Swihart DFA

[Sox75]

Aren't we missing the elephant in the room. It seems neither Vaz or Swi is capable of calling a game. The pitches are coming from the dugout?

[Hitch]

Too late!!

 

 

I’ve already placed you on the “Trade Betts” bus! In fact, I have you as the driver...

 

I'm already driving the 'Bring Back John Farrell' bus! A man can only take so much on!

[Bellhorn04]

Aren't we missing the elephant in the room. It seems neither Vaz or Swi is capable of calling a game. The pitches are coming from the dugout?

 

No, they're not coming from the dugout. This was confirmed when Cora criticized Swihart for not following the game plan in one of E-Rod's starts.

[jung]

No, they're not coming from the dugout. This was confirmed when Cora criticized Swihart for not following the game plan in one of E-Rod's starts.

 

Clearly the Sox Coaching staff and most particularly AC/DL plotted out ERod's 1st inning in his last game. Pretty obvious that he was instructed that he would only throw 4 seam FB's in that inning come hell or high water. Vaz would only put down 1 finger and ERod would only throw 4 seams. I have little doubt that the coaches left ERod and Vaz no choice, no wiggle room in that. That launched ERod into his best start of the season and pretty much the best start of the entire rotation to date in 2019.

 

Beyond what they are clearly doing with ERod, I don't think the calls are coming from the bench.

[jacksonianmarch]

If Erod has his fastball and is locating it, there is no reason for him to give another look the first time through the order barring a long at bat

[jung]

If Erod has his fastball and is locating it, there is no reason for him to give another look the first time through the order barring a long at bat

 

True....but neither ERod nor Vaz on their own are smart enough to figure that out....proven time and time again. Hence I cannot credit either one of them for how that 1st inning was plotted out.

 

Plus I don't think it was done specifically because anybody knew Erod would have a decent FB but to coerce confidence in a pitch from Erod who only has either no confidence in pitches or is neutral to them. "You are only going to throw 4 seams in the first inning Erod. SO THROW GOOD ONES!"

 

Left to his own devices, the glass is always half empty for Erod.

Edited April 17, 2019 by jung

[Fan_since_Boggs]

Wilson Ramos has a .780 OPS and was available for roughly the cost of Steve Pearce...

 

Good point.

[moonslav59]

I'm already driving the 'Bring Back John Farrell' bus! A man can only take so much on!

 

If he would accept the pitching coach job, I'd be all in!

[notin]

No, they're not coming from the dugout. This was confirmed when Cora criticized Swihart for not following the game plan in one of E-Rod's starts.

 

 

A moment that was likely instrumental in his DFA...

[jung]

Look folks, there is little sense in crying over the Swi DFA. Swi was NEVER going anywhere here. The organization does not believe in him. I actually have trouble understanding why the Sox drafted him in the first round and then did what they did with him. They have chucked this kid under the bus from day 1.

 

I do think Swi's hitting is overrated and his potential as a catcher is also overrated. But IMO, they took whatever this kid had and dropped it down a rathole. They can't help themselves with Swi. Any chance they ever had to throw this kid under the bus, they did it. They toss him in Fenway OF, the most physically dangerous OF in baseball across the three positions with predictable results. They have a disgusting start to this season. Their rotation can't pitch its way out of a paper bag save Price....SORT OF. What do they do?....They throw Swi under the bus after the ERod start with the "We did not stick to the plan" comment. Then as Sale's NY start comes up they DFA the kid to bring up Leon. How did that work out for us?

 

So to be honest, I am more concerned about the mentality that created this mess than I am about the fact of Swi because the Sox were NEVER going to do anything with Swi whether he is talented or not! Deal with it Sox fans. Let the kid at least try to have a career someplace where an entire organization is not spending excessive amounts of gray matter trying to throw him under the bus.

 

Final insult to injury, Swi gets to play the scapegoat for a team that can't pitch, can't hit, and can't field and came out of ST completely unprepared to play with a stunningly obtuse plan for the rotation that will have blown up in their faces unless and only unless they can get to the ALCS. That is the only way this grand Cora strategy works out.

[moonslav59]

jung:

 

I, respectfully, disagree.I actually think the Sox bent over backwards to give Swihart every and any chance he could possibly have to stick in the majors and he never proved he belonged.

 

[harmony]

jung:

 

I, respectfully, disagree.I actually think the Sox bent over backwards to give Swihart every and any chance he could possibly have to stick in the majors and he never proved he belonged.

 

I wish Blake Swihart the best but I'm with moonslav59 on this assessment.

[dgalehouse]

Let's face it . When the Sox feel the need to turn to a career ham and egger like Sandy Leon as the answer to their problems , it reeks of desperation . The catching situation should have been addressed during the off season .

[jung]

jung:

 

I, respectfully, disagree.I actually think the Sox bent over backwards to give Swihart every and any chance he could possibly have to stick in the majors and he never proved he belonged.

 

 

 

Did you not read this quote from my post?

"I do think Swi's hitting is overrated and his potential as a catcher is also overrated."

 

They decided to make a conversion at Catcher their 1st round draft pick. What the f*** was that about?

 

I am saying that whatever Swi had, they simply did not care to try to exploit. That said, how does that excuse what they actually did to him over the course of the time he was here and the way they have exited him. Sorry...does not wash...not with me regardless of the fact that I have probably been the most vocal critic of Swi in this forum!

 

Probably should:

-never have brought him here

- hever have kept him here as long as the did

- never have used him like they did including that LF experiment that ended predictably

- should not have scapegoated the kid and dumped him on his rear end as a means to cover for their new Golden Boy at Manager, Alex Cora

Edited April 17, 2019 by jung

[notin]

Did you not read this quote from my post?

"I do think Swi's hitting is overrated and his potential as a catcher is also overrated."

 

They decided to make a conversion at Catcher their 1st round draft pick. What the f*** was that about?

 

 

That happens all the time. Players switch to new positions either in the minors or after being drafted. I heard an interview with Brandon Inge once where he talked about being drafted. Inge was a shortstop at VCU and an expected high pick. When he got the call that he was a second round selection of the Tigers, he was relieved. That lasted for a minute or two when the Tiger scout called back and told him “By the way, you’re going to be a catcher...”

[harmony]

Did you not read this quote from my post?

"I do think Swi's hitting is overrated and his potential as a catcher is also overrated."

 

They decided to make a conversion at Catcher their 1st round draft pick. What the f*** was that about?

 

In June 2011 the Red Sox drafted Blake Swihart as a catcher:

 

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/events/draft/y2011/drafttracker.jsp

 

... after Swihart started catching during his junior year in high school:

 

http://www.espn.com/blog/boston/red-sox/post/_/id/34578/prospect-swihart-catching-on-quickly

 

Don't blame Swihart for being overhyped.

Edited April 17, 2019 by harmony

[Bellhorn04]

Let's face it . When the Sox feel the need to turn to a career ham and egger like Sandy Leon as the answer to their problems , it reeks of desperation . The catching situation should have been addressed during the off season .

 

When you win 3 straight division titles and a World Series with Vazquez and Leon doing most of the catching, it doesn't really seem to be such a bad 'situation' as far as I can see!

[jung]

In June 2011 the Red Sox drafted Blake Swihart as a catcher:

 

https://www.baseball-reference.com/draft/?year_ID=2011&draft_round=1&draft_type=junreg&query_type=year_round

 

... after Swihart started catching during his junior year in high school:

 

http://www.espn.com/blog/boston/red-sox/post/_/id/34578/prospect-swihart-catching-on-quickly

 

Don't blame Swihart for being overhyped.

 

How did you pull "don't blame Swi for being overhyped out of my posts? How does that make any sense. Its the organization's job to know what they are doing and why they are doing it.

 

Frankly, by the way, very few catchers are made out of whole cloth during their baseball careers and if they are, you better devote them to full time catching from the moment you make that decision. You want your kid to be a catcher, stick a mask on his head and a catcher's mitt on his hand about when he pops out of the womb.

 

Don't forget as well, the little experiment in LF completely stilted for over a year Swi's development as a potential professional catcher and completely stilted his development as a professional hitter. They either wanted a catcher, converted or not or they did not. They were IMO yanking meat the entire time. I would bet real money that Swi was handled this way throughout his amateur career as well..."athletic, can play multiple positions, good bat"...frankly those guys end up playing all over the diamond in amateur ball. Once they get to pro ball, if you really are trying to convert him to a pro ball Catcher you LET HIM CATCH.....PERIOD! None of this LF nonsense in the most physically dangerous OF (Fenway) in all baseball across all three positions.

[moonslav59]

Did you not read this quote from my post?

"I do think Swi's hitting is overrated and his potential as a catcher is also overrated."

 

They decided to make a conversion at Catcher their 1st round draft pick. What the f*** was that about?

 

I am saying that whatever Swi had, they simply did not care to try to exploit. That said, how does that excuse what they actually did to him over the course of the time he was here and the way they have exited him. Sorry...does not wash...not with me regardless of the fact that I have probably been the most vocal critic of Swi in this forum!

 

Probably should:

-never have brought him here

- hever have kept him here as long as the did

- never have used him like they did including that LF experiment that ended predictably

- should not have scapegoated the kid and dumped him on his rear end as a means to cover for their new Golden Boy at Manager, Alex Cora

 

I think they bent over backwards to give him all the chances possible to make the bigs, including tries at other positions.

 

He failed and failed and then failed again.

 

Yes, he was "over-rated" in many ways, but the fact that he got so many chances shows me the organization "believed in him" too much--not like you claimed.

 

Swihart threw himself under a bus, or he just never had what it takes all along.

[moonslav59]

How did you pull "don't blame Swi for being overhyped out of my posts? How does that make any sense. Its the organization's job to know what they are doing and why they are doing it.

 

Frankly, by the way, very few catchers are made out of whole cloth during their baseball careers and if they are, you better devote them to full time catching from the moment you make that decision. You want your kid to be a catcher, stick a mask on his head and a catcher's mitt on his hand about when he pops out of the womb.

 

Don't forget as well, the little experiment in LF completely stilted for over a year Swi's development as a potential professional catcher and completely stilted his development as a professional hitter. They either wanted a catcher, converted or not or they did not. They were IMO yanking meat the entire time. I would bet real money that Swi was handled this way throughout his amateur career as well..."athletic, can play multiple positions, good bat"...frankly those guys end up playing all over the diamond in amateur ball. Once they get to pro ball, if you really are trying to convert him to a pro ball Catcher you LET HIM CATCH.....PERIOD! None of this LF nonsense in the most physically dangerous OF (Fenway) in all baseball across all three positions.

 

The chance they gave him in LF is evidence they were willing to give him an extra chance to prove himself.

 

He was never going to be our catcher in any meaningful way. The injury in LF sucked, but let's not kid ourselves. The guy could have started 800 games at catcher and never proved he belonged.

[moonslav59]

When you win 3 straight division titles and a World Series with Vazquez and Leon doing most of the catching, it doesn't really seem to be such a bad 'situation' as far as I can see!

 

..and I'll add, it wasn't like we won despite Vaz & Leon. They were net pluses.

[notin]

When you win 3 straight division titles and a World Series with Vazquez and Leon doing most of the catching, it doesn't really seem to be such a bad 'situation' as far as I can see!

 

But it also doesn’t mean there isn’t room for improvement...

[jung]

I think they bent over backwards to give him all the chances possible to make the bigs, including tries at other positions.

 

He failed and failed and then failed again.

 

Yes, he was "over-rated" in many ways, but the fact that he got so many chances shows me the organization "believed in him" too much--not like you claimed.

 

Swihart threw himself under a bus, or he just never had what it takes all along.

 

So you think they actually gave Swi an opportunity to develop as a Catcher, the position they drafted him to fill. Were those other positional opportunities really opportunities or were they acts of team necessity because they had allowed Ramirez to talk them into the idea that he would actually WORK to be a LFer? Which do you really think that was?

[harmony]

So you think they actually gave Swi an opportunity to develop as a Catcher, the position they drafted him to fill. Were those other positional opportunities really opportunities or were they acts of team necessity because they had allowed Ramirez to talk them into the idea that he would actually WORK to be a LFer? Which do you really think that was?

In the nearly eight years since he was drafted as a catcher, Blake Swihart has played 477 professional games, including 432 starts, at catcher.

 

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=swihar000bla

[Bellhorn04]

But it also doesn’t mean there isn’t room for improvement...

 

'Room for improvement' applies to just about everything...

[Kimmi]

If he would accept the pitching coach job, I'd be all in!

 

Yes, I really liked Farrell as a pitching coach.

[Kimmi]

I think they bent over backwards to give him all the chances possible to make the bigs, including tries at other positions.

 

He failed and failed and then failed again.

 

Yes, he was "over-rated" in many ways, but the fact that he got so many chances shows me the organization "believed in him" too much--not like you claimed.

 

Swihart threw himself under a bus, or he just never had what it takes all along.

 

I have to disagree with this.

 

Swihart was jerked around for most of his career here with Boston. Twice, he was pulled from his catching role after a very short sample. One day, they say they are committed to keeping him at catcher, the next day they have him playing LF or 1B.

 

The Sox never really gave him a fair chance to succeed.

[Kimmi]

But it also doesn’t mean there isn’t room for improvement...

 

But it wouldn't have necessarily been an improvement.

[notin]

'Room for improvement' applies to just about everything...

 

 

If you had to pick one position from the 2018 lineup to improve upon, which one would you have picked?

[Kimmi]

In the nearly eight years since he was drafted as a catcher, Blake Swihart has played 477 professional games, including 432 starts, at catcher.

 

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=swihar000bla

 

That amounts to about 60 games a season, spread out over 8 years, back and forth between Boston and Pawtucket, and back and forth between positions. That's not the consistent playing time that a developing player needs.