What is wrong with Wily Mo?

[jacksonianmarch]

I truly think there is something seriously wrong with Wily Mo Pena. Hear me out. The Yankees signed him initially and moved him for Drew Henson. He goes to CIN and hits 26 HRs in 300ABs. He then spends the next season backing up in the OF while still hitting 19 HRs in 300 abs yet he sits behind Kearns and this past yr he hit 11 HRs in 276 ABs. If you project that out a 550AB season, that is a little over 30HRs a season. He is going to be 25 in January. Why are the sox reluctant to hand him the RF spot? Why are they about to throw 5 yrs 55 mil at JD Drew when they have a guy who hit over .300 last yr and has averaged 30HRs for every 500ABs. What is wrong with this guy? Why has every team he has been on tried to get rid of him? Now he is being dangled for a closer or for a set-up man mind you.

[EvilDonut]

I think Most teams got rid of him only because of the return they could get on him. I mean the Yankees traded him because their strategy was sell young, buy the established. Its because hes so young is why hes being traded. You can get good players if hes in a deal because of his potential.

 

Personally i think going after Drew is a bad Option, I know ORS and some others disagree but i think he should be given the chance.

[Cocos Disciples]

There's nothing wrong with him...but you can't just convert 276 at bats to 550 and assume it'll be the same stuff in a full season.

[jacksonianmarch]

There's nothing wrong with him...but you can't just convert 276 at bats to 550 and assume it'll be the same stuff in a full season.

 

I am adding his entire career together and projecting out to 550ABs. Still, you would think that one of the 3 teams he was on would hang onto his raw power.

[Cocos Disciples]

But still theres a difference between speading the ABs around and having him play every day in the long grind of a season...if thats even what you're talking about.

[example1]

I truly think there is something seriously wrong with Wily Mo Pena. Hear me out. The Yankees signed him initially and moved him for Drew Henson. He goes to CIN and hits 26 HRs in 300ABs. He then spends the next season backing up in the OF while still hitting 19 HRs in 300 abs yet he sits behind Kearns and this past yr he hit 11 HRs in 276 ABs. If you project that out a 550AB season' date=' that is a little over 30HRs a season. He is going to be 25 in January. Why are the sox reluctant to hand him the RF spot? Why are they about to throw 5 yrs 55 mil at JD Drew when they have a guy who hit over .300 last yr and has averaged 30HRs for every 500ABs. What is wrong with this guy? Why has every team he has been on tried to get rid of him? Now he is being dangled for a closer or for a set-up man mind you.[/quote']

 

I thought this was going to be a horribly depressed, pessimistic thread at first. By the end I see your point and appreciate the question.

 

I think there are a few things "wrong" with Wily Mo Pena.

 

1) He's too young for people to know what he's capable of yet, he's still unknown

 

2) He's an enormous RH hitting power hitter who doesn't play 1B and who has only average fielding skills

 

3) He strikes out a lot and people overreact to that

 

4) He has played on two teams that had decent OF depth. You better believe that if the Sox were able to move Manny Wily Mo would be playing LF on a daily basis. The Sox had Ramirez, Crisp and Nixon as their OF last year, and any time any of those guys couldn't play he did.

 

There's nothing wrong with him. He's got a lot of potential and most people still believe he has a lot of potential. That means that he has a lot of trading potential as well. If he could be packaged in a deal for Lidge--say--I'd be willing to give it a shot.

[jsinger121]

There is nothing wrong with him.....The Yankees foolishly signed him to a major league contract which cost him valuable development in the minor leagues. He was traded by the Yankees because they couldn't waste a bench spot developing his talent. Cincinnati traded him because they needed pitching. If this guy wasn't foolishly signed to a major league contract then his development would not have been hampered like it has been.

[jacksonianmarch]

I guess my question now is, since the sox have him and they happen to have an open RF slot, why not save the 11mil a season it would take to land Drew and hand the spot to the very affordable Pena?

[example1]

Because JD Drew gets on base over 40% of the time and has the potential to knock in over 100 runs. Also, the FO very well could have plans to move Manny, in which case we need to replace his crappy fielding with... well, .... crappy fielding.

[Beckett95]

I wish WMP could play 1B. He did a little in the Dominacan but not much over here.

 

You could then sign Drew. Move Youk to third and trade Lowell for some pitching.

 

3. Ortiz

4. Manny

5. Drew

6. WMP

 

would be a solid middle of the order

[mosox]

But still theres a difference between speading the ABs around and having him play every day in the long grind of a season...if thats even what you're talking about.

 

I agree. Willie Mo is not an everyday player and like other teams, the Sox now realize this.

[RedSoxRooter]

Part of the blame has to fall on Wily even though I agree he hasn't been given a shot at a full season. I honestly see him with 40+ hr power, but he does lack defensively even worse than Manny. He strikes out way too much for a guy who has percieved MLB superstar tallent.

 

That said, all he needs is one year to pull it all together and put up a 2003 version of Ortiz and he's in for a long shot. He's got to get past whatever is causing the holes in his swing and just put up good enough numbers so that he actually wins a spot in the lineup.

 

I swear I know the answer to his problems... He swings way too heavy a bat. The thing's HUGE. It's a redwood. Lighten up and get a Kevin Millar style bat and the dude would rake everything.

[HeadOfSoxNation]

Part of the blame has to fall on Wily even though I agree he hasn't been given a shot at a full season.

 

 

The problem, in my opinion, with Wily Mo is that he feels like he's gotta hit a homerun every single time he's up in order to win himself some playing time. And also, he's not facing pitchers even REMOTELY as much as other guys in the everyday lineup are...and pitchers always have an advantage when the hitters aren't as comfortable with their stuff. Wily has gotta get more looks at guys on an everyday basis and realize that there's guys around him who will hit him in, and he doesn't have to hit 4 HRs in every game to be in the lineup every day. He knows that everyone expects him to ABSOLUTLEY rake and that's why teams go after him...so on the 1 in 3 or 1 in 4 or 1 in 5 days that he plays, he goes up there, and swings for the fences.

 

The strikeouts will drop drastically when Wily figures out how to get ahead in the count. He's always in counts that are farrr in the pitchers favor. Once he can stop this, he'll be a far better hitter. But, in all honesty, if the strikeouts DON'T drop, I reaaaaaaaaaaaally don't care as long as his power numbers are there. Adam Dunn struck out a hair under 200 times last year...but he hit 40 bombs. Are you guys going to turn that kind of production down? No wayyyyyy! Sure, I'd rather a guy who will hit .310 and put up those power numbers, but not every player is cut out to do that. Loretta is a guy that'll put up those average numbers and people (some...ahem jsinger ahem) crucified him last year and couldn't get him off this team fast enough. Everyone's gotta make up their mind and be realistic about WMP...he's not going to be the .310 guy ever...but he'll rake with the best of him once you get him some everyday experience.

[seabeachfred]

No one brought up the real reasons Wily Mo is not the answer to our right field position. HE IS A ROTTEN OUTFIELDER---PERIOD!!!!!! He cannot judge a fly ball well and cannot catch the ball consistently. He has shown no improvement in those skiills since he was signed. He certainly cannot play RF at Fenway. He has shown that beyond a shadow of a doubt like in the Red Sox home opener when he misplayed a routine fly ball off his glove for a homer. He certainly cannot play LF at YS either. He misplayed three or four balls in one game there this past September which cost the Sox the game and prevented us from paying the Yankees back with a sweep on our own on their home turf. He also has proven he is a poor hitting with men on base, especially in the clutch. In that DH on Sept 16th he left 12 runner on base that day with five strikeouts. Drew can hit better, field better, run better and throw better. He also has over a 40% OBA. That's why the Red Sox are reportedly after him. Pena should go to an AL team and be a DH on a team that is rebuilding where he can get a full chance to develop his talents without the glare of a pennant race.

[BSN07]

There is some positives and negatives to WMP, i'll try to list them here.

 

Positive

1.Young/inexpensive

2.Enourmous Power

3. Loves the game and wants to play.

4.Being around Manny and Papi should elevate him to the next level.

5.His upside is tremendous, but really unknown

 

 

Negative

1.The only pos. open on the sox is RF(that he could play), and RF at Fenway is one of the hardest in the league.

2.He K's alot because he does think he has to hit HR to keep his spot.

3.His defense is spotty at best.

 

With all that said, Manny's D was terrible when he got to BOS, but honestly over the last few years it has improved dramatically. Yes I know every once and awhile he has a Manny play but thats ok. Manny plays the wall as good as anyone has for a very long time. So teaching someone how to play D in Bos. is possible, cause if Manny can do it anyone should beable to. RF I think is just gonna be to difficult for Pena tho. I wouldn't mind seeing him at 1B. Give him all winter to practice and it might turn out good. We had Mo Vaughn at 1B for how long? Pretty much same build with WMP having better physical skills. Then Like Becket95 said, move Youk to 3rd and trade lowell for bullpen help. He might be good at first, I mean giambi,Thomas( in his prime), Vaughn,Howard, are/where not the greatest fielders and they have done well at 1st. We can always get a good glove for 1st base, have him on the bench to come in in the late innings like Dougy boy did in the 04'season. I do believe he just needs a full season and daily at bats to get over his swing for the fences approach. But the FO might not see it this way and maybe 1st base is out of the question, in that case I see him going to a team that is gonna have him play the outfield everyday.

[jacksonianmarch]

I guess my take is, if you have 11mil to spare, throw it into pitching. The sox O, although no longer an elite offense, can still be dominant. The pitching is what is so shaky and getting one starter is not going to fix that.

[ORS]

What's wrong with WMP? He doesn't "see" the ball well. Both is offensive and defensive problems center around poor judgement of the trajectory of the ball. On offense, his pitch recognition is s***. He doesn't recognize ball from strike very well, nor does he recognize what type of pitch it is very well. On defense, he looks like a monkey f***ing a football because he can't judge where the ball will end up.

 

IMO, it's not a hand eye coordination thing. When his judgment is on he squares the ball up really well with the bat (highest BABIP on the team), and when he makes a good read he makes some decent plays in the field. The problem is, he doesn't make a good judgement as often as he needs to.

[Bosoxwest]

I would disagree that Wily Mo tried to put everything out last year, at least all the time. He hit over .300, 40+ points higher than his previous average, and his slugging and HR/9 were his lowest. I think he made strides in going with the pitch, and in general I think offensively he will become a powerhouse if given the chance. The Ks will always be an issue, but that usually comes with power. If his eye improves that is no issue.

 

His defense is atrocious in right, but could probably improve. However, I don't see them taking a chance on that, given the Drew rumors. I don't really see Manny being moved, but I suppose that is a possible scenario. If so, then WMP could no doubt learn to be passable in left, although with the cannon on his right shoulder it's sort of a waste. First base is probably a little too cerebral for the Super Genius, though.

[Texas_Red_Sox_Fan]

Willy's only problem is his playing time. He hits for power and can be a 30+ HR but he needs to be healthy and available. I agree he should be the starter in Rf this year I believe he will do well he proved last year that he could carry the Sox in a game when nobody else was hitting. Keep him. His good years are about to come.

[v2freak]

Reportedly, he has no work ethic. I can't confirm/deny this

[castigs850]

i would keep willy mo im interested in seeing what he can do over a full season but i also see the point that we cant take the risk of both him and coco having down years again especially if we put pedroia in the lineup, its just too many ?'s that could really hurt us manny and ortiz cant do it all. and with aramis ramirez now signed im guessing its most likely lowell will be back at 3rd next year is there any other possibilities? just curious i havent really heard much about that

[kreinbihl34]

Reportedly' date=' he has no work ethic. I can't confirm/deny this[/quote']

 

That's why when he was with the Reds all they talked about was how he was so big, muscle wise, he should play football. Also Griffey only said negative things when the trade went down.

[a700hitter]

Red Sox coaches did have a talk with him about his work or lack thereof regarding his fielding.

[Mr Crunchy]

his plate discipline is simply awful,could be the worst ever

his K rate if given 600abs would break rob deeres record

theres no overreacting to a guy who is going to K 200 times a year

 

sure hes 25

and as the man who originated this thread indicated

why wouldnt we give him the chance to earn the job instead of dropping 40M on jd drew who tends to take months at a time off during the season

 

ive seen them both

pena is easier to get out but is still a better hitter than drew

drew is a better fielder and has better plate discipline

[jacksonianmarch]

Reportedly' date=' he has no work ethic. I can't confirm/deny this[/quote']

 

spin cycle has started again. WMP's time in boston sounds doomed.

[corngordon]

Unfortunately, he is a defensive liability. Letting balls clang around the RF corner in Fenway is like giving up runs for nothing. He had a decent stretch in CF, but had some major issues in LF (in Yankee Stadium no less).

 

I'm still a Trot fan, and wish they'd sign him plus a solid fourth outfielder. Of course we all know how Jay Petyon worked out....

[seabeachfred]

Unfortunately, he is a defensive liability. Letting balls clang around the RF corner in Fenway is like giving up runs for nothing. He had a decent stretch in CF, but had some major issues in LF (in Yankee Stadium no less).

 

I'm still a Trot fan, and wish they'd sign him plus a solid fourth outfielder. Of course we all know how Jay Petyon worked out....

 

Well, if we dither any longer with J.D. Drew we might find ourselves with Trot again, but, believe me, he will not agree to be a 4th OF after playing regularly for so many years. Remember two things. He is only 32 and, secondly, Wily Mo Pena cannot play RF at Fenway worth a damn. Of course, all this could be moot if we would just sign J.D. and be done with it. I have to admit, I am in a minority here and on other boards with Drew, but I saw this guy all last season and he fits the Red Sox like a glove and I also believe he is ready to have some real big seasons. We need to sign this guy to put this topic to rest once and for all. :D :D

[Texas_Red_Sox_Fan]

I agree with u seabeachfred and we have not agreed on much but....JD hits well to RF if u see his hit chart u will see that he may have his finest season yet playing 81 games at Fenway.

[seabeachfred]

I agree with u seabeachfred and we have not agreed on much but....JD hits well to RF if u see his hit chart u will see that he may have his finest season yet playing 81 games at Fenway.

 

See, I knew we would agree on something sooner or later. I rarely have trouble with Texans; hell I have voted four times for Texans for President. Drew's signing, if ever it comes, means we have gotten our fifth hitter, improved our offense 25-30%, taken care of a key defensive position (at Fenway, RF is very important), and makes it possible for us to put either Pena, Crisp, Hinske, or Murphy up for trade for needed relief pitching, most likely Pena or Crisp since they have more value. But we must start acting quickly before he is off the table, too, and we are left with some of Epstein's typical leftovers. :) :)

[Mr Crunchy]

take into consideration that drew played in fan friendly st louis where they politely clap when you f*** up

and in los angeles

where the beautiful people arrive in the 3rd inning and leave in the 7th.

 

we drop 45M on him and he plays his usual 80 games??

he will be crucified beyond reproach

 

he had a couple of good years

he had a couple of mediocre years

considering he would cost a little less than what we refused to give to damon i have to wonder what is the mindset in yawkee way.