The Alex Cora Managerial Decision Thread

[devildavid]

Two losses in a row. Did the players stop having fun already?

 

I like how Cora is utilizing his bench and resting guys.

 

Oakland is always tough on the Sox on these west coast trips.

 

Best start in franchise history. Better fire Cora before it gets any better. Buck Showalter should be available soon.

[Dalas21000]

When you start insisting the team bunt and steal home more, you're calling for overmanaging. The Sox do Need to execute properly and the fans need to accept the reality that the Sox are going to lose two games in a row once in a while. ...

 

I'm sry to say but Its all part of the game....I'm ok with Cora resting players if he wants but down 4-1 in the 9th with a guy on 2 outs in the 9th, Betts on deck and a pitcher that just showed he can't move well ...I'm bunting down 1st base line making him make a play....if he gets on you have Betts next

[cp176]

Agree. This was another rookie manager mistake. Trying to get the veteran pitcher through the inning in hopes to get him a W. He should have been pulled once 2 reached....

 

Boy do I agree with you here. The only reason I could even think of for Price staying in once runners got to both first and second was to get him the win. He should have made the move - no question. Rookie manager and a veteran pitcher who really had pitched an excellent game - maybe a tough one for him to make but Price's win loss record is secondary to the team's win loss record.

[cp176]

Being truthful here, with an off day tomorrow, I didn’t see any real need whatsoever to rest that many starters when still winning the series after being no-hit was a definitel possibility. I’m starting to think Cora was the one who needed a day off, not Betts, Hanram and Nunez.

 

I felt like I was watching the jv team for the most part.

[Bellhorn04]

Agree. This was another rookie manager mistake. Trying to get the veteran pitcher through the inning in hopes to get him a W. He should have been pulled once 2 reached....

 

I'm pretty sure it wasn't about trying to get Price a W when it's a 1-1 game and the team's bats have gone cold. You could just as easily say he was increasing the chances of Price getting an L.

[Bellhorn04]

Statistically??? Where are your stats?

 

LOL the post you replied to over and over was a sarcastic one and part of a running argument.

 

You can't just drop in here once in a while and start going off on other posters when you don't even know what they're saying.

[Emp9]

All these days off should pay dividends later in the year and into the playoffs.

 

I've scrathed my head a few times, but I'm loving Cora, so far.

 

They’re playing extremely well for him and I guess that’s all that really matters. I’d personally rather a bird in the hand than two in the bush. But maybe giving most of our bench a full game and getting them involved more will pay dividends too in the long run? Who knows? It’s only one game and we’ve built a serious lead in the standings to do this type of ... experimenting.

[Bellhorn04]

They’re playing extremely well for him and I guess that’s all that really matters. I’d personally rather a bird in the hand than two in the bush. But maybe giving most of our bench a full game and getting them involved more will pay dividends too in the long run? Who knows? It’s only one game and we’ve built a serious lead in the standings to do this type of ... experimenting.

 

Cora's basically following the template Houston used last year.

 

Peter Abraham's story on yesterday's game is a good one. He makes it pretty clear that like many fans he's going WTF about Betts, Hanley & Nunez remaining on the bench the whole game, but then he explains what Cora's trying to do.

[Emp9]

I might be the only one who has noticed this judging by the bulk of the comments, but Cora's MO looks like he intentionally gives players the day off before an off day, probably too double the rest.

 

I also wonder if the unreasonable cold most of the country had been experiencing was a factor.

 

I do question leaving Price in for so long today, but those games happen. ...

 

If we won the first two I doubt I’d even care at all, but I like winning as many series as we can. They’ve played so well for Cora, I expect this to be a minor blip and back on track tuesday.

[Emp9]

Cora's basically following the template Houston used last year.

 

Peter Abraham's story on yesterday's game is a good one. He makes it pretty clear that like many fans he's going WTF about Betts, Hanley & Nunez remaining on the bench the whole game, but then he explains what Cora's trying to do.

 

An ice pack for my PH-ing blue balls you say? Thanks I’ll read it.

[cp176]

I'm pretty sure it wasn't about trying to get Price a W when it's a 1-1 game and the team's bats have gone cold. You could just as easily say he was increasing the chances of Price getting an L.

 

Not that it really matters because we still look pretty good record wise but you were ok with him leaving Price in the ball game at that point? I don't think that any of us know what he was thinking. One guess I think is just as good as another. I'm still thinking that pulling Price at that point would have been a tough but good move by him.

[moonslav59]

They’re playing extremely well for him and I guess that’s all that really matters. I’d personally rather a bird in the hand than two in the bush. But maybe giving most of our bench a full game and getting them involved more will pay dividends too in the long run? Who knows? It’s only one game and we’ve built a serious lead in the standings to do this type of ... experimenting.

 

Yes, that's the other part of the equation. If we ever need to go to the benchfor a long term use, we'll have players that we have a better sense about what they can do, and they should be more ready to step right in without missing a beat.

 

It's not my choice of how to rest players, but I know Cora knows more than I do.

[cp176]

It looked like Smith was ready and I did expect him to come in when runners got to second but I'm trying to figure out the rationale behind not using Kimbrel at that point in the game. Cora's comments indicated that he was not an option with the score tied in the 9th during a road game. I'm not questioning the move to not use him, just need someone to tell me why you wouldn't use him at that point.

[moonslav59]

It looked like Smith was ready and I did expect him to come in when runners got to second but I'm trying to figure out the rationale behind not using Kimbrel at that point in the game. Cora's comments indicated that he was not an option with the score tied in the 9th during a road game. I'm not questioning the move to not use him, just need someone to tell me why you wouldn't use him at that point.

 

I felt the same way, but I try to avoid criticizing managers over pen moves. There's just so much going on and so many factors to consider, including the fact that K Davis was just 2 for 8 career against Price before that HR.

 

What do I know? I still have no issue with Grady Little keeping Pedro in that game.

[cp176]

I felt the same way, but I try to avoid criticizing managers over pen moves. There's just so much going on and so many factors to consider, including the fact that K Davis was just 2 for 8 career against Price before that HR.

 

What do I know? I still have no issue with Grady Little keeping Pedro in that game.

 

With respect to Pedro, so was I. I'm not going to ever criticize a guy like Cora but I think that it is ok to question moves or lack of moves - I hope it is anyway. I like doing it because it keeps me involved mentally. These types of things interest me - they are real baseball moves. Hey, I still haven't gotten over Austin's slide yet. Since that play, I have focused in on every side made in a Red Sox game and got to say I haven't seen one that even comes close to his. Real baseball stuff for me!

[Natick to NC]

This rest thing is with good intention but with terrible planning and consequence.Mookie ,JBJ ,JD ,Benny ,Hanley have no reason to take another rest day for the next couple weeks .

[Natick to NC]

When's Pedey back ? The team has done a fantastic job for the most part but the Defense will be much better when Pedey and X are out there obviously .I Look for Pedey to explode offensively after watching successful and unsuccessful approached at bats .The team chose to stay disciplined up until the As series and then went to chasing way to many balls that where way out of the strike zone ...it's a blip I'm sure but they showed just how terrible they look as a group when they take last years approach . Edited April 23, 2018 by Natick to NC

[Maxbialystock]

Agree. This was another rookie manager mistake. Trying to get the veteran pitcher through the inning in hopes to get him a W. He should have been pulled once 2 reached....

 

Meh. I think he was just trying to get out of the 8th without using the bullpen because he was expecting extra innings. Plus Price had gone 7.2 innings while holding the A's to 1 run and needing less than 100 pitches. After "once 2 reached," the next batter was Lowrie, who had been killing us. Price struck him out. Why are you so sure Carson Smith, the guy in the bullpen, would have done as well? My guess is, had Lowrie hit a double and drive in just one run against Carson Smith, the chorus would now be, "why did Cora take Price out when he had pitched so well for 7.1 innings and brought in Carson Smith of all people?"

[Maxbialystock]

It looked like Smith was ready and I did expect him to come in when runners got to second but I'm trying to figure out the rationale behind not using Kimbrel at that point in the game. Cora's comments indicated that he was not an option with the score tied in the 9th during a road game. I'm not questioning the move to not use him, just need someone to tell me why you wouldn't use him at that point.

 

Kimbrel? Kimbrel? In a 1-1 game on the road and in the 8th innings with runners on 1st and 2d? That's exactly the situation in which Kimbrel has struggled in the past.

[Maxbialystock]

With respect to Pedro, so was I. I'm not going to ever criticize a guy like Cora but I think that it is ok to question moves or lack of moves - I hope it is anyway. I like doing it because it keeps me involved mentally. These types of things interest me - they are real baseball moves. Hey, I still haven't gotten over Austin's slide yet. Since that play, I have focused in on every side made in a Red Sox game and got to say I haven't seen one that even comes close to his. Real baseball stuff for me!

 

OK. That's good. Question away in that context. In this particular case, I would have left Price in because he struck out Lowrie swinging for the 2d out and Carson Smith has not exactly been Mr. Reliable with men on 1st and 2d in the 8th inning.

[cp176]

Kimbrel? Kimbrel? In a 1-1 game on the road and in the 8th innings with runners on 1st and 2d? That's exactly the situation in which Kimbrel has struggled in the past.

 

I'm not criticizing the guy here Max. Don't fall into the trap that leads to the sarcastic nastiness that we see here from time to time. If I can't question these moves or lack thereof, then what is a forum board for? yup - I am still puzzled by the explanation to not use Kimbrel but not as much as the one to not bring in Carson Smith.

[cp176]

Kimbrel? Kimbrel? In a 1-1 game on the road and in the 8th innings with runners on 1st and 2d? That's exactly the situation in which Kimbrel has struggled in the past.

 

Also Max, when is the last time you can remember Kimbrel struggling in any situation? lol Smith was ready and could have been used.

[Slasher9]

I'm pretty sure it wasn't about trying to get Price a W when it's a 1-1 game and the team's bats have gone cold. You could just as easily say he was increasing the chances of Price getting an L.

 

your opinion is noted. mine is stated. rookie manager mistake.

[Slasher9]

Meh. I think he was just trying to get out of the 8th without using the bullpen because he was expecting extra innings. Plus Price had gone 7.2 innings while holding the A's to 1 run and needing less than 100 pitches. After "once 2 reached," the next batter was Lowrie, who had been killing us. Price struck him out. Why are you so sure Carson Smith, the guy in the bullpen, would have done as well? My guess is, had Lowrie hit a double and drive in just one run against Carson Smith, the chorus would now be, "why did Cora take Price out when he had pitched so well for 7.1 innings and brought in Carson Smith of all people?"

 

what you think i would post on something that didnt happen is invalid. i posted what i posted based on what happened and my opinion of it and my opinion of why he did it.

btw - the "100 pitches" thing is meaningless to me. it was the 8th inning. and he was gassed. we had plenty of strong/fresh arms in the pen. Cora made an error in his decision making. that is my opinion. and that is why i posted it in this thread. i have posted of 2 instances so far in 21 games. both of which i deemed as "rookie mistakes". he will clean those up as he gets more comfortable and confident in his role as manager. 2 instances in 21 games is pretty good. the rookie manager for philadelphia had 2 in the first game......

[Bellhorn04]

OK. That's good. Question away in that context. In this particular case, I would have left Price in because he struck out Lowrie swinging for the 2d out and Carson Smith has not exactly been Mr. Reliable with men on 1st and 2d in the 8th inning.

 

Correct. This is what Cora said too - the fact that he looked good striking out Lowrie is what persuaded him to let Price face Davis.

[Maxbialystock]

Also Max, when is the last time you can remember Kimbrel struggling in any situation? lol Smith was ready and could have been used.

 

Last year in almost any game into which he was inserted with men on in the 8th inning. This year he has been pretty good (but twice had 2 men on before he got the third out) precisely because every appearance has been in the 9th inning or later. He is not as good in the 8th as he is in the 9th and he prefers to work a "clean" inning.

[mvp 78]

Correct. This is what Cora said too - the fact that he looked good striking out Lowrie is what persuaded him to let Price face Davis.

 

And at some point, you have to give Price the opportunity to get through a tough situation. Maybe next time Cora will go for the hook? Until we see a pattern of mismanagement, it's hard to get on Cora too much.

[Maxbialystock]

what you think i would post on something that didnt happen is invalid. i posted what i posted based on what happened and my opinion of it and my opinion of why he did it.

btw - the "100 pitches" thing is meaningless to me. it was the 8th inning. and he was gassed. we had plenty of strong/fresh arms in the pen. Cora made an error in his decision making. that is my opinion. and that is why i posted it in this thread. i have posted of 2 instances so far in 21 games. both of which i deemed as "rookie mistakes". he will clean those up as he gets more comfortable and confident in his role as manager. 2 instances in 21 games is pretty good. the rookie manager for philadelphia had 2 in the first game......

 

If Price was "gassed," how do you explain that he had struck out Lowrie, who had been killing us, right before giving up the dinger? You are absolutely, positively entitled to your opinion, but you haven't convinced me you're right, especially when I believe we have already seen several examples of Cora masterfully managing his bullpen. I cite especially Pomeranz's first start when he gave up 2 in the 1st, was in trouble in the 2d, causing Cora himself to go out to the mound, before he got the 3d out with 0 runs scored, was terrific in the 3d, and was pulled in the 4th when he got into trouble again. In came Velazquez, he went 3 (0 runs and the W), then Johnson, then Barnes, and finally Kelly. Plus Pom threw 87 pitches (and gave up 3 runs) in a game the Sox won.

 

I assume the other instance was game 1 when Kelly and Smith both failed in the 8th. I was mad at Cora during the game, but afterward, thought the real fault lay with those two. Plus I did not think it made sense to bring in Kimbrel in the 8th in the first game of the year.

[Station 13]

I didn't fumed over letting Price pitch the inning. But letting Vazquez hit with the go-ahead run did. His late game management warrant future scrutiny.

[jacksonianmarch]

It did not make sense to let a gassed Price face the A’s 2 best RH hitters with the go ahead runs on base. It was a mistake