Blue Jays (Rodriguez) vs Red Sox (Criswell): 8/27/24, 7:10pm

[Brock Beauchamp]

[moonslav59]

We need Criswell to be the "stopper."

Yikes!

[Old Red]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:We need Criswell to be the "stopper."

Yikes!

No worries. Hill will be there to back him up.

[jgar658]

Watching the games is not much fun these days.  We have poor relievers.  I can live with average starters, but poor relievers will lose a ton of games.  It was obvious last year too.

 

How come we do not have over 100 MPH arms in the bullpen?  All other teams have them.  

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Go SOX!

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Let's see what Duran can do tonight.

[moonslav59]

Duran Da Man!

[moonslav59]

Yoshi-Da-Man!

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

The SOX OF defense has been the most consistently good thing about this team. 

[Maxbialystock]

We've already seen two terrific plays to get Jays runners trying to score.  When moonslav recites all those non-errors that cost runs--like failing to get a double play--he should also include the good plays, but of course he doesn't.  

This score, 3-1, Sox, would be tied but for those two superb plays.  The first was Duran to Rafaela to home and the second was Abreu, after a long run to catch a fly near the RF line, to home.  Both plays at home were close.

 

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

I started a game thread, but it must have been in the wrong location. It was under the Mike Grace thread. 

Slowly learning how to wander thru this place.

 

Btw, the SOX OF defense has been the only consistently good thing about this team.

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

3 minutes ago, Maxbialystock said:

We've already seen two terrific plays to get Jays runners trying to score.  When moonslav recites all those non-errors that cost runs--like failing to get a double play--he should also include the good plays, but of course he doesn't.  

This score, 3-1, Sox, would be tied but for those two superb plays.  The first was Duran to Rafaela to home and the second was Abreu, after a long run to catch a fly near the RF line, to home.  Both plays at home were close.

 

The SOX OF defense is a different country from the SOX infield defense.

[Maxbialystock]

Another thing.  I vehemently disagree with playing Rafaela in CF this season for the simple reason that he is our best SS--most range and best arm--and Duran is excellent in CF and in fact has the highest DWAR on the Sox.  Moving Rafaela to CF puts Duran in LF, where all that range is wasted, especially at Fenway.  Red Sox history is filled with leftfielders who were excellent hitters and below average fielders--the most prominent of whom was Ted Williams.  

In this game O'Neill, who has the worst DWAR of all the Sox outfielders, is in left field.  He just ran in and made a nice catch.  Not a great catch, but a nice one, and that's all the is usually needed in LF.  

[Maxbialystock]

7 minutes ago, SPLENDIDSPLINTER said:

The SOX OF defense is a different country from the SOX infield defense.

Agree, and I'm sure moonslav would too.  That said, Rafaela has made some nice infield plays, and of course tonight he made that great throw--as SS--home to nail a Jays runner.  Hamilton doesn't make that throw.  And the play originator, Duran, made a nice play on the double off the wall and throwing it right to Rafaela.  

Also, In the first month of the season Casas had a horrible DWAR in just a handful of games.  Since he's returned, he's looked terrific, especially on throws to 1b.  Hamilton and Gonzalez have been OK/decent at 2b and in fact have also made some good plays.  That said, moonslav's right that the infield has not been good on double plays, which are a godsend for every pitcher.  Rafaela is probably as much at fault as anyone else, and I blame that on the fact that he keeps bouncing back and forth between CF and SS.  Some of the better double plays are an art form and require lots and lots of practice.  Great defense is the poetry of baseball.  

Sox are up 6-1!!!!!!  rbi's by Duran, Hamilton Casas, Abreu, and 2 by Yoshida.

Speaking of whom, I am literally the only contributor on talksox who defended playing Yoshida--and gave 5 reasons why.  However, I didn't do it because I was smart, but only because it was logical.  One of the reasons I gave was the Cora was sending out there to hit.   Gotta trust Cora.  

Too bad moonslav missed that, Rafaela had to go in the hole to start that double play.  Heckuva play.  

 

 

 

[Maxbialystock]

9 more outs for the win.  

[moonslav59]

Bernardino has lost the magic he had at the end of last season and start to 2024.

[Maxbialystock]

28 minutes ago, SPLENDIDSPLINTER said:

I started a game thread, but it must have been in the wrong location. It was under the Mike Grace thread. 

Slowly learning how to wander thru this place.

 

Btw, the SOX OF defense has been the only consistently good thing about this team.

You better get your stuff together, and I mean now.  We need some wins.  The fact that you actually started somewhere in the twilight zone may be why the sox are up 6-2 now.  

[moonslav59]

30 minutes ago, Maxbialystock said:

We've already seen two terrific plays to get Jays runners trying to score.  When moonslav recites all those non-errors that cost runs--like failing to get a double play--he should also include the good plays, but of course he doesn't.  

This score, 3-1, Sox, would be tied but for those two superb plays.  The first was Duran to Rafaela to home and the second was Abreu, after a long run to catch a fly near the RF line, to home.  Both plays at home were close.

 

I'm not worried about our D. Our OF D has been superb, and I've mentioned it, often.

[moonslav59]

4 minutes ago, Maxbialystock said:

Agree, and I'm sure moonslav would too.  That said, Rafaela has made some nice infield plays, and of course tonight he made that great throw--as SS--home to nail a Jays runner.  Hamilton doesn't make that throw.  And the play originator, Duran, made a nice play on the double off the wall and throwing it right to Rafaela.  

Also, In the first month of the season Casas had a horrible DWAR in just a handful of games.  Since he's returned, he's looked terrific, especially on throws to 1b.  Hamilton and Gonzalez have been OK/decent at 2b and in fact have also made some good plays.  That said, moonslav's right that the infield has not been good on double plays, which are a godsend for every pitcher.  Rafaela is probably as much at fault as anyone else, and I blame that on the fact that he keeps bouncing back and forth between CF and SS.  Some of the better double plays are an art form and require lots and lots of practice.  Great defense is the poetry of baseball.  

Sox are up 6-1!!!!!!  rbi's by Duran, Hamilton Casas, Abreu, and 2 by Yoshida.

Speaking of whom, I am literally the only contributor on talksox who defended playing Yoshida--and gave 5 reasons why.  However, I didn't do it because I was smart, but only because it was logical.  One of the reasons I gave was the Cora was sending out there to hit.   Gotta trust Cora.  

Too bad moonslav missed that, Rafaela had to go in the hole to start that double play.  Heckuva play.  

 

 

 

Rafaela may not be a net plus on D at SS, but he's the best we got. We also have 4 other  OF'ers for 3 slots. I'm fine with Rafaela at SS, for this year.

[Maxbialystock]

Somebody cited a bunch of stats to prove Wong stinks behind the plate.  I hate that that stuff because I'm afraid he might be right.  And I don't like Jansen at all--and he's probably good at the stuff Wong isn't good at. 

Of course, I honestly don't care who's behind the plate as long as he is contributing to a win.  Tonight is sort of a bullpen game, and the Sox are leading 6-2 and Jansen, behind the plate, is hitless.  Fine with me.  

[Maxbialystock]

4 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I'm not worried about our D. Our OF D has been superb, and I've mentioned it, often.

My point is it's unfair to document errors--or even "nonerrors"--that contribute to losses and ignore good plays that contribute to wins.  

[Maxbialystock]

Just now, Maxbialystock said:

My point is it's unfair to document errors--or even "nonerrors"--that contribute to losses and ignore good plays that contribute to wins.  

It's also unfair to document errors/nonerrors that lead to losses and ignore the same by opposing teams who do in fact commit errors that now and then contribute to losses.  

[Maxbialystock]

That was a hard hit ball that Casas didn't catch, and I agree it was an error, which the scorer called.  

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, Maxbialystock said:

My point is it's unfair to document errors--or even "nonerrors"--that contribute to losses and ignore good plays that contribute to wins.  

I don't ignore them. You asked me to show where we lost 15+ games due in part to defense. I listed 15 games, then spoke of more that are not from official "Un Earned" runs.

I fully realize our D has made some very nice plays, but the net negative is huge, Max. HUGE!

Our OF D is solid. Our corner IF is about the worst in MLB. Wong is rated near the bottom. 2B and SS have been a disaster until Rafaela brought a little stability to SS. Valdez was awful and still has more innings at 2B by about 150. DHam, Romy & Reyes were not good. Sogard is not great. That's 5 positions of awful D or just plain bad.

It is what it is. It's not as important as pitching or batting, but that doesn't mean  being freakishly bad can't make a difference in 15 games. That's less than 10% of the games.

[moonslav59]

10 hours ago, Maxbialystock said:

It's also unfair to document errors/nonerrors that lead to losses and ignore the same by opposing teams who do in fact commit errors that now and then contribute to losses.  

Was it unfair to call the Sox defense the worst in MLB history?

(I never said that one, and they aren't even close to that.)

[mvp 78]

21 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

We need Criswell to be the "stopper."

Yikes!

Can't even go 4 innings. 

[moonslav59]

No, he couldn't, and he got rather luck (again) that only 1 run scored off him. 

I would not say he had a big role in "stopping" the slide, but he did not lose the game for us.

[Old Red]

14 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

No, he couldn't, and he got rather luck (again) that only 1 run scored off him. 

I would not say he had a big role in "stopping" the slide, but he did not lose the game for us.

Outside of Old Faithful (Hill) the Red Sox don’t have many other options then to keep using him. Chris Sale isn’t coming through that door.