Lugo benched?

[jacksonianmarch]

why would the rangers move Vizquel though. He's a supersub on a team that is in 1st.

[jacksonianmarch]

Another issue with Hardy. Acquiring him now keeps him away from the Yankees. He is definitely a target for us when he gets to FA after 2010. Just so happens to be when Jeter's contract expires.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

The Red Sox want to be above league average at every position and right now we are talking David Ortiz and SS being below league average. I don't expect the SS situation to climb based on who we have and it's a lot of pressure for Jed Lowrie to come in, stay healthy, and produce respectable numbers.

 

Based on his career batting stats I can assume JJ Hardy is a above average SS in the league especially if you place him in Fenway park for half his games and covered by the Red Sox lineup. Can't say I know a lot about his defense. I would like to see another quality left handed hitter in the Red Sox lineup but thats not essential.

 

So I could see Hardy being the answer plus Lowrie surviving the rest of the season if he is the utility bench player. What does JJ Hardy cost? Michael Bowden? more or less...

[Redguitar985]

The Red Sox want to be above league average at every position and right now we are talking David Ortiz and SS being below league average. I don't expect the SS situation to climb based on who we have and it's a lot of pressure for Jed Lowrie to come in, stay healthy, and produce respectable numbers.

 

Based on his career batting stats I can assume JJ Hardy is a above average SS in the league especially if you place him in Fenway park for half his games and covered by the Red Sox lineup. Can't say I know a lot about his defense. I would like to see another quality left handed hitter in the Red Sox lineup but thats not essential.

 

So I could see Hardy being the answer plus Lowrie surviving the rest of the season if he is the utility bench player. What does JJ Hardy cost? Michael Bowden? more or less...

 

His defense isn't bad either. He only has 3 errors so far with a .978 fielding percentage. I would think at least Michael Bowden, probably more.

[Dipre]

If the Brewers want Michael Bowden straight-up for JJ Hardy, it'll be a happy day in Red Sox land.

 

However, there's no way that trade happens.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

If the Brewers want Michael Bowden straight-up for JJ Hardy, it'll be a happy day in Red Sox land.

 

However, there's no way that trade happens.

 

Do the Brewers have someone waiting in the wings behind JJ Hardy? Otherwise I'm not sure why they would be interested in a trade discussion or how this rumor came to be. I can see Jason Donald in Philadelphia since Rollins isn't going anywhere.

[Dipre]

Do the Brewers have someone waiting in the wings behind JJ Hardy? Otherwise I'm not sure why they would be interested in a trade discussion or how this rumor came to be. I can see Jason Donald in Philadelphia since Rollins isn't going anywhere.

 

Sir.

 

The Brewers have Alcides Escobar, who is their overall no.2 prospect, and a top 30 prospect according to the BA rankings.

 

He's about 2,400 times the prospect Jason Donald is.

[Dojji]

If the Brewers want Michael Bowden straight-up for JJ Hardy, it'll be a happy day in Red Sox land.

 

However, there's no way that trade happens.

 

Right, there needs to be something else alongside Bowden. Something that fills another Milwaukee need. That's not taking a thing away from Bowden, since I believe that when all is said and done that Bowden may well be the best of he, Buchholz and Masterson, but power-hitting SS are just that rare.

 

Michael Bowden and Manny Delcarmen for JJ Hardy and a Brewers top prospect perhaps? That might leave us too dependent on Saito staying healthy all year though. A power hitting SS is the only kind of player I pay a proven RH power reliever like MDC for however.

[Cocos Disciples]

No thanks on Bowden/MDC. But, I don't like Hardy as much as you guys.

[ORS]

No thanks on Bowden/MDC. But' date=' I don't like Hardy as much as you guys.[/quote']

This is about where I fall on the issue. I think he's severly overrated. Don't get me wrong, the 20+ HR power is nice from your SS, but it's the only thing above average about him, offensively. He doesn't have particularly good plate discipline, he's not special when it comes to hitting for average, and he doesn't have speed. Plus, his performance is very streak heavy. He'll have 150 PA stretches where he hits like a full on BALCO Barry Bonds, but then he mixes in two 200 PA stretches where he's the '08 incarnation of Jason Varitek. Personally, I think this team is laden with streaky guys, which is evident by periods of 10+ run games and periods of 4- run games. How would his current .668 OPS be helping this team today?

 

Nick Green is outperforming him right now. Sure, that will change, but not by enough of a margin that will eclipse the improvement I think is available in a healthy Jed Lowrie, at least not at the cost of Michael Bowden (by himself, throwing one of the better RP's on this team as incentive is outright silly).

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Right' date=' there needs to be something else alongside Bowden. Something that fills another Milwaukee need. That's not taking a thing away from Bowden, since I believe that when all is said and done that Bowden may well be the best of he, Buchholz and Masterson, but power-hitting SS are just that rare.[/quote']

 

Love it. Plug in not one, but two dire needs for the Brewers, coming out of our system, and get a this-season solution at shortstop while Lowrie heals. Beautiful.

 

Everyone f***ing says how much of a luxury it is to have a power hitting SS (if that's what you want to call the almost 700 OPS that J.J. Hardy proudly calls his). Its just that, a luxury. Defense is our main issue there. Defense is what's hurting us. Defense is what we need to prioritize. How is this so hard to understand?

 

Michael Bowden and Manny Delcarmen for JJ Hardy and a Brewers top prospect perhaps?

 

Fail.

[Dipre]

To be honest, it's not that i'm overvaluing Hardy, it's that i think you guys are overvaluing Bowden.

 

But hey, concensus wins, i suppose.

[ORS]

I have no problem entertaining the idea of trading Bowden. I just want them to maximize the return. Hardy does not represent that, IMO. How much of an upgrade is he over Lowrie (when Lowrie is healthy)? Given his proven issues getting on base consistently, I'd put that difference at marginal. With continued success in Pawtucket, Bowden could enter elite status as a pitching prospect. You don't trade those guys for marginal improvement.

[BoSox21]

I have no problem entertaining the idea of trading Bowden. I just want them to maximize the return. Hardy does not represent that' date=' IMO. How much of an upgrade is he over Lowrie (when Lowrie is healthy)? Given his proven issues getting on base consistently, I'd put that difference at marginal. With continued success in Pawtucket, Bowden could enter elite status as a pitching prospect. You don't trade those guys for marginal improvement.[/quote']

 

this.

[Spudboy]

To be honest, it's not that i'm overvaluing Hardy, it's that i think you guys are overvaluing Bowden.

 

But hey, concensus wins, i suppose.

 

I'm not sure anyone here is truly qualified to put an accurate value on Bowden. He is a promising young ML pitcher. He has no MLB track record to speak of. It's nice to project MLB performance but ultimately one is just speculating. Having said that, good young pitching is a valuable commodity. A MLB shortstop with mediocre numbers is not. Even if he has some "pop". I'm with ORS on this one. There is no need to panic now. Let's see what Lowrey can do when he comes back. From what I saw of him last year, he had the makings of a very solid hitter and was more than average at short. Once again, I have no numbers to back what I say. Just my impressions from watching him. He can play 3rd and 2nd in case the need arises, and is cheap.

[SCM33]

Sox talking to A's about O-Cab:

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/messages/chrono/15443550

[redsoxrules]

If O'Cab can do any better than he is so far this season he's worse than Lugo and Green

 

PASS

 

I dont want a SS sporting a 588 OPS

[Spudboy]

Sean McAdam said in today's Herald that this would not happen. It's been 5 years since he played here.

His offensive numbers are not what they were back then. I'm not sure why he was jettisoned by the Sox. I liked him when he was here. Lowrey is the Sox SS.

[BoSox21]

There were always whispers of some attitude problems with him

[SCM33]

There were always whispers of some attitude problems with him

 

Yeah, banging Keith Foulkes wife was a pretty good attitude problem.

[Cocos Disciples]

Yeah' date=' banging Keith Foulkes wife was a pretty good attitude problem.[/quote']

 

Orlando Cabrera is the fourth Wife Foulker?

[Dipre]

Orlando Cabrera is the fourth Wife Foulker?

 

He's the original Wife Foulker apparently.

[Spudboy]

Orlando Cabrera is the fourth Wife Foulker?

 

Ha ha ha ha!

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

He's the original Wife Foulker apparently.

Go find the 2005 July 4th game against Texas thread.

[Dipre]

Go find the 2005 July 4th game against Texas thread.

 

I lost about 30 minutes of my life reading that thread.

 

And it begun to raise my suspicions that YOTN is, in fact, insane.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

I lost about 30 minutes of my life reading that thread.

 

And it begun to raise my suspicions that YOTN is, in fact, insane.

He is insane.

 

 

He banned me once.

[Cocos Disciples]

WOW I totally forgot about that.

 

EDIT: The banning, I mean.

[TheKilo]

4 hits tonight

[SCM33]

4 hits tonight

 

He is so frustrating when he had performances like this, because you know hes capable of hitting .270 with a .340 OB and the ability to steal 30+. While its encouraging, I will be disappointed if they option out Green bc of Lugos contract.

 

BTW...what happened to his speed?

[Lived2seeit]

... I will be disappointed if they option out Green bc of Lugos contract.

 

Agreed. Green isn't winning an all star ballot or anything, but he's performing well enough to start on this team. If platooning-in Lugo/Lowrie every now and then helps to work them in, then great. But why just GIVE Lugo back his position because of his ubsurd contract (2nd coming of Renteria?). I'd rather have a gamer like Green/Lowrie. Sorry if that turned into a rant, but Lugo makes me drink.