

[SoxSport]

I see they cut Overbay rather than pay him $100K. Says he hasn't had a good ST, though he made a nice diving stop yesterday. Looked a bit overweight, though. He's old enough for the Yankee Retirement Home.

[Dojji]

you know, if Iglesias cracks the roster, and Drew recovers quickly, that might not leave a ton of room for Ciriaco. And we do have Brock Holt in the wings. Should we be thinking trade?

[rjortiz]

What could we get for Ciriaco?

[Palodios]

.668 OPS. Not gonna get it done at CIF.

 

That said none of the other conventional options are exactly blowing us away either. Nava's probably the best of the bunch and he's at .745, albeit with a .415 OBP (yeah he's hit for that little power)

 

Nava has lit .310 with a .333 slugging. Only one of his 13 hits was not a single. Until I saw that I wasn't convinced it was actually possible. That said, his batting discipline has continued strong and that's worth a lot in the right role.

 

I'm probably one of the few people around here who like Nava as much as you do. That being said, if the choice is between Carp and Overbay, I'm not entirely sure Carp is the best choice.

[Palodios]

What could we get for Ciriaco?

 

Considering that he was a player that the Pirates didn't want... probably not too much:lol:

[Dojji]

Considering he's a MIF who hit .293 in a backup role while playing solidly at short, more than you might think. That combination is getting rarer.

 

To put it in perspective, Ciriaco's numbers last year kind of echo the performance we got from Orlando Cabrera after the trade. Not quite as much power though.

 

I could see a team with a hole at a MIF position giving us something for Ciriaco. Not a king's ransom, but maybe an RP or a bottom of the rotation prospect.

[BSN07]

Considering he's a MIF who hit .293 in a backup role while playing solidly at short, more than you might think. That combination is getting rarer.

 

To put it in perspective, Ciriaco's numbers last year kind of echo the performance we got from Orlando Cabrera after the trade. Not quite as much power though.

 

I could see a team with a hole at a MIF position giving us something for Ciriaco. Not a king's ransom, but maybe an RP or a bottom of the rotation prospect.

 

I wouldn't be surprised to see St. Louis show some interest. I wouldn't give him away for anything though. Does he have options left?

 

Oh and I fully expect the Yanks to sign Overbay.